Thoughts on 9/11 and Democracy (all Americans read)

[Lies and Perfidy]

Today is a day of sorrow, a day of remembrance, a day of resolve. A day to think on the events of two years ago and decide what they mean to you. But more than anything else, today is a day to reflect on what it means to be an American and a member of a democracy.

As a citizen of this country, you have a voice in how the country is run and who is running it. But how many of us are using that? In the hotly debated 2000 national election, a mere 67.5% of registered voters and 51.3% of eligible voters cast their votes for the presidential election. Consider that the citizens of America, one of the closest things to a true democracy in the world, barely turned out over halfway to exercise their rights; meanwhile, Iraq, for instance, is liberated from an oppressive dictatorship only to be plunged into anarchy and chaos under military rule. The citizens of countries like Iraq risk their lives for the right to make decisions; meanwhile, we've been sitting on it for 50-200 years (depending on your status), and barely even utilizing it.

So if you truly respect our soldiers and the history of our country, if you think that democracy is something worth fighting or dying for, if you want to have a voice in the way your life is run, then get out their and vote. Pro-choice, pro-life, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, anti-immigration, pro-school voucher, anti-war, pro-environment, whatever - the important thing is that you make your voice heard. We have a responsiblity to our country, to our neighbors, and to ourselves to participate in democracy - so don't fall silent when our country is in a dark place.

Thank you for your time.
-Reuben Poling

 

[AjDeath]

I am anti-Gov't Ahh, Ican see the flames pouring in, eh? maybe not. This country has been on a road to tyranny for the last one hundred years, it may be the best, but it is getting worse. Thank you for reading my opinion of my own country, where they haven't figured out a way to police your thoughts, if you discount the media.

A prayer for the slain though, and a realization that my own life goes on.

 

[OrestesMantra]

9/11 Nevar Forget Amerika Forevre Lets Roooooll

 

[Brent]

Sorry, but I think America is just a joke. I mean, I love living in the country. I love a lot of things about it. I like a lot of the people here. I love that I have the opportunities that I have. I love the fact that if I'm smart enough I can break the laws. But ever since W Bush has been elected we have seen bullshit fall out of a bull's ass right in front of our eyes. Countries like North Korea are SO much more of a threat to the U.S Security than ANY middle eastern country. Yet, is America doing anything about it? I think not. We are wasting over 87 Billion dollars on bullshit. Where are Iraq's Weapons of Mass Destruction? They didn't hide them or get rid of them....there aren't any. Sure, we may have ended Saddam's reign, but what does that really do for us? Sure, some of us like to see people happy, but is it really gonna put a smile on our face when we see little Iraqi's running around happily jumping on Saddam Statue's while we have a cunt as a president? No. And the funny part is, they aren't happily jumping around. The media has covered up just about everything about how Iraqi's are STILL throwing rocks and yelling things at our soldiers. And I'm not gonna go off topic, but let's not forget the failing drug policy. I hope that after the 2004 election, America is a better place.

 

[Lies and Perfidy]

Yeah, I'm REALLY not happy with the current administration either, especially the way they're dismantling education. But I wanted to post something non-partisan, cause it's important that EVERYONE vote if we want to make this country work the way Madison, Hamilton, Jefferson & co. intended it to. It makes me sick to see people who have such a privilege throwing it away like that. Useless motherfuckers.

 

[Anneke]

Yeah, I'm REALLY not happy with the current administration either, especially the way they're dismantling education. But I wanted to post something non-partisan, cause it's important that EVERYONE vote if we want to make this country work the way Madison, Hamilton, Jefferson & co. intended it to. It makes me sick to see people who have such a privilege throwing it away like that. Useless motherfuckers.

I'm not gonna start about my thoughts on America

But I do agree with you on the voting-part. In Belgium you HAVE to vote, if you don't you get a fine. This makes sure that people from all societal levels have their saying. Research has shown that in countries where there's no compulsory voting, only the rich and educated go to vote.. Well not only but in a much larger percentage. WHich is wrong and is not what democracy is about.. So indeed, I'm backing Pyrus up in this one: Go Vote!!

 

[Valofvalhalla]

Have Fun With This

 

[Lies and Perfidy]

Whoah, that's GREAT. Fun shit. I made Gallhager look like a Klingon.

 

[Steiner]

Sorry, but I think America is just a joke. I mean, I love living in the country. I love a lot of things about it. I like a lot of the people here. I love that I have the opportunities that I have. I love the fact that if I'm smart enough I can break the laws. But ever since W Bush has been elected we have seen bullshit fall out of a bull's ass right in front of our eyes. Countries like North Korea are SO much more of a threat to the U.S Security than ANY middle eastern country. Yet, is America doing anything about it? I think not. We are wasting over 87 Billion dollars on bullshit. Where are Iraq's Weapons of Mass Destruction? They didn't hide them or get rid of them....there aren't any. Sure, we may have ended Saddam's reign, but what does that really do for us? Sure, some of us like to see people happy, but is it really gonna put a smile on our face when we see little Iraqi's running around happily jumping on Saddam Statue's while we have a cunt as a president? No. And the funny part is, they aren't happily jumping around. The media has covered up just about everything about how Iraqi's are STILL throwing rocks and yelling things at our soldiers. And I'm not gonna go off topic, but let's not forget the failing drug policy. I hope that after the 2004 election, America is a better place.

