I neither have their experience, nor their means of production, and though I am working on it, I haven't put out any real full length record. By the way, I am 23. Does that mean I can't have an opinion ? Am I being too harsh on them thinking that they are a few steps away from being successful and some of the world's best songwriters ? Wow, how ungrateful and narrow minded I must be.
Listening to March of Progress
- Thread starter Drumius
- Start date
Since you and Karl are curious, here's a link to a 6 tracks demo I released late 2009.
http://www.jamendo.com/fr/artist/355547/paris-by-night
http://www.jamendo.com/fr/artist/355547/paris-by-night
Lake of despond
New Metal Member
- Mar 22, 2007
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You see, that's exactly where we disagree - I see a mature and well-rounded band, whilst you would prefer to chop few bits off and replace it with a more successful formula, at least what you regard as such. Where you see imperfection I see creativity and we will never agree on it. A word of advice though, every album takes a life of its own once being composed and because music is such an abstract entity, there is a certain flow to it that you should not alter. It is a way of expressing oneself and it's impossible to shift some proposed elements as it affects its whole structure. If you don't feel it as perfect then it's time to move on to a different band.
LavagesOfTime
evangelist of Threshold
I think that the point in having Karl studying jazz to improve is solos is totally out of the world. Threshold are a METAL band with progressive elements, not viceversa, so I expect them to play METAL and, as for any metal band in the world, stick to that.
With this said, I think that Karl already did an improvement, since I found his soloing on Dead Reckoning much more diverse compared to what he used to do in the past; in parallel, I definitely love guitarist with their own style and "voice", and IMHO the fact that a solo could be "predictable" doesn't mean it is bad.
If I want to listen to proper progressive, with band members showing up their jazz influences, I listen to Spock's Beard. And I love them for the very same reasons: they are progressive.
With this said, I think that Karl already did an improvement, since I found his soloing on Dead Reckoning much more diverse compared to what he used to do in the past; in parallel, I definitely love guitarist with their own style and "voice", and IMHO the fact that a solo could be "predictable" doesn't mean it is bad.
If I want to listen to proper progressive, with band members showing up their jazz influences, I listen to Spock's Beard. And I love them for the very same reasons: they are progressive.
LavagesOfTime
evangelist of Threshold
This fantastic quote from an interview with Jon Jeary back in 1999 sums up the whole concept:
<<
Karl said to me the other day, "let's just keep on making albums until we're old men". So as long as somewhere like GEP will let us do it, we'll keep on making albums.
>>
The only bad thing about it is that Jon is no longer making records with the band. :Smug:
You know, I just meant that with such a high technical level, I really find it too bad that he plays the same licks over and over. I don't want him to play jazz, my point is that it's good to step outside of your usual beat, to get new inspiration. But yes, there's some cool new guitar stuff, especially on Ashes. I would just love to be more surprised.
As it goes, Steve Lukather along with Dann Huff (Giant) were two of the guitarists I liked when I set out to play. That was due to their ability to find tunes instead of scales on the guitar and then embellish with technique afterwards. That is reason I find jazz and fusion so aimless in terms of instrumentals. It all feels a bit random and lacking in melody. You should ask Steve about this instead!
My personal view on guitar is that the players with the more limited playing vocabulary have been the more accessible and ultimately listenable. Dave Gilmore is probably the most recognisable sounding guitarist in the world and yet hardy revolutionary. You would more than likely list him as no more than competent in technique and using the same patterns time after time, but it is highly effective. If anything, I would prefer to limit my playing more to melody and use less technique. However, instrumentals for me are usually an emotional response to the song and I want the solo to integrate instead of standing separate from the vocal sections.
Maybe we should start complaining about vocalists next? Damian should stop repeating his stylized sound and start listening to other influences. If he works hard, maybe he could sound like Russell Allen. He has the beard now
By the way, it is good to see that you have something to offer musically yourself.
My personal view on guitar is that the players with the more limited playing vocabulary have been the more accessible and ultimately listenable. Dave Gilmore is probably the most recognisable sounding guitarist in the world and yet hardy revolutionary. You would more than likely list him as no more than competent in technique and using the same patterns time after time, but it is highly effective. If anything, I would prefer to limit my playing more to melody and use less technique. However, instrumentals for me are usually an emotional response to the song and I want the solo to integrate instead of standing separate from the vocal sections.
Maybe we should start complaining about vocalists next? Damian should stop repeating his stylized sound and start listening to other influences. If he works hard, maybe he could sound like Russell Allen. He has the beard now
By the way, it is good to see that you have something to offer musically yourself.
"I really find it too bad that he plays the same licks over and over."
How on Earth did you find it that Karl plays same thing over and over? :O
Then what to say about Iron Maiden that write songs based on the same pattern all these years?
Threshold's style is recognizable and unique, but every record is a story for itself.
And if you don't like their style, and that bothers you, sorry, mate, but true Threshold fans don't wanna hear them playing in some other style.
How on Earth did you find it that Karl plays same thing over and over? :O
Then what to say about Iron Maiden that write songs based on the same pattern all these years?
