Want to see a reunited Led Zep? Got $14,700?

[General Zod]

As per Blabbermouth....

Owen Gibson of The Guardian reports: The loud and proud return of LED ZEPPELIN was the most lucrative event of the year for the touts and fans at the centre of a heated row over the resale of tickets online, according to figures published yesterday.

One of the leading online ticket resellers, Seatwave, said the average price for tickets sold through the site for LED ZEPPELIN's comeback gig at London's O2 arena was £7,425 (approximately $14,700).

Online resellers have effectively created a rolling market for high-profile gigs and sporting events.

There is no legislation covering the resale of concert tickets and sporting events other than football matches but the culture, media and sport select committee will this week release a hotly anticipated report on the matter.

Desperate LED ZEPPELIN fans were willing to risk thousands on tickets sold through sites such as Seatwave. The tickets had a face value of £125 (approximately $250).

Read the entire article at The Guardian.

 

[Ars Magna]

It's such shit that they can get away with that crap. Hopefully someone will stop it.

 

[Climb Thar Hill]

Outrageous ticket prices on both ends

 

[Krilons Resa]

If some jackass is willing to pay that much for a ticket, who fucking cares. Good for the seller.

Now, on the flip-side, if people just bought the things to resell them, well...

There should be a max per person.

But still, the buyers ar ethe fucking retards. If they have that kind of money to see it, w/e.

 

[cthulufhtagn]

If some jackass is willing to pay that much for a ticket, who fucking cares. Good for the seller.

Now, on the flip-side, if people just bought the things to resell them, well...
.

that's exactly the problem, these big internet resellers swooping up all the tickets before the public has a chance...at least it's never a problem with the shows i want to see

 

[skyrefuge]

that's exactly the problem, these big internet resellers swooping up all the tickets before the public has a chance

All that means is the band/promoter priced the tickets way too low. If they are priced near market levels to begin with, then the resellers won't take on the risk of buying them, and they'll be equally available to normal fans. Normal fans with $14700 to blow in this case, but that's simply the price to pay for being a rabid fan of such a popular band. It's not the scalpers that create the demand, it's the fans themselves, and it would make a lot more sense for the band to collect that money themselves rather than let the scalpers get it.

Neil

 

[Dark One]

Exactly. That's why 50 yard line lower level seats to the Super Bowl generally have a face value in the thousands. Plus, given the fact that the show was originally billed as a once-in-a-lifetime reunion, the demand was that much higher. I doubt the average would've been so high if the talk of additional shows happened before the tickets went on sale.

 

[cthulufhtagn]

so the only way to stop ticket resellers is to sell the tickets at a price far beyond what the average fan would be willing or able to spend? keep in mind that this is a problem that effects many bands. of course the fans create the demand and drive up the price, but what if the band wants the tickets to be available to the fans at a reasonable price? sadly they don't usually have much control, if any, over how their tickets are sold. although i can't imagine robert plant is losing much sleep over it

 

[skyrefuge]

so the only way to stop ticket resellers is to sell the tickets at a price far beyond what the average fan would be willing or able to spend?

It's not the only way, but it's the only fair way.

If the tickets are priced way below market value, it's essentially a random lottery where most people lose, and the few "winners" just happened to get lucky. But the luck of those chosen few doesn't mean that they're the band's biggest fans. There could be someone out there who has been saving money his whole life just for the chance to see Zep, but if tickets are awarded on a lottery basis and reselling is prevented, then tough shit for him, he's out of luck, even if he's willing to pay $50,000. He has no chance to exercise his fandom, and instead, someone's girlfriend who doesn't even like the band will go in his place. It's pretty difficult to come up with an exact measurement of "fandom", so the best proxy we have is how much money you're willing to spend.

but what if the band wants the tickets to be available to the fans at a reasonable price?

Then they should play enough shows at large enough venues to satiate the demand.

Neil

 

[General Zod]

so the only way to stop ticket resellers is to sell the tickets at a price far beyond what the average fan would be willing or able to spend?

This is what the NFL has done, in response to outrageous scalper prices at the Super Bowl. I think the average face-value price of a Super Bowl ticket was $650 last year. I believe, just a few years ago, it was under $100.

