Please critique my song...

RogueSpirit

Wannabe Guitar God
Aug 10, 2001
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This probably shouldn't be done at the Opeth board since the music dosen't sound anything like Opeth (although I love them and own every single album by them). But since I read the guitar thread and there are lots of musicians here, I was wondering if I could get a critique on my rough version of a song.

There is only guitar though and I warn you that it is recorded quite poorly.

Any suggestions and criticisms (yes, even the "you suck, learn to play") would be appreciated.

So without further ado,

www.mp3.com/Eisengrim
 
Ok, I've listened to it a few times, so here's some thoughts:

You suck, learn to play




:) JUST KIDDING :)

Some very cool ideas in there. I don't think the opening lead thing really fits with the rest of the song, especially when it comes in the second time, makes everything disjointed.
The riff at 0:20 reminds me of Metallica :lol:
The part starting at 0:50 is alot like Bolt Thrower (ie good!). I'd like a bit more to be done with it, it sounds like the intro to this big chord-chugging thing that BT would do, but you jump into this gallop-picked thing instead, which is a good riff and I'd keep it, just maybe develop the riff a bit more before you get there.
The part at 1:22 is a good change of pace, I like it.
Everthing after the 2:00 mark is a bit too fiddly to go with the stuff before it, I'd ditch it and create another song with it (it doesn't suck, it just doesn't fit). Develop all the riffs that come before it properly, and you'll probably be stressing out about writing a 6 minute song :tickled:
The last riff (3:14 or so) is a good ending, tack it on to the stuff ending at 2:00.

And don't ever worry about your playing, it's more than alright.
 
Ok let me give you some pointers.

First of all you have the skills. Both in the creativity room and the technical one. But well nothing its perfect and you ask fro critics so i will do that. First of all i see your approach you sound very heavy/power metal influenced and surpricinly enough, you do not sound too repetitive or boring. That its a good thing alone however, just because you like certain style or influences do not limit yourself to just that. You need to work on making riffs have a little more flavor. I dont know twin guitars, guitars doing separate melodies ( or melody/harmony ) sutil variations of the melody, harmony or rythm on the riffs ( in that order of dificulity and proximity to your influences ). The riffs are solid yet they lack of a certain detail or two that make them stick in your head after you heard 1000 similar riffs in heavy metal. I say all this because such creativity to improve them its shown on your leads. Your leads have much more variety, however i do not know if out of technical skill or personal preference, you live alot of techniques out. When you are going to solo that long you need to keep things interesing. The masters do it with strange changing paterns or with sutil changing scales and musical cualities studied in harmony, Us mere mortals can use a mixture of that, but more important: Guitar Techniques. When you are playing or listeing classical guitar classical guitarist takes advantage of the 6 strings and 8 fingers ( 4 of each hand ) he is using. Making often harmonies and intrincate paterns. While this can be done in electrical guitar ( look for jazz players if you are interested ) electric guitar has a different approach. Instead you generally use a pick to develop speed. Its way more easy to develop speed with picks that with fingerpicking techniques. I suggest you try a couple of things: play riffs or little exercices using ONLY alternate picking ( up and down attack ) and trying to change strings as much as you can. Keep working on it till you master some wicked fast things. Now fast things are not the only things needed to spice up, there are other elements i should mention. Sweeps, sweeps are good and with one simple 3 strings sweep you can spice up your solos quite a bit. Tapping ok you know it can get boring but be creative about it. The other day i was making tapping with my pick ( cannot use my fingers cause my fingernails are long for the classical guitar picking )and accidentally missed the fret but i slided it to the correct freet, making a unique sound. Then i came up with a classic pretty standard tapping pattern only difference is that i do what i know call pickslide on the right hand then keep using the pick to slide doing a pulloff to my left hand. It makes the solo sound interesting.