Threshold's style is recognizable and unique, but every record is a story for itself.
And if you don't like their style, and that bothers you, sorry, mate, but true Threshold fans don't wanna hear them playing in some other style.
LavagesOfTime
evangelist of Threshold
Damian should stop repeating his stylized sound and start listening to other influences. If he works hard, maybe he could sound like Russell Allen. He has the beard now
ghost hunter
New Metal Member
hi everybody.
I'm listening to the new album right now
I think that Threshold never disappointed us, every release was good, including March Of Progress.
We should be grateful that there are still band like this, offering always their best to us. On the contrary, some bands re-invented so much their sound, you can't tell it is the same band of two years before. Think about it.
Instead of re-inventing their sound, they "invented" a new one years before (you can tell it's Threshold from the early albums, they added some new "sounds" on the musical scene since Clone and even before), but every album has its differences from the others (subtle differences perhaps).
Personally, I put them in the Prog Metal emblematic and symbolic bands.
I'm listening to the new album right now
I think that Threshold never disappointed us, every release was good, including March Of Progress.
We should be grateful that there are still band like this, offering always their best to us. On the contrary, some bands re-invented so much their sound, you can't tell it is the same band of two years before. Think about it.
Instead of re-inventing their sound, they "invented" a new one years before (you can tell it's Threshold from the early albums, they added some new "sounds" on the musical scene since Clone and even before), but every album has its differences from the others (subtle differences perhaps).
Personally, I put them in the Prog Metal emblematic and symbolic bands.
ghost hunter
New Metal Member
i have a question
in the song Liberty, Complacency, Dependency, i cannot understand the spoken lyrics at the beginning and in the middle of the song.
Does someone know from where they're taken or who's speaking?
If not, if someone who understands English better than me could write the text down, it would be much appreciated.
thank you in advance
in the song Liberty, Complacency, Dependency, i cannot understand the spoken lyrics at the beginning and in the middle of the song.
Does someone know from where they're taken or who's speaking?
If not, if someone who understands English better than me could write the text down, it would be much appreciated.
thank you in advance
Maybe we should start complaining about vocalists next? Damian should stop repeating his stylized sound and start listening to other influences. If he works hard, maybe he could sound like Russell Allen. He has the beard now
James LaBrie already tried the beard thing, didn't prevent him achieving to lose whatever voice he had left. No, I love the dramatic aspect that Damian brings to the band, he should just shave and stay himself
Bungalow Buttons
New Metal Member
Criticism is a good thing when it doesn't come across as a personal attack of which the above 2 comments come across as really quite vindictive.
The guys have feelings y'know so keep your criticisms constructive and perhaps you won't get such a reaction.
It's nice to see that you are actually in the minority when it comes to an opinion.
March of Progress is an amazing album, I'm new to Threshold myself but having heard a lot of early works and building up my back catalogue I consider this to be their best work yet.
Lake of despond
New Metal Member
- Mar 22, 2007
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Hm, good on you for giving it a go, I just felt there is still a room for improvement. The vocals are completely out of tune at times and don't necessarily follow the same harmonies as the background music. First two tracks ok, nothing ground breaking but the rest just dragged on endlessly and didn't change the rhythm pattern much. All in all, slightly eclectic and not inspiring enough, but I guess you are in your twenties as yet.
Lake of despond
New Metal Member
- Mar 22, 2007
- 22
- 0
- 1
Ok, I have been listening to my iTunes copy for two days and hopefully the cd will arrive tomorrow so I can check out the art work and lyrics. I absolutely love mop. I think it has possibly one of the best vocal performances I have heard. there is that classic Threshold sound but plenty of surprises. "Rubicon" and "don't look down" are two of the best tracks Threshold have written. I cannot wait to hear the new material live. Thank you Threshold.
Harley D
Member
This is a solid, solid album.
My review is here: http://thatdevilmusic.net/2012/08/28/devils-review-threshold-march-progress/
My review is here: http://thatdevilmusic.net/2012/08/28/devils-review-threshold-march-progress/
Karl, in 2007 I have asked you about long distance between "Subsurface" and "Dead Reckoning" (3 years) and you said that you will try to reduce the gap, but, in fact, it turned out that it grew up to 5 years!
Wounded Land 1993
Psychedelicatessen 1994
Extinct Instinct 1997
Clone 1998
Hypothetical 2001
Critical Mass 2002
Subsurface 2004
Dead Reckoning 2007
March of Progress 2012
Replacements of singers did not affect on the releases of albums earlier.
Wilson to Morgan - 1 year
Morgan to Wilson - 3 years
Wilson to Mac - 1 year
That's why I think that main problem of Threshold now is the troubles with the songwriting. Previously, you had 1-3 years to write an album. Now - 5.
And during those five years, the band has not released any single (not in compilations) for their fans. It's not good too.
It's not about quantity or frequency of output but quality. Threshold are one of the few bands who have never let the quality of their releases drop below a very high standard. Also, the band members have lives (families), other bands, careers, etc.. You cannot exepect them to simply produce album after album. There is absolutely no problem with the song writing on MOP; it is infact superb.
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