Creasionism museum opens in US

[Lord SteveO]

I'm sure this has been argued over before in other threads, or at least the whole idea has been mentioned before. But this was the final straw for me.

Creationists in the US have just opened up a Creation Museum, a place where people are shown that creasionist ideas are the truth, that dinosaurs existed with humans, that the earth is in fact only 6000yrs old.
I just want to know what people make of this. Is this acceptable? Or is it taking the idea too far? We already have some US schools actually teaching creationism alongside evolution as an actual proven scientific fact.

I'm in the firm belief that this is too far. I accept it is up to people to believe or not, and to go see the place as well. But this trend towards allowing religious belief to be shown as scietific fact is getting a bit much now. Once you start trying to show children that these beliefs are facts you are going down a dangerous path in my opinion.
I don't mind faith, religion too is fine if not used to control people. But this is now getting too much. I think religion is given too much of a say in things which will have a huge efect on the world. And trying to swing children towards believing in faith over facts and logic are a pretty risky thing to do i think.

http://www.answersingenesis.org/museum/

 

[cr0wbar]

Well as much as I disagree with the museum I am sure it is within their rights to have one. As long as they are not calling it a museum of science I guess they are not doing anything wrong. I hate that children are being taught that the bible is the only fact and that science is wrong. I used to live in Kansas and I was fortunate to not be in school when they started teaching this crap. I am worried if I have kids that my wife's parents will try to teach them that the bible is the truth and everything else is wrong. They get upset when there is anything on TV that goes against what is said in the bible. It drives me insane.

 

[AsModEe]

they shouldn't be allowed to open their museum... this is giving strenght to ignorance

 

[derek]

^ I agree. Creationism has an agenda, and thus fails to be science. It's pathetic and irritating. But they are more than welcome to have such a museum if they wish.

see my sig...that kinda sums up my opinion (in a childish way )

 

[AsModEe]

family guy rocks

 

[derek]

Yeah...it's pretty amazing television. I'm so glad they brought it back.

 

[sonofhendrix13]

I'm for free speech no matter what the case. This is just an example of people exercising that right. We can't stop people from preaching any belief they want no matter how ridiculous it is. I don't think any grown person with any discretion should be threatened by this. If you don't want to believe this, you don't have to. Its not like their shoving their ideas down anyones' throats. This is a museum, you have to pay to get in, nobody that doesn't want to believe in creationism is going to go and suddenly be forced into believing these ideas.

 

[Lord Foul]

We can't stop people from preaching any belief they want no matter how ridiculous it is.

We (America) can and do stop people from preaching some beliefs. There are laws restricting "Hate" speech, and certainly if you preach that America is evil and attempt to incite people to carry out terrorism against this country then you'll be picked up and hauled away. The difference is, we are soft on allowing people to preach beliefs that are demonstratably ignorant or outright lies. I say either make speech completely free or restrict everyone equally based on rational criteria. Halfway measures achieve nothing.

 

[derek]

^I think the general reaction is not to the museum itself, but the idea. The campaign for it to be taught in schools just like evolution, seems to me to be a dangerous prospect, and the idea in general is an insult to science.

 

[veil the sky]

on what basis does everyone refer to modern science as 'fact' and religious teaching as 'indoctrination'

haven't we all been 'indoctrinated' into just a modern day scientific paradigm? why is that so different from a religious perspective?

when we describe something as 'scientific fact' all it really means is that it is a principle or proposition which is useful or predictively successful in that scientific paradigm. when we describe or teach something as 'religious fact' it only means that it is a useful or consistent maxim within a framework of that religious belief.

to argue otherwise will result in intellectual fascism.

 

[Korona]

The desire for truth in religion will make creationism die a death. I say we allow it it's death cries as those people with sense finally root out the enclaves of stupidity. They are only argueing about this because some people don't like the fact that science doesn't need to posit God to explain anything any more, and this is a way to avoid the wider issue.

 

[derek]

...Creationism is different in the sense that is a religious fact predicated by belief in a creator God. In that sense it is not like conventionl science where what generally holds to be "True" is based on no such predicate rooted in belief. That was all i was pointing out. I find that to be problematic.

Please don't always assume we have a lesser understanding of concepts, before at least engaging in conversation.

 

[Cythraul]

on what basis does everyone refer to modern science as 'fact' and religious teaching as 'indoctrination'

haven't we all been 'indoctrinated' into just a modern day scientific paradigm? why is that so different from a religious perspective?

when we describe something as 'scientific fact' all it really means is that it is a principle or proposition which is useful or predictively successful in that scientific paradigm. when we describe or teach something as 'religious fact' it only means that it is a useful or consistent maxim within a framework of that religious belief.

to argue otherwise will result in intellectual fascism.

You forgot to include explanatory power and falsifiability ( although the latter doesn't necessarily pertain to the notion of scientific fact, but more to testability).

edit: hold on! Are you one of those goddamn Kuhnians?

 

[Lord SteveO]

My point was really the whole idea of teaching religious beliefs as hard facts, like teaching creationism in a science class.
It just shouldn't be allowed.
No matter how you argue about what is a fact and what is true, you can't deny that mixing science and religion is a bit of a dangerous route to take.
In science we say something is a fact, if we can use experiments to prove this to be the case, or at least prove it to a reasonable degree.
Religious beliefs rely on nothing but blindy following "the word of god", there is no way such things can be called a fact. As such i don't think they should be taught as facts, and most definately not in a science class.

 

[Korona]

Well a religeous "truth" substituted in place of science will be ill fitting. The instability it generates leads most people to reject it, it's just too incompatible with the prevailing scientific tradition that western worldviews are based on.
Creationism is dying, it will be gone in a few generations. The last remaining enclaives just happen to be very vocal...

 

[derek]

Predictions of the future are impossible. Marx was wrong, hitler was wrong and toffler was wrong. Durkheim said religion would be dead by now, but to me it still seems to be going very strong.

 

[sonofhendrix13]

Science is only one way of interpreting our environment. That of course doesn't make it the wrong way, but it doesn't make it fact either.

 

[Jaen]

"The Creation Museum is an outreach of Answers in Genesis, a non-profit ministry located near the Cincinnati International Airport, in northern Kentucky, USA. This 50,000 square foot facility will proclaim to the world that the Bible is the supreme authority in all matters of faith and practice and in every area it touches on. Scheduled to open in 2007, this “walk through history” museum will be a wonderful alternative to the evolutionary natural history museums that are turning countless minds against the gospel of Christ and the authority of the Scripture."

that not only is bullshit, its arrogant bullshit.

 

[Lord SteveO]

Proves my point really.

Talk like that makes me look at this place as no different or better than those religious schools in Pakistan where (suposedly) suicide bombers and islamic extremists are brainwashed.

It's the typical "our religion is best so anyone who doesn't believe it should be converted" type of talk.

 

[derek]

If your God won't do, their God will stop you.