ATTN: Putting my money where my mouth is

[Metaltastic]

Well dudes, it's about time I step up and show you what I can do as an engineer. Granted, I know I still have a ton to learn, but I've been lurking here for awhile now, and this is the first material I've posted, so you all can be the judge of how well my knowledge that I've been gleaning from books and this forum has served me thus far!

This is my final project for my Audio Arts Prod. class. The drums are all natural (except for the kick, which is a sample we made during the drum tracking session, just applied to every hit), there's two tracks of guitars (5150 left, JSX right, both through my Bogner 2x12 w/ V30's with a single 57 off axis), bass is some "eh" Fender 15" combo with a D112 at the cone, and vocals are an SM7. It's was all recorded into my school's PTHD rig, with the 192 i/o interface, and everything with the exception of toms went through a Millennia HV-3D pre-amp (it was either that or the Control 24 pres, which we used on toms simply because the Millennia only has 4 in's).

I guess the only things I'm not sure about are whether the vocals are too soft, the bass drum/toms too boomy, and the limiter on the master bus too heavy. But any other comments are welcome! (I've already handed it in, but I still have the session file to tweak with my MBOX 2).

Oh yeah, me and my fellow guitarist wrote and performed the song, and the solos are me in the middle of the song and the first-half of the end, and him in the second-half. Enjoy!

www.soundclick.com/marcusmusic

EDIT: Revised mix up, see reply #12

 

[Manicompression]

sounds cool dude, sounds like "Parade of Chaos" era Zao but with awesome guitar solos, the only thing I noticed that wasnt so great was the drummers timing sounded uneasy on a couple of minor instances, real cool man, rock it

 

[lilhermiejobo]

I can't really say anything about the mix cause I'm listening on tiny crap speakers but the kick seems to get lost through the song a bit

AWESOME WRITING!!! Great Job on this man!!! This is very impressive for a first post especially without all the usual ANDY SNEAP SAMPLES®

 

[Wolfeman]

Pretty good man..... Guitar tone reminds me of a lot of post-hardcore/pre-metalcore stuff.

 

[Djabthrash]

the only thing I noticed that wasnt so great was the drummers timing sounded uneasy on a couple of minor instances, real cool man, rock it

+1

there are some good riffs in the song. Solo-ing is great also.

Drums sound fits well with the genre.

The overall sound is good.

I don't like the guitar sound so much(sounds a bit sterile to me). Matter of personal taste (it reminds me of the guitar tone on some recent Sneap records that i don't like, new Exodus for example).

 

[Jarkko Mattheiszen]

I guess you're more interested in constructive criticism than praise (the song is really good and you probably now it already ), so I'll give you some off the top of my head. The kick sounds a bit too round and dull to my liking, it gets buried in the mix at least on my bass-lacking monitors. Some more click would probably do wonders. Also, the vocals could use a little more presence and punch - as you said, they sound a bit too soft. Other than that, very good job. I'm not a big fan of the sterile and a bit dry guitar tone, but that's just a matter of taste, not something I think needs 'fixing'

 

[Metaltastic]

Holy crap, thanks a ton dudes! I really appreciate all the support, though naturally constructive criticism is indeed appreciated as well!

Manic, funny you mention Zao, because although I've never listened to 'em (though I find it hard to believe they'd have a 7/4 break! ), our singer is a big fan, and cites them as one of his biggest influences on his vocals. Also, believe me, I'm WELL WELL aware of the drummer's inconsistencies; you think it's bad now, you should've heard it before I went nuts with realigning his kick hits; it honestly sounded like a popcorn popper. He's a great guy, but man...oh well, at least he's graduating after this semester, so problem solved!

Hermie, thanks a lot man! Yeah, because it was for a class, I wanted to keep everything as natural as possible.

Wolfe, Djab, and Jhawke, to be honest, I agree with you about the sterility of the guitar sound, it's not my favorite either. Any tips on how to improve it? Cuz some of my favorite tones are really organic, such as Opeth's "Ghost Reveries." And please don't say quad-tracking (too much effort ). Jhawke, I'll try giving the kick a bit more click (I've already got a boost there in the eq, so I'll just up the gain!), and drop down on the super low stuff a bit, thanks!