Then go live somewhere else.

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/michellemalkin/mm20030910.shtml

 

[AjDeath]

Why is it that when a person with mainstream views of America and what they think it should be hears a different and opposing view they think the person with actual individual thought should move out of the states. This is America Go Damn it, and if I think this country fucking sucks because careful observation has shown me that it ideed does, I have the fucking right to fucking say so, I am sick of that line, "Then go live somewhere else." Fuck you, you go live somewhere else where differing views are not tolerated, try China or North Korea, it will be fun.

I ask everyone-WHEN DID THIS COUNTRY TURN COMMUNIST?!

 

[MindInsane]

Well...I love this counrtry. I can do whatever the fuck I want..whenever I want. I'm completely free to chose any life I want for myself. The possibilities are endless here..your life is what you make it. As far as our government goes..every fucker that's been in office has been a goddamn liar...Bush is DEFINITELY not the first AT ALL! Everyone acts so damn suprised at this aspect of the current administration and it cracks me up. When they lie it's no big suprise to me because one of the requirements to become a politician is to be a great (or not so great) liar! I look at voting as just merely picking the lesser of three or four evils...politicians ALL suck. There might be one in a million who is actually genuine and a good person with out an agenda..but that person will just get steamrolled and smashed by the bad ones before they get anywhere..we blame the politicians for this but it's actually our fault because thats what we have chosen throughout history. I hate the views of the extreme left and I hate the views of the extreme right..there's gotta be a middle of the road somewhere..unfortunately this never rises to the top...why? Because of the voters...they put the absolute jackasses in office...the middle of the road politicians with the rational views never make it..the ones who remain in the race are the two biggest liars. They've all been shitty liars people..this time around the media just covers it constantly..so we get a biased view of a biased view.on CNN, FOX, or whatever other 24 hour news channel we happen to be viewing at the time...this is nothing new..it's just covered 24/7 on the goddamn boob tube...stop tuning in and letting the media ruin your day..they shouldn't have that much power over your mood..or views on your country.

My country is great..my life is great...I can go hiking anywhere I want..I can go to a killer concert once or twice a month ( or more) I can take a road trip to a killer national park..whatever...I enjoy my life in America. I've always made a pretty good living that allows me to do the things I love (and I don't have a college degree) it's all what you make it...every country has it's problems.

 

[Steiner]

Why is it that when a person with mainstream views of America and what they think it should be hears a different and opposing view they think the person with actual individual thought should move out of the states. This is America Go Damn it, and if I think this country fucking sucks because careful observation has shown me that it ideed does, I have the fucking right to fucking say so, I am sick of that line, "Then go live somewhere else." Fuck you, you go live somewhere else where differing views are not tolerated, try China or North Korea, it will be fun.

I ask everyone-WHEN DID THIS COUNTRY TURN COMMUNIST?!

You two can be roomates. You 2 can move to Amsterdam, Paris or Berlin or something. Maybe the Gaza strip would be good. You could even bring a few CD's. Then you could burn some American flags for shits and giggles. You'll find plenty of other America haters who'll share you're opinions. When you're on top everybody wants to see you go down. I don't know how old either of you are, but your opinions show a lack of perspective, appreciation, and intelligence. My buddy elected to quit the Marines because people like you aren't worth dying for. You don't know how lucky you are because you're constantly pissed off that the next guy has more. Maybe it will hit you when you have your own kids. Sorry for the rant, but 2 bad ones deserves another.

"War is an ugly thing but not the ugliest of things; the decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feelings which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself."

-- John Stuart Mill

 

[AjDeath]

What is wrong with you?

 

[Brent]

Steiner, that was just about the worst arguement I have ever seen. You proved NOTHING as a response to what AjDeath said.

 

[panzer0x]

Steiner = A classic example of mindless nationalism. This is exactly what's wrong with the world today.

 

[Lies and Perfidy]

Yeah, Steiner, no offense, but that was a really, really shitty argument. You can do better than "If you don't like what a country you're supposed to have a voice in is doing, then don't use your voice."

 

[Steiner]

I wrote a big long post and then thought better about posting it. I'll stick to music. There are other forums for this kind of stuff.

