There is nothing wrong with the production on any of the recent Porcupine Tree albums imo.
I could not disagree more regarding Steven Wilson. Have you heard Insurgentes? Listening to the 5.1 mix in a dark room with my eyes closed was one of the coolest listening experiences ever. I definitely wouldn't complain if PT went into Avatar again to record an album but everything after In Absentia has sounded just fine to me. Maybe I am blinded by the fact that I am a fanboy :zombie:
Yeah to be honest I think it's the fanboi thing. Compare the PT stuff to the best stuff from the top guys like Randy Staub, Andy Wallace etc and the PT stuff is not even remotely close.
Steven Wilson is a great musician, but sadly not a great mix engineer.
As for Insurgentes, I listened to it twice and deleted it off my computer.
Don't remember much about the production, but musically it did nothing for me.
As for recording cheap but good: I'm 100% sure that I could make a world class sounding recording for way less than 10k with hiring people from this very forum to do various stages of the process. I mean I can go to a studio record the drums. Only takes a few days if the drummer really got his shit down. Not too expensive. Send them off to be edited. DI guitars and bass. Off they go to be edited and reamped. Back to the studio for a couple of days of vocals. Off to Mix/Master.
I have really given this a lot of thought over the last couple of months and it's certainly not a lack of affordable ressources to get a good sound that concerns me. But: I think you need to be in a room with a producer with a lot of experience in order to make an outstanding record. I never notice how many songs consist of four chords only until I try to play them myself. Haven't been able to "hide" things like that myself yet.
Harry: I didn't necessarily mean that the band needs to be the best at their instruments. But they have to be tight as a rats ass, know their shit very well, have a front(wo)man that knows how to work a crowd etc. These are the kinds of things that make a good band and that's what I meant.
Also, as I said, a lot (most?) bands fail at "meaning it". Sure, they wanna play Wembley Stadium but do they know that to maybe get there they have to buy on larger tours and book their own shitty youth center tours with no shower or laundry for two weeks (if they are lucky), be on the road for at least six months a year, life with their mum because they won't be able to afford a place of their own etc.? Probably not because they have never really talked to someone in a professional touring band or worked at a show to experience it first hand.
This may all sound very negative but that's just what it is. Mathew posted a good quote on his Facebook Wall the other day: "If you want to end up with a million dollars in the music business make sure to start out with three." That pretty much sums it up imo. You're either filthy rich from the start and do this because that's what you want to do or you better be serious about it and prepare to be poor for at least a few years, maybe even for your whole career.
Yep, definitely some guys around here that can absolutely destroy guys like Bulb and Wilson for making great sounding records.
Indeed, musicians should be tight and I agree ultra high technical skill is not a requirement.
I listen to a lot of post metal, post rock, some stoner metal, and listen to stuff like Deftones and Katatonia a lot, so I know you don't need to be able to play like Joe Satriani or have a 5 octave vocal range to be considered a great musician.
What I meant is that you get complete garbage like this :
That's what I meant when I said "Time and time again history has proved you don't actually have to make particularly meaningful music nor have to be anywhere near a remotely good musician to "make it"
And now to compare, from our very own Ola Englund (Goddamn Guitar)
I think it's quite obvious which one of these musicians is just a mediocre singer who relies heavily on her sex appeal to shift records (the other part being the inane music), while the other has fans based entirely on his musical merits and is just an extremely talented musician.
I mean honestly, surely the "I wanna see your pea-cock cock cock" thing (and damn Katy Perry, you're as subtle as a grenade exploding right in front of you with those lyrics
) makes you just want to bash your head against the wall? That kinda music just makes me agitated, seriously.
Feared are a FUCKING GREAT band. These are the types of bands that should be selling millions of records.
Pink Floyd was probably the last truly great and creative artist that was able to shift a truly mammoth amount of records.
Unfortunately, truly great music will just never sell as well as truly great music in this day and age, because most people are shallow and as such, just want shallow and meaningless background music.
Once you're in a good band, a lot of it after seems to come down to pure luck really, because great music alone just isn't enough anymore.
It's unfortunate a lot of people have to struggle through the tours with the horrible working conditions (lack of showers, shitty food, being fucked around by promoters/sound guys etc), but as you said, it's the harsh reality of things
As for Trent Reznor himself, whether one likes his music or not, it's hard to deny he's extremely creative, and for a guy who's really pushed the boundaries and went against the grain many times in his career, he's done incredibly well for himself.
