you know.. my dad was told to apply for one of those iraq contracting jobs
- Thread starter minxnim
- Start date
0sm0se
Mr. Negativity
At the risk of being deemed a racist forthwith, those people are savages, poking a corpse that way. And also, even at the death of an enemy, celebration seems soulless.
The Dope
Hi.
FuSoYa
Lunarian
But how many Americans in this country do you know who would rejoice at the swooping destruction of certain parties in the middle east? I for one know plenty of them.
FalseTodd
Skirt Wizard
xfer
I JERK OFF TO ARCTOPUS
Your dad was told to apply for an Iraqi contracting job, or he was told to apply for the so-called "contracting jobs" of HIRED MERCENARY KILLERS that were held by the four guys who got killt, burnt, and pok'd?
xfer
I JERK OFF TO ARCTOPUS
Additionally, even the "September 11th ruled/Hamas and Hezbollah are my friends" height-of-villanous radical clerics in Iraq condemned the corpse abuse.
Although they admitted having no problem with the actual killings.
Although they admitted having no problem with the actual killings.
he said 'they asked us to go because they need contractors that can use machine guns to protect themselves'.
thefourthcontact
prospective mad scientist
my dad was asked to go to iraq for the same reason. he's a contractor and he's also a retired cop experienced with firearms and i think the offer was that if he worked there for a year he would make one million dollars. i wasn't sure at the time what i thought was best because i didn't know how dangerous it really was and it sounded like a good deal, but now i think he did the right thing by staying home.
what's the story with that picture anyway? was it an american civilian working in iraq?
what's the story with that picture anyway? was it an american civilian working in iraq?
0sm0se
Mr. Negativity
xfer
I JERK OFF TO ARCTOPUS
yeah, it sounds like your dad was asked to be a REAL contractor, not like the guys in the picture.
the bodies in the picture were those of members of a private army--barely civilian at all. i think i read that there are 10-15,000 of these type of people working in iraq, not just americans (like these were) but south african (the merc capital of the world) and other nations.
they have military grade hardware; they fly in military-grade helicopters; they have fucking ARTILLERY and can call in airstrikes. essentially, their presence was encouraged by the Pentagon--they are hired to do tasks that 20 years ago the military would have been responsible for, including securing battlefields and even carrying out operations--because when a civilian "contractor" dies, the government doesn't report it as a bad-publicity american soldier death. instead, they're euphemized as "contractors" instead of "soldiers of fortune" and the US scores PR points by saying "the terrorists killed an innocent civilian!" most people think "contractor" meaning somebody building roads or pipes or houses or something (and i'm guessing that's the kind of stuff your dad was asked to be hired for, amanda? even carpenters and such in iraq do carry weapons to defend themselves), but these guys were flat-out paramilitary soldiers.
they also don't necessarily need to abide by war-crimes and rules-of-war stuff of the Geneva convention. very convenient.
the bodies in the picture were those of members of a private army--barely civilian at all. i think i read that there are 10-15,000 of these type of people working in iraq, not just americans (like these were) but south african (the merc capital of the world) and other nations.
they have military grade hardware; they fly in military-grade helicopters; they have fucking ARTILLERY and can call in airstrikes. essentially, their presence was encouraged by the Pentagon--they are hired to do tasks that 20 years ago the military would have been responsible for, including securing battlefields and even carrying out operations--because when a civilian "contractor" dies, the government doesn't report it as a bad-publicity american soldier death. instead, they're euphemized as "contractors" instead of "soldiers of fortune" and the US scores PR points by saying "the terrorists killed an innocent civilian!" most people think "contractor" meaning somebody building roads or pipes or houses or something (and i'm guessing that's the kind of stuff your dad was asked to be hired for, amanda? even carpenters and such in iraq do carry weapons to defend themselves), but these guys were flat-out paramilitary soldiers.
they also don't necessarily need to abide by war-crimes and rules-of-war stuff of the Geneva convention. very convenient.
lizard
Member
xfer is for the most part right...you can read about "private security corporations" in Robert Young Pelton's always fascinating "World's Most Dangerous Places". Technically they are not allowed to be armed with explosives but they probably play that card pretty loosely. These guys are for the most part corporate security types in dangerous lands but they by nature and training easily veer into total mercenary territory.
