WOW.

[Dead_Lioness]

http://switch5.castup.net/frames/20041020_MemriTV_Popup/video_480x360.asp?ai=214&ar=1050wmv&ak=null

 

[Dark One]

Hard to believe someone actually has the courage and vision to tell it like it is.

Thank you for sharing.

 

[DemonKnight5150]

That was pretty intense....but definitely accurate.

 

[Reminiscence]

Want to say what it is? I'm kind of writing a 15 page essay and don't want to waste my time. Fun!

 

[derek]

Dealing in absolutes is idiocy.

The Islamic world may be a whole bunch of things, but to claim the western world is intrinsically better, or indeed right is plain old-school fucking dumb.

Whether it be barbarism or liberalism gone mad, the entire world is heading towards implosion. Senseless crap like that entire video is only gonna make it happen quicker.

 

[Karmic]

but not using absolutes in a discussion where the opposing party does deal in absolutes, doesn't that somewhat make your statement seem weaker?

and, I would believe she was referring to certain aspects, most likely especially the controversial ones.

 

[derek]

but not using absolutes in a discussion where the opposing party does deal in absolutes, doesn't that somewhat make your statement seem weaker?

and, I would believe she was referring to certain aspects, most likely especially the controversial ones.

It may seem less emphatic, but it's certainly not weaker. I'd argue that an understanding of the context, scale and scope of human civilisation would provide a much better structure to build upon than this mad ramblings of absolutes.

Dealing in absolutes, as she is, we cannot really determine what she is referring to. She seems to be writing off an entire civilisation. Saying The Islamic approach to sexuality and women is increasingly misogynistic is vastly different from saying Islam, as a civilisation, is all wrong.

 

[unknown]

that was good stuff. and for a woman to be the one delivering the message just ups the ante

 

[Karmic]

compared to the dude she was debating/arguing with, who would you deem the winnar then?

 

[Krigloch the Furious]

heh, dirty muslims.

 

[WhiteBeastofWotan]

I dont agree with every single one of her points, but DAMN that woman knows how to do public speaking. That was pretty amazing.

 

[derek]

She knows how to sway the idiot masses, yes.

 

[Necromunchkin]

Given the masses that program was meant for, I doubt there was much swaying.

 

[derek]

Given the masses that program was meant for, I doubt there was much swaying.

Totally true.

 

[neal]

Final Product>>> so what specifically were all of these 'absolutes' she was dealing in? other than "muslims treat women like beasts" i didnt really hear anything that couldnt be backed up by examples. i guess you could claim the whole "a jew has never blown themselves up in a german restaraunt etc." as 'absolutes', but its like, true. (i only watched it once)

 

[derek]

Final Product>>> so what specifically were all of these 'absolutes' she was dealing in? other than 'muslims treat women like beasts' i didnt really hear anything that couldnt be backed up by examples. i guess you could claim the whole 'a jew has never blown themselves up in a gernam restaraunt etc.' i suppose are 'absolutes', but its like, true. (i only watched it once)

I mean absolutes as in her talk of "two opposing civilisations", "one barbaric and one not", "one from the middle ages and one in the 21st century".

Talking as if the western world = good and the Isalmic world = bad is dealing in black and white, one dimensional absolutes and I'm not sure it helps anything.

 

[Necromunchkin]

I point out she was actually challenging that argument, by pointing out that it's not a clash between civilizations, she was referencing arguments cited by many Muslim extremists in arguing why protestors in Pakistan, Iran, etc are justified in attacking buildings associated with the West. Her point was that it is merely a clash of ideologies based purely on one group believing one thing and the other not believing it.

 

[Necromunchkin]

Heh, not arguing your points as for the most part I would tend to agree. Just establishing that she actually shared a few of 'em

:Spin:

 

[neal]

well ok. some of those cant really be denied though, she did kind of elaborate on many of her opening 'absolute' statements later on in her speech, i think she was probably trying to keep it as short as possible before they cut her mic and burned her as a heretic (intentionally inflamatory).

 

[derek]

I point out she was actually challenging that argument, by pointing out that it's not a clash between civilizations, she was referencing arguments cited by many Muslim extremists in arguing why protestors in Pakistan, Iran, etc are justified in attacking buildings associated with the West. Her point was that it is merely a clash of ideologies based purely on one group believing one thing and the other not believing it.

I'd still argue she's generalising.

She does say some interesting things, but there's a value system at work there I dont quite agree with.

edit: me bed time. I shall post somemore here tomorrow. *hugz, until then *