As others have said, it only makes sense to sell your product at the price that the market will pay. If that prices some people out of the market, so be it. It's the reason we're all not driving around n Ferraris and Lamborghinis.

Zod

 

[cthulufhtagn]

i see your points, and yeah i suppose that when you're in a band that big and involved in the industry you have to run it like a business...that is to say, forget artistic integrity. hear hear for independent music

There could be someone out there who has been saving money his whole life just for the chance to see Zep, but if tickets are awarded on a lottery basis and reselling is prevented, then tough shit for him, he's out of luck, even if he's willing to pay $50,000. He has no chance to exercise his fandom, and instead, someone's girlfriend who doesn't even like the band will go in his place.

interesting. i suppose that's true but i was considering the opposite scenario where somebody who might love the band but couldn't afford the ticket would be S.O.L. while...some richer guy's girlfriend who doesn't even like the band will go in his place

 

[skyrefuge]

hear hear for independent music

The value of independent, underground bands is not that they intentionally charge less than market value, because they don't. The value is that they EXIST, in great numbers, meaning that we can get a hell of a lot more value for our money than those ignorant Led Zeppelin fans, if we only put a small amount of effort in staying in touch with the underground.

Here's an excerpt of a piece I wrote explaining my rationale for attending the 2002 Milwaukee Metalfest. Full essay here.

I never want to end up in a position where I only know about the “popular” bands and lose my connection to underground music. For years now, I’ve heard people whining about being forced to pay high prices for concert tickets. $130 for U2. $100 average for Billy Joel/Elton John. $250 for Madonna. Heck, I even saw someone here a few weeks ago complaining about ticket prices for the Dream Theater tour. To me, complaints like that are moronic, and I say the same thing I say to those who complain about being forced to buy new reissues of old albums: “Who is reaching into your wallet and taking the money out?” If the price is truly too expensive, don’t pay it. If you pay it, the price wasn’t too high, and you have no reason to complain.

The reason ticket prices get so high is because there are huge numbers of people who want to see particular acts, all fighting for a limited number of seats. And sure, those acts might be good, and deserve all the fans that they have, but if anyone thinks there is any correlation between popularity (which equals ticket price) and quality of the show, then they don’t know anything about music. The enormous supply of bands out there dwarfs the demand of people to hear them, so high ticket prices are not caused by any sort of overall demand, but rather from a very uneven distribution of that demand. Crowds glom onto certain bands and ignore others not because they’re “better”, but simply because lots of other people like them. That means there will always be excellent bands out there playing for next to nothing, to a few passionate fans, in intimate venues. It just takes a little more effort to find them, since you can’t just follow the well-worn path created by the stampeding herd. Case in point: I recently saw Dillinger Escape Plan for $3. DEP can hold their own with anyone in terms of musicianship and intensity as far as I’m concerned; sure, a lot of people might say U2 puts on a better show, but 43 times better? The average price of a concert ticket in 2001 was an absurd $43.86; I’ve been to over 60 concerts, and I don’t think I’ve EVER paid that much to see a one-day show, and I hope I never do....

...So the way I see it, spending $45 and a bunch of time on the Milwaukee Metalfest gave me the chance to see 130 bands (many of them unsigned), which was a very good investment for my concertgoing future. I never want to reach the point where I believe that I NEED to spend a whole lot of money to see a particular band, and staying in touch with the underground, catching bands while they’re on the way up, before they’ve had a chance to balloon, is a great way to prevent that from happening. Who knows which of the bands I saw this year will be big next year? Last year’s festival had Soilwork, who while pretty well-known then, made a significant step up in the last year. I’ve seen several people talking about Mastodon recently, and they played last year...

Unfortunately, last year, I spent $50 to see Rodrigo y Gabriela.

Neil

 

[Mormagil]

Spending that much on guitar wankery is always a bad idea. Go see a pretentious college student give a recital if you really have to see something like that...might as well go to a donkey show

Doomcifer pretty much nailed it.

 

[General Zod]

i see your points, and yeah i suppose that when you're in a band that big and involved in the industry you have to run it like a business...that is to say, forget artistic integrity.

Never been a Zeppelin fan, but I'm not sure what ticket prices have to do with artistic integrity. If in the end, your tickets are going to be sold for $10,000, why should some ticket agency, who didn't even exist when you wrote the songs people are paying to hear, make that money?