Aside from techniques you could also try to learn some more complex things like musical scales. I would not suggest to do that just now cause you will end up always looking for scales, but getting an exotic scale can sometimes help. I only use major and the 3 minor scales ( natural melodic and harmonic ) but sutil things like going from melodic minor to a harmonic minor can make things sound interesting. Do not be affraid of getting out of the scale, if you find an interesting way to get back on it, becomes a really nice thing.

In the end its up to you but never keep anything you listen out of your music. Do not shy away to include influence from bands like Opeth in your music. This will help you improve your sound quite a lot.

Keep up the good work:D
 
Man you guys are way more helpful than most of the boards I've run into (one Roadrunner board member called me better than Malmsteen, I have no idea how he got that idea).

I've only gotten into metal for the past year or two and have only really concentrated on theory rather than just playing covers in the past year. I'm starting to learn about the harmonic, and natural minors and other simple scales. If there are things you could teach me (or direct me to) that I could learn, that would be greatly appreciated. I also have no clue about how to harmonize a lead so some help would be nice there too.

My (former) piano teacher recommended that I take classical guitar back when I was considering taking guitar. Back then it seemed like such a silly idea, but I really wish I did learn classical guitar since I wasted my first year learning covers of rock songs rather than working on technique. Anyway, I'm trying to make up for it now.

Again, thank you all for the criticism! :)
 
wow, man, 15 seconds into the song, i heard that same thing on the metallica song blackened, HOW THE HELL IS THAT DONE! plz tell me :d other than that its fucking awesome.
 
How to harmonize a solo? tough one. I do it by instict and ear. There are some pointers i can give you out when playing on a mayor scale you play the 2nd 3rd 6th and 7th grades with minor scale ( any of the 3 ) and when hitting the 1, 4th and 5th grades the mayor. Now i know it seems complicated but what you can do its to play freely on a minor scale but lead the melody into a consonant sound when hitting the mayor chords ( 1 4 and 5 ) or in other words: Land it on the root or the 5th. The 4th can work but when you hit a 5th and land the solo on a 4th it will form a minor 7th or a mayor 2nd. We do not want those. If you where doing jazz the 7th could work but it usually sounds weird. Thats why i recomend to land on the 1st and 5th at all times it always sonds consonant and gives you that sence of consistency.

Now this sounds like a lot to think about while playing, but i got 1 word for you: Improvisation. It really teaches you to listen and land those consonant tones so it gives you consitency. At first you should get used to it doing only minor pentatonic scales ( or more widely known as Blues scale ). The pentatonic scale its very intuitive and teaches you how it should sound. You learn to land those tones and guide your leads to them making them sound consistent. Once you are capable you could either jump into your stuff or try Jazz improvisations. Basically the same ending at the 1 and 5 notes when playing 1st, 4th and 5th grades ( i sometimes end up with minor and mayor thirds but its really more hard to make it sound good but it can give you either a festive happy sound ( major 3rd ) or a melancolic sound ( minor 3rd ). Now they might seem like a lot to handle but if you do not change keys on the chord sequence, and have a pretty circular chord sequence ( or a pretty obious sounding cadence like II-VI [ that is playing the second grade with a minor 7th ( minor chord and minor 7th ) then the fifth grade with a dominant 7th ( A minor chord with a minor 7th added ) then the Root tone in a Major 7th ( major chord and major 7th ) . Its hard and you can get lost really fast ( i still do sometimes ) but it really teaches you to listen to the music and playing along. I shure you will find making riffs for your leads and viceversa very easy if you practice consonant sounds either by instinct and ear ( the method i just described ) or by musical theory ( Just making good planings and working carefully and slowly on each solo and riff using the rules ).

Hope its any help:gri
 
Originally posted by Juggie
wow, man, 15 seconds into the song, i heard that same thing on the metallica song blackened, HOW THE HELL IS THAT DONE! plz tell me :d other than that its fucking awesome.