 

[Bulletride]

I think you guys missed the point of Steiner's arguments. Maybe I'm missing it, but I think I got his point. You all rip on the country like it's a piece of shit. One person started by saying the U.S. is a joke. Then, that same person said to move to North Korea or China. Guys, fact is, that guy proved Steiner's point. The only reason he can come on here or can run out into the streets and say this country is a joke, and that Bush is an idiot, is because of how great the country is. You take that for granted. You rip on it because you can, and blindly and ignorantly take for granted the very fact that you can do this without being thrown in jail or worse. So when he says, go somewhere else, it's not because you'd like it better somewhere else. It's to prove a point. Go somewhere else, and just see how you do with your same loud outbursts. You'll get an appreciation for this country like you wouldn't believe. And yes, this fact that you don't understand that makes you nearsighted. It's like rich kid syndrome. The rich kid who complains life sucks because his girlfriend dumped him or his parents bitched at him. He's got everything, he can't even see how much he's got, just what he doesn't have. You all do the same thing with this country. Look what's positive. Sure we could make improvements, but that is a constant process.

As for whoever made the comments about N. Korea's threat level to the U.S. vs. Iraq's, you'd be 100% right if we could go back 10 years. But Clinton sat on his hands and allowed weapons to be built. He didn't want to shake the economy (which equaled his approval rating). Now it's too late to drop a couple bombs on a reactor and call it a day. Bush is forced to clean up Clinton's mistakes.

And last but not least, the Steiner= blind nationalism..... that's just bullshit man. What you have is a blind complaint against the U.S. Your idealism blinds you and leaves you without the perspective to look at what America really is, and in fact what it has made you. I'd side with the guess that you're a 18 year old kid, give or take a couple years. It's trendy to oppose the government, especially a conservative one. I'm sure you stood by and said, "what a fucking stud man" when Clinton's Lewinsky scandal was breaking. In fact, you are what's wrong with the country. Grow up.

 

[AjDeath]

I think you guys missed the point of Steiner's arguments. Maybe I'm missing it, but I think I got his point. You all rip on the country like it's a piece of shit. One person started by saying the U.S. is a joke. Then, that same person said to move to North Korea or China. Guys, fact is, that guy proved Steiner's point. The only reason he can come on here or can run out into the streets and say this country is a joke, and that Bush is an idiot, is because of how great the country is. You take that for granted. You rip on it because you can, and blindly and ignorantly take for granted the very fact that you can do this without being thrown in jail or worse. So when he says, go somewhere else, it's not because you'd like it better somewhere else. It's to prove a point. Go somewhere else, and just see how you do with your same loud outbursts. You'll get an appreciation for this country like you wouldn't believe. And yes, this fact that you don't understand that makes you nearsighted. It's like rich kid syndrome. The rich kid who complains life sucks because his girlfriend dumped him or his parents bitched at him. He's got everything, he can't even see how much he's got, just what he doesn't have. You all do the same thing with this country. Look what's positive. Sure we could make improvements, but that is a constant process.

As for whoever made the comments about N. Korea's threat level to the U.S. vs. Iraq's, you'd be 100% right if we could go back 10 years. But Clinton sat on his hands and allowed weapons to be built. He didn't want to shake the economy (which equaled his approval rating). Now it's too late to drop a couple bombs on a reactor and call it a day. Bush is forced to clean up Clinton's mistakes.

And last but not least, the Steiner= blind nationalism..... that's just bullshit man. What you have is a blind complaint against the U.S. Your idealism blinds you and leaves you without the perspective to look at what America really is, and in fact what it has made you. I'd side with the guess that you're a 18 year old kid, give or take a couple years. It's trendy to oppose the government, especially a conservative one. I'm sure you stood by and said, "what a fucking stud man" when Clinton's Lewinsky scandal was breaking. In fact, you are what's wrong with the country. Grow up.

Umm, some of that really did not make sense to me, go back and read this thread over again, I am not telling him to move out of this country(actaully I did but it was sarcastic), I merely stated the fact that I have the right to voice my opinions, and when I do so the overwhelming majority of people tell me to move to another country, like telling me that proves anything intellectually. But it is all these people have got to say for themselves when they try to deny me the freedoms they so strongly "support."

Aaron's quote of the day-"When life is worth less than our money, and death becomes an acceptable by-product of freedom, there is something wrong with humanity."-Aaron Desrosiers

 

[Bulletride]

Umm, some of that really did not make sense to me, go back and read this thread over again, I am not telling him to move out of this country(actaully I did but it was sarcastic), I merely stated the fact that I have the right to voice my opinions, and when I do so the overwhelming majority of people tell me to move to another country, like telling me that proves anything intellectually. But it is all these people have got to say for themselves when they try to deny me the freedoms they so strongly "support."

Aaron's quote of the day-"When life is worth less than our money, and death becomes an acceptable by-product of freedom, there is something wrong with humanity."-Aaron Desrosiers

No no, maybe you should re-read my post. It made perfect sense and was directed at you. People tell you to move to another country so you understand, when you say America sucks, it could be worse. Go elsewhere, and you'll see you don't have the freedom to say that. It doesn't prove anything intellectually. It tells you to become fully informed before making statements about the U.S. Go back and read my analogy of little rich kid syndrome. It fits you quite well.