Zod

 

[Dark One]

Yep, just like a piece of art (only on stage instead of on the wall), some people are willing to pay thousands for something with a bunch of squiggly lines that others would say "are you completely insane?". Yet the artist will gladly take the $$ any day of the week.

 

[cthulufhtagn]

Never been a Zeppelin fan, but I'm not sure what ticket prices have to do with artistic integrity. If in the end, your tickets are going to be sold for $10,000, why should some ticket agency, who didn't even exist when you wrote the songs people are paying to hear, make that money?

Zod

first off, imo selling concert tickets for $250 is totally bogus. now, did led zeppelin themselves determine the ticket price? of course not; they have no say in the matter. but, greedy or not, they're being used to fleece their fans of enormous amounts of money. any time you allow your artistic expression to be used in this manner (for somebody else to make $$$ off you) you're sacrificing integrity. for example, would you sign over the rights to your classic tunes to sell cadillacs? i'm not even saying it's their fault in this case, i'm just spouting off about the soulless and evil nature of the popular music industry.

now, you probably disagree that $250 or even $10,000 is a ludicrous sum to charge for a concert ticket and would contend that the band deserves whatever they can get away with. that goes against every rule in my book, but hey--opinions are like assholes, no?


@skyrefuge: totally agreed about independent music being a matter of supply and demand, as it were. not every band in the underground is so much holier than your typical major-label act. but many would prefer to avoid that business-oriented pit of despair at all costs....myself included. the major labels don't give a flying fuck about quality music--it's all about the bottom line and the bands on their rosters exist exclusively as disposable product.

 

[General Zod]

first off, imo selling concert tickets for $250 is totally bogus. now, did led zeppelin themselves determine the ticket price? of course not; they have no say in the matter. but, greedy or not, they're being used to fleece their fans of enormous amounts of money. any time you allow your artistic expression to be used in this manner (for somebody else to make $$$ off you) you're sacrificing integrity.

I guess I'm not seeing how their "artistic integrity" is being compromised. Their art is their music. And the price of tickets doesn't effect the music one iota. So, what's been compromised? Who decided that artists must be poor, and must be willing to play for prices the poor can afford? And I'm curious, who gets to determine what price you can charge and still have "artistic integrity"? I don't think Zeppelin ever claimed to be tr00 or kvlt.

for example, would you sign over the rights to your classic tunes to sell cadillacs?

I just don't see using your art to sell Cadillacs and having high ticket prices as being equal.

now, you probably disagree that $250 or even $10,000 is a ludicrous sum to charge for a concert ticket and would contend that the band deserves whatever they can get away with. that goes against every rule in my book, but hey--opinions are like assholes, no?

Well, what good does it serve Led Zep to sell their tickets for $8, just to have ticket agencies turn around and sell them for $14,000? If that money is going to change hands (and clearly it is), why shouldn't the artist get it?

Zod

 

[cthulufhtagn]

I just don't see using your art to sell Cadillacs and having high ticket prices as being equal.

i do. i'm not saying led zeppelin should turn around and charge $8, it's way too late for that.

 

[Dark One]

i do. i'm not saying led zeppelin should turn around and charge $8, it's way too late for that.

Keep in mind though that, say, Zep charged $150 a pop or something that you consider high yet reasonable. The scalpers were still going to get thousands regardless due to supply and demand for the show. Since that money would've been put in someone's pocket regardless, it would've made sense for the money to go to the actual artist rather than the scalpers.

 

[General Zod]

Keep in mind though that, say, Zep charged $150 a pop or something that you consider high yet reasonable. The scalpers were still going to get thousands regardless due to supply and demand for the show. Since that money would've been put in someone's pocket regardless, it would've made sense for the money to go to the actual artist rather than the scalpers.

It's a very odd dynamic. The record companies are often chided for ripping off the artists. And I suspect very few here approve of downloading and not buying. So, if you believe that the artist should be the one to make the money that his art generates, I'm not sure why this is different. If Zeppelin charged $50, couldn't you also argue that's unfair to the fan whose got a family of four to feed, and can't afford the $100 for he and his wife to go to the show?

Zod