So keep 'em coming, and to reiterate, do you guys think the mix is hitting the master bus limiter too hard?

 

[JoshDRAH]

Sounds badass man, the only thing I would change would be the kick, it does seem to get kind of lost in the mix...Maybe something with a little more click to it?

What school are you doing to?

 

[Metaltastic]

Thanks dude - I go to SUNY Oneonta in NY, though almost all of what I've learned about recording and mixing came from books (Modern Recording Techniques and the Mixing Engineer's Handbook, mainly) and this forum. I'm in Audio Arts Production III right now, which might as well be a Comp Sci course cuz it's ALL about Pro Tools (we get 110 certified at the end, but big fucking deal, I'd much rather learn about parallel compression then spend a whole class learning about the goddamn workspace browser), and while Audio Arts I was useful, I suppose, cuz it taught me the basics of audio (in terms of the basics of digital audio, with the nyquist theorem, properties of sound, etc.), Audio Arts II was all about electronic music (lame) and AAP III as I mentioned is just Pro Tools, so hopefully IV will get into actually making stuff sound good!

 

[Wolfeman]

Wolfe, Djab, and Jhawke, to be honest, I agree with you about the sterility of the guitar sound, it's not my favorite either. Any tips on how to improve it? Cuz some of my favorite tones are really organic, such as Opeth's "Ghost Reveries." And please don't say quad-tracking (too much effort ).

I was going to say quad track

Mess with the EQ a bit, that might do the trick...

 

[Loren Littlejohn]

The guitars have a bit o fizz in them and I noticed the timing thing as well, other than that though kickass job!

I say roll of at 9K like Ozz did in his 5150 tone in the clayman thread.

 

[Metaltastic]

Ok, I replaced the file on the above soundclick link with a revised one; raised the vox, backed off a bit on the L2 (nobody mentioned it, but it was bothering me on the tom hits), gave the kick a bit more click, and LP'd the guitars at around 9k. To be honest, though, I wonder if a big reason they sound as sterile as they do is the preamp; that Millennia is reputed to be one of the cleanest freakin' preamps around, so maybe that's why - I had the gain low on the amps (around 12 o'clock), the mids decently high, and the 57 was like halfway between the dustcap and edge. That, and we used my ESP EC-400 with an 81 in the bridge, but I've heard plenty o' killer recordings with that pup, so I know what it's capable of. Oh well, I'm still happy with it, and thanks again guys!

 

[Djabthrash]

To be honest, though, I wonder if a big reason they sound as sterile as they do is the preamp; that Millennia is reputed to be one of the cleanest freakin' preamps around, so maybe that's why - I had the gain low on the amps (around 12 o'clock), the mids decently high, and the 57 was like halfway between the dustcap and edge. That, and we used my ESP EC-400 with an 81 in the bridge, but I've heard plenty o' killer recordings with that pup, so I know what it's capable of.

Weird... Many people on this forum use the same kind of combination EMG 81 guitar>5150/XXX w. low gain, a good amount of mids> V30 cab > SM57 "halfway between the dustcap and edge" spot and i remember some of those did not sound so dry/sterile (it reminds me of some "preamp out" takes (without any cab sim/impulses after) i've done/heard).

I'd suggest a bit less presence maybe but that won't fix it i guess. And then maybe try something different in your DAW's EQ for the guitars.

Very weird... Some tips from the XXX/5150 owners ? (Can't help i have an ENGL SE myself, not any XXX/5150)

This guitar sound thing is just a minor issue anyway. The overall thing is good. If you like it don't change anything.

 

[Metaltastic]

Thanks again dudes!

 

[Wolfeman]

I never have good results halfway between the dust cap and edge..... I seem to stick around where the dust cap meets the cone, and blend in a little bit of a second mic at that halfway position....