Piracy Dilemma - Kontakt 4

striked01

striked01

Member
Jul 11, 2010
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strikesound.com.au
lets get this straight, im not looking to pirate anything.

my question is...
Is it ok to download the demo version of a program (in this case, Kontakt 4) and use it in commercial mixes? Only using it within the bounds of the crippled demo.

I don't need to use the program for more than 15 minutes, I see no reason in buying the full version. But is it ok to include a demo version in the final mixdown?

Stupid question? haha
 
If all else fails, you could contact NI. Their customer service is pretty nice from my experience.

There's also a free Kontakt player, if I remember correctly.
 
Tbh this has never even crossed my mind, and I have released projects with demo plugins on them. Occasionally, I'll wait until I start mixing a certain band to install a plugin I think will work for them, so I can use it in the final mix. I can't imagine it would be illegal, but it'd be good to know either way.
 
I'm one of those assholes that reads terms and conditions thoroughly; more often than not, demo licenses are treated as "for you and you only". Rarely will there not be a section that forbids use of a demo license in a commercial project - that is, any project you create for financial gain - if you wanna use it, you gotta buy it. Generally speaking I think if you use a demo license in a mix, make some money off it and then go and buy the full license afterwards because of how chuffed you are with the results, there wouldn't be an issue.

All that said, I think it's totally fair. It'd be much the same as someone reading a a whole book in a bookstore without buying it.
 
Interesting question. I'm downloading the T-racks clipper demo tomorrow to use it on a mix. If I like it, I'll buy it. If I don't like it, it probably won't end up in the mix anyway, so I guess it won't really matter.

But do plugin companies ever try to pin down pirates based on the potential sound of one of their plugs in a commercial mix? Wouldn't that be ridiculously difficult to prove?
 
mva801 said:
Interesting question. I'm downloading the T-racks clipper demo tomorrow to use it on a mix. If I like it, I'll buy it. If I don't like it, it probably won't end up in the mix anyway, so I guess it won't really matter.

But do plugin companies ever try to pin down pirates based on the potential sound of one of their plugs in a commercial mix? Wouldn't that be ridiculously difficult to prove?
Click to expand...

I dont really think they could prove you'd used pirate software/demo software, because if they could, i think a hell of a lot of bands would be in shit!

As long as you dont really mention you used the demo software, i dont think theres a problem, i've used demo software on all sorts of shit, fucking everyone probably has
 
mva801 said:
But do plugin companies ever try to pin down pirates based on the potential sound of one of their plugs in a commercial mix? Wouldn't that be ridiculously difficult to prove?
Click to expand...

I think there are some new systems coming (some might even be in use) that can do that. I think they're only on some high end sample libraries. The trick is that they code some sort of a watermark to the very very low frequencies (which won't be reproduced anyway, like way under 30 hZ). That way they could see that you've used the samples in a mix, and if you're not the guy who bought them in the first place both you and the guy who bought them will be in trouble.

Well, something like that.
 
Skinny Viking said:
^ but everything gets high-passed at like 40 anyway :p
Click to expand...

yeah that's what I was thinking. Everyone high-passes their mixes, and that's after whatever plugins you use to it would be impossible for a plugin to "bypass" the filter wouldn't it? Plus, at least with mp3s I'm pretty sure everything down there is thrown to the trash while encoding as well
 
muckypup1 said:
I dont really think they could prove you'd used pirate software/demo software, because if they could, i think a hell of a lot of bands would be in shit!

As long as you dont really mention you used the demo software, i dont think theres a problem, i've used demo software on all sorts of shit, fucking everyone probably has
Click to expand...

While you are probably "technically" correct in saying that they could not "prove" the use of demo or pirated software, ultimately in the end, it's still a justification for a questionable act unless clarification is sought. Not trying to get into a heated debate of piracy, but saying "I don't really think they could prove you'd used pirate software/demo software" sounds a little like it's all fine and well as long as you don't get caught and that's a slippery slope indeed.

My personal opinion is that if you like a tool well enough to use it in a professional recording you should probably reward the developer financially buy purchasing their product. Testing an item is fine, but the minute it becomes a profitable tool for you, it should be a profitable tool for the developer. How comfortable are you in giving away your hard work - do you allow the musicians you engineer the same leeway? Can they "demo" your skills and then sell the work you did for them without compensation? Or, do you expect that if you produce a song/album for them that you be rewarded? Just extrapolating out the train of thought.

Once again, just my personal opinion, individual mileage may vary.

PS - who knows, maybe it's perfectly "legal", but it's worth covering ones bases and asking before assuming. Even then, once again, if you like it enough to use it, maybe you should reward the developer.
 
Kontakt 4 doesn´t have a demo/trial, it has a free version called Kontakt Player that is basically the same thing but without the whole sample library (and you can´t load individual instruments that are not related to a commercial library).

So, short answer: yeah, do whatever you want with the software. It´s yours.
 
Not dropping the hammer or judging anyone by chiming in. I know how seriously anti-piracy is taken around here (too the extreme at times ha! Love it). That was one of the first things that pleasantly surprised me about this forum. I've mentioned how upstanding you guys are in that regard to a lot of people at Waves and we all appreciate it.

Andy's actually the one that first suggested I should check out the forum btw. Believe it or not I'm not here on some corporate agenda. I'm a fan of heavy music/production as well and hope to help out on occasion like I have with Andy and other metal producers and artists direct.

To answer the question I'm positive most plugin/DAW demos have a line similar Waves User License Agreement where it says "you expressly agree that you shall use SOFTWARE during the DEMONSTRATION PERIOD only for purposes of evaluation of the SOFTWARE, and not for any commercial use."

Basically if you are going to use it to make money, pay us. It's really the cool thing to do.

That being said I don't think Kontakt Player falls under this. Like mentioned above, when in doubt contact NI.
 
TimatWaves said:
Not dropping the hammer or judging anyone by chiming in. I know how seriously anti-piracy is taken around here (too the extreme at times ha! Love it). That was one of the first things that pleasantly surprised me about this forum. I've mentioned how upstanding you guys are in that regard to a lot of people at Waves and we all appreciate it.

Andy's actually the one that first suggested I should check out the forum btw. Believe it or not I'm not here on some corporate agenda. I'm a fan of heavy music/production as well and hope to help out on occasion like I have with Andy and other metal producers and artists direct.

To answer the question I'm positive most plugin/DAW demos have a line similar Waves User License Agreement where it says "you expressly agree that you shall use SOFTWARE during the DEMONSTRATION PERIOD only for purposes of evaluation of the SOFTWARE, and not for any commercial use."

Basically if you are going to use it to make money, pay us. It's really the cool thing to do.

That being said I don't think Kontakt Player falls under this. Like mentioned above, when in doubt contact NI.
Click to expand...

Great to have a Waves rep with no hidden agenda around here, welcome aboard.
I agree 110%. If you make money from it, buy it. Support developers for their hard work. You wouldn't want someone stealing from your studio and/or band, would you?
 
Just chucking my 2c in, but pirating is a bit contradictory imho.

I'm not saying I don't do it at times, as being a young student with no real income I cant really afford to purchase alot of the software i use, but I still want to be able to learn to prepare for the future (as I wanna go to SAE to do a recording course next year). That being said, when I have the funds spare or if I ever became a commercial studio (not just a simple hobbyist) I would definately buy all the software I use and support the Developers.

I see as not just a thanks for the use of their programs, it's also like an investment, promoting them to further develop their products and expand their range. In fact helping yourself and your peers in the process.

EDIT: I meant to type "I see BUYING SOFTWARE as not..."
 
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