I honestly have no clue what people are taking about Metallica for though...didn't Metallica take a lead and then play it backwards for Blackened? I sure didn't do that.

E-5p0-8p0-7p0-4p0-|

E-5p0-7p0-8p0-10p0-12p0-13p0-12p0-10p0-|-8v-7v-3v

That's what I'm playing for the intro lead...
 
wait dude i ment after the 15 seconds the but hell that answers my second questions..thank you so much. i didnt think youd actually tell me :D
 
Kirk Hammet is big ( or was ) on open string riffs. But i gotta say that Roguespirit heavy metal influenced style with open string leads sounds way more original than cheese blues solos with open strings that metallica used.
 
Originally posted by Juggie
wait dude i ment after the 15 seconds the but hell that answers my second questions..thank you so much. i didnt think youd actually tell me :D

Argh damn you InsTab...work...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
-7-------------------7-7/9-9/8--5-------------------5-5/7-7/8-|
-7-------------------7-7/9-9/8--5-------------------5-5/7-7/8-|
-5-555-555-555-555-5-5/7-7/10-3-333-333-333-333-3-3/5-5/6-|



I think I was playing this after the intro lead...palm mute when needed.
 
Originally posted by Misanthrope
How to harmonize a solo? tough one. I do it by instict and ear. There are some pointers i can give you out when playing on a mayor scale you play the 2nd 3rd 6th and 7th grades with minor scale ( any of the 3 ) and when hitting the 1, 4th and 5th grades the mayor. Now i know it seems complicated but what you can do its to play freely on a minor scale but lead the melody into a consonant sound when hitting the mayor chords ( 1 4 and 5 ) or in other words: Land it on the root or the 5th. The 4th can work but when you hit a 5th and land the solo on a 4th it will form a minor 7th or a mayor 2nd. We do not want those. If you where doing jazz the 7th could work but it usually sounds weird. Thats why i recomend to land on the 1st and 5th at all times it always sonds consonant and gives you that sence of consistency.

Now this sounds like a lot to think about while playing, but i got 1 word for you: Improvisation. It really teaches you to listen and land those consonant tones so it gives you consitency. At first you should get used to it doing only minor pentatonic scales ( or more widely known as Blues scale ). The pentatonic scale its very intuitive and teaches you how it should sound. You learn to land those tones and guide your leads to them making them sound consistent. Once you are capable you could either jump into your stuff or try Jazz improvisations. Basically the same ending at the 1 and 5 notes when playing 1st, 4th and 5th grades ( i sometimes end up with minor and mayor thirds but its really more hard to make it sound good but it can give you either a festive happy sound ( major 3rd ) or a melancolic sound ( minor 3rd ). Now they might seem like a lot to handle but if you do not change keys on the chord sequence, and have a pretty circular chord sequence ( or a pretty obious sounding cadence like II-VI [ that is playing the second grade with a minor 7th ( minor chord and minor 7th ) then the fifth grade with a dominant 7th ( A minor chord with a minor 7th added ) then the Root tone in a Major 7th ( major chord and major 7th ) . Its hard and you can get lost really fast ( i still do sometimes ) but it really teaches you to listen to the music and playing along. I shure you will find making riffs for your leads and viceversa very easy if you practice consonant sounds either by instinct and ear ( the method i just described ) or by musical theory ( Just making good planings and working carefully and slowly on each solo and riff using the rules ).

Hope its any help:gri

My head is spinning...

So when you play a minor scale for example you should use notes from the chords from the 2nd, 3rd, 6th, and 7th degrees? I'm still pretty new to this theory stuff. For my information, harmonizing is mainly used if one wants to do a dual guitar lead right?

And I am very aware of the pentatonic...for the really fast part of my "solo" I basically wanked using pentatonics lol.
 
Hehe ok lets answer your doubts.
When playing a minor scale play anything you like but when you reach an important 1 4 or 5 play the 1 or 5 on the scale ( they are the same on the mayor and minor ). It should give you consitency.

