Fingerstyle Bass recording

[ArtisanBass]

I play fingerstyle bass and I'm sick of gettind drowned out in recordings. Playing with a pick is not an option after after all these years. Assume that my technique is semi-versitile (meanwhile, I'll imagine) and I want to get my prominant melodies out there in the mix. Sure I love to pound 8th notes for the sake of heavy, but enough of the practicing my arse off only not to be heard. There's got to be a better way than just turning up. I've been reading up a lot about creating holes in the mix in relationship to all the instruments, but I admit it can make the guitars suffer.

Background. Tuning normally in D. I used to use very heavy strings but I found the tone suffered. I trained myself back into normal .105-.45's. I use mainly 6-string bass but not too many high end parts. If I do get a good low end, it can turn out being a bit shrill for the higher stuff. All my basses have EMG pickups. I have a GK amp with an Eden cab. I also at times augment my sound with a Tech 21 SansAmp or RBI.

Let me know, if I'm being a selfish overzealous bass player not being a team player. Otherwise,I'd love some tips if you have any other than "use a pick" I'm going to be posting this on a few forums.

Thanks for all the thoughts in advance.

ArtisanBass

 

[Ermz]

Well compression plays a huge part in getting the bass to sit well. It's common to slam the bass until there's basically no dynamic range left in it any more, in particular with fingerstyle playing where a good majority of players are sloppy with their consistency.

You might want to check out Slumber's debut album and see how they mixed the bass into the foreground. It sounds pretty cool.

It will help to multiband compress the guitars from around 280hz to 80hz or whatever. Just roll off 60hz and below for them totally. This will achieve a consistency in the low-end, allowing you to fill it up nicely with your compressed bass, without it ever getting out of control.

The guitars will suffer, yeah, but unless you want to be battling for the low-end, they will have to.

 

[ArtisanBass]

Thanks for the feedback thus far. Compressing the guitars I heard is taboo in metal. I have experimented. I've also played around with ducking frequencies with various instruments to create holes for others. I've read 120hz and under for guitar. You hear so many things. I actually dig Slumber and love tuning into the bass. I'm such a dork if anyone has some numbers for compressing the bass that would be great. I compress it at times at 3:1 and use very light amounts if I'm not doing metal. Sometimes I'll get it up to 8:1 and get 15db of reduction. Once again, thanks for taking the time to write

 

[Ermz]

Just compress it and then listen to how it interacts with the mix. You never want it to jump out at points then duck down in others (unless of course that's an artistic choice for the song). Just make sure it's solid and staying at the same level. I think Slumber is a perfect example of that. The bass is always there, just filling up that low-end and being audible yet never obtrusive.

You're right though, to get the kind of seperation between instruments you're after, you're going to have to cut away from other elements. It's usually a given that the kick drum will have everything aside from the dominant bass frequency (50-80Hz or whatever) and the attack frequency (2-5khz or thereabouts) cut out. It's very important that the bass drum isn't flabby and doesn't conflict with the bass.

The snare may have to suffer a little bit on the low-end to accomodate the bass, but I'm sure there has to be ways around that. I'm not very big on thin, picollo snare sounds.

The guitar... the best thing to do is multi-band compress around the range I wrote up above. You want the guitars high-passed to around 60Hz anyway.

It's annoying in metal because in order to get seperation and hit that perfect compromise of sound, the individual elements do have to suffer simply because there's so much going on.

 

[NK]

That's really odd. I wrote quite a long reply to this thread and saw it here yesterday. Now it's gone. Hmm...

I'll investigate this further and post again on the subject when I get home - I'm on my way to the airport now...

Neil K.

Neil K.

 

[ArtisanBass]

Neil, thanks for tryin.

 

[Ermz]

I definitely look forward to it Neil. Mixing bass in well is something I've always struggled with. I suppose the principles are there... but implementing them is the trick, haha.

 

[NK]

Well, there's no one trick. However, I've never had a problem making the bass heard without the track losing power(my opinion of course). It certainly takes some messing with, but it's essentially a matter of tweaking the bass versus the bass drum and gtrs until you get to the sweetest spot.

I personally far prefer bass played with fingers to pick. In my opinion the click of the bass isn't what you're looking for anyway - you need the fullness of it. I've had a lot easier of a time with bass played by fingers than with a pick as far as finding a good spot in the mix, for sure.

Neil K.

 

[ArtisanBass]

Playing with fingers? Neil... I love you man. Might you be suggesting that I look for a sound that works with the drums and guitars before I print to tape(hard drive)? As opposed to getting a good bass tone and then tweaking to fit. Any guidelines for compression ration and gain reduction?

 

[silverwulf]

I've heard of some guys HP'ing heavy guitars at around 150 to make room for the bass before. I'd be curious to anymore insight into this also.

 

[ArtisanBass]

I've heard the same for between 125-150. I read it by BT though. So maybe this doesn't work famously with metal. Everytime i try it, the guitars lose all body.

 

[Ermz]

That seems a bit hardcore. Even though those lows on the guitar aren't present enough to be heard or clash with the bass, they do add to the underlying bass on the track. I think high-passing up that far is a bit overkill. At the very most I high-pass at 60-80Hz and then just shelf the rest of the lows, however much is needed.

 

[NK]

It should be easy to have the bass be audible even without radical high pass filtering. Of course it all depends on just how loud and separated out you want the bass, but I've never really encountered any problems with the bass not being audible. There are occasions where the band simply doesn't want the bass to stick out so you keep it down for those reasons.

 

[KeithRT99]

try adding overdrive or compression. Also, what kind of bass are you playing, what pickups,wood,etc? listen to maiden, its a great example of getting fingersyle to stick out. Alot of mids around 1k wouldn't hurt either.