Pelton outlines how in Sierra Leone a team of about 80 of these guys basically suppressed an entire rebel army of thousands, simply by sheer training, discipline and firepower.
I understand Osmose is responding with disgust and revulsion. yeah we all are capable of heinous crimes under certain circumstances and environments, remember how the Somalis basically made us quit their country after a very similar incident as outlined in blackhawk down.
Pelton outlines how in Sierra Leone a team of about 80 of these guys basically suppressed an entire rebel army of thousands, simply by sheer training, discipline and firepower.
I understand Osmose is responding with disgust and revulsion. yeah we all are capable of heinous crimes under certain circumstances and environments, remember how the Somalis basically made us quit their country after a very similar incident as outlined in blackhawk down.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/vietnam/trenches/mylai.html
read this thread to my dad. he told me to direct osmose here.
read this thread to my dad. he told me to direct osmose here.
0sm0se
Mr. Negativity
I've read plenty about My Lai, as well as a host of other atrocities commited by American soldiers during the Vietnam War. I am aware that all people are capable of doing some extraordinarily horrible things under extreme circumstances, however, I'm equally as revolted by the soldiers as by the Iraqi public that particpated in these grim displays of violence. All I said is that it's terrible that it happens, though I failed find anything about the celebration that the American soldiers at My Lai took part in. I don't see them posing with piles of corpses or similarly giving the corpses the finger which would be the American equivalent of beating them with shoes in Iraq. Not that it makes either better, but the amount disrespect shown to human life, human dignity, family dignity, and even in this case, religion leaves my jaw hanging and my heart in my shoes. Pictures like those are the reason I can't believe in organized religion anymore, knowing that it causes things like that, in Christianity with the Crusades and with Islam now. Tell you dad thanks in trying to broaden my world view but those soldiers who massacred those women children and elderly are merely as savage as those who participated in the murder and subsequent defamation of those bodies.
FalseTodd
Skirt Wizard
I think the confusion stemmed from
"those people are savages"
by which I entirely believe you meant to refer to "those people (attacking those corpses) are savages", but which was construed by myself and probably Toby and others as "(the Iraqis) are savages". Am I right? If so, sorry.
"those people are savages"
by which I entirely believe you meant to refer to "those people (attacking those corpses) are savages", but which was construed by myself and probably Toby and others as "(the Iraqis) are savages". Am I right? If so, sorry.
xfer
I JERK OFF TO ARCTOPUS
osmose didn't you ever see Full Metal Jacket?!0sm0se said:
yeah, it was a movie, but it was based on a lot of things from life, including incidents from Michael Herr's Dispatches which was nonfiction.
anyway, i'm not especially shocked by the corpse abuse. caring about corpses and "respect" and all that over the real issues is...well, it's something a radical Shiite cleric would care about, not me.
lizard, in a comparative incident in the past few days, mercenary commandos from Blackwater (the company that employed the four "contractors" killed in Fallujah) repelled a militia attack on coalition headquarters--performing a job that has, in previous wars, been strictly reserved for the military.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2001896454_security06.html
also, read: meditations in green.
p.s. guys in vietnam wearing ear necklaces or saving dead people's fingers wasn't fake.
p.s. guys in vietnam wearing ear necklaces or saving dead people's fingers wasn't fake.
xfer
I JERK OFF TO ARCTOPUS
i also think the Black Hawk Down comparisons are very interesting, because the larger situation is totally unlike the Somalia situation in every way--the only "point of comparison" are the visual images of the corpses. so, in Mogadishu, we could just pull out. in Iraq, the USA does not have that luxury, so the public distaste will affect national policy and action in a very different (and hopefully anti-Bush) way.
lizard
Member
xfer
I JERK OFF TO ARCTOPUS
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