Harmonization its the part of music that studies how 3 or more sounds work togheter. Now for the most part this is true but it can be 2 sounds. IN a major chord C chord you got C E G. Notice than if you take the E out of it it still kinda sounds like C major. Some shorcuts can be made this way. But anyway for harmonizing your SOLOS i thought you where talking about the riff UNDER the solo but lets get to that twin guitars. Basically you can just use a pedal or a program to do intervals. One guitar on the root and the other on the 5th. Root or 4TH. Root or 3rds ( mayor or minor ). 6ths are not that good it sounds weird. So do seconds ( but beware 9ths ( thats a second an octave higher ) have a different approach ) 7ths ( mayor and minor ) are up to you because it can sound bizarre or nice depending on the context. Now this alone makes it sound great. But they are other things. One things bands like inflames like to do its 3rds but instead of doing always the exact interval all the time you play a Mayor root scale and play exaclty the same on a 3rd grade but using a Minor scale. This is a secret known to very few man and can and will become you into a twin guitar god. Its really really interesting sound and you can work your way around it. Now if you are really into this twin things Why have 2 when you can have 3? :D when 3 notes come into play its called Harmony and there is people who study harmony for years and years. Some basic stuff its what i already told you A root Mayor 3rd and 5th make a major chord. A root minor 3rd and 5th make the minor. A root mayor 3rd and an aumented 5th make an aumented chord. A root a minor 3rd and a diminished 3rd make a diminished chord. Now you can mix and match all 3 of them while doing parts on 3 guitars or 2 guitars and bass, There are certain rules that can make you sound like classical music, other approaches that can make you sound like jazz, etc. One very melodic metal approach its to use again a mayor scale, its 3rd but on minor, then its 5ths on its mayor again. This will give you a very dinamic sound yet very consonant. You can just plan all this and mix up parts etc. In fact you dont even need to play the exact same thing. DT likes that approach. The usually use very consonant intervals ( 5ths and 8ths mostly ) wich sound like nothing special at all but they are playing Different melodies on top of each other, but since they are consonant it automatically gives you a twin feel but extremely dynamic without going into chaoitc. You can play different melodies in disonant itervals but unless you plan it note by note it can become a mess and sound really weird.
I hope this approaches help you in your solos and music in general.

And yes i noticed your pentatonics but i was talking about training your ears to recognize and use consonant conclutions. I mean just go to audio galaxy and look for Muddy Waters songs ( i recomend Hoochie Coochie man, Manish Boy ) or Howlin Wolf ( check smokestack lighing or Backdoorman...Little red rooster also ) or well some very very old blues. Just play along with the songs over and over and listen a couple of times how this people with no music training at all always sound very very consistent on their solos. Its just instic and ear, what i do too.
 
Ah, that makes more sense. I was specifically wondering about the whole "Gothenburg" harmonizing sound so thank you.

But where would I find these programs that would do the intervals? Or what pedals?
 
Programs? Well i used soundforge and it can alter the pitch of a sound without altering its tempo. Since its a wave editor you mix the 2 of them togheter ( personal suggestion: make the low sounds at slighty higher volume than the high sounds when using only 2 sounds ). As for pedals well ive seen a harmonizer pedal by boss, but more usefull are the multieffects pedals that include them, cause it already includes welcome goodies like reverbs chorus and echoes, vintage amp simulators, wha and other compresion things, and a wide range of distorion plus the ability to make your own ones. The digitech multieffect pedals are nice overall i like them but can be expensive. Boss multieffects are better and yet more expensive. But Xoom pedals...THey just relased a very compact model that has your basic 2 buttons and a volume/wha/expression pedal and its under 200 american bucks. Ive seen it go as cheap as 150american. It has a nice ammount of effects and it has harmonizing options, very good ones. In fact i think you can even program scales so you get that inflames sound out of it but im not shure. A useful tool nevertheless.