bob clearmountain/cla/tla/aw

[Mikaël-ange]

Some of my friends had a record mixed by Ben Grosse and it sound HUUUUUGE. He's way underrated.

I love Ben Grosse work!!! If you have anything to share?

Btw for don't be OT, you can still post here

 

[aramism]

loooove the part in mix about how bruce springstein influenced his mixing...

What did you learn from Springsteen?

He has a very clear vision of getting his point across, and he taught me that the song and its central character are always the most important. Everything in the mix needs to complement that. Most of Bruce's songs are about someone's tribulations or joys of life. The connection between the character — as portrayed by the singer — and the listener can never be broken. Everything needs to add to the connection and not take away from it. From a mixing standpoint, that means you have to connect with the song first before you even start.

How do you do that?

Usually, it's by listening to the vocal. I'll put up a rough and listen to the vocal, then go through and solo things to see what the contribution of each instrument or vocal is. It's kind of like a play or a movie: Each instrument is a character. The main character is the lead vocal, the main subcharacters are the backing vocals and it goes on from there. In some songs, say some pop tunes or a dance record where the lyric isn't really about anything, it can be other things. If it's a dance record, then it's the groove that's got to come through and nothing else can get in the way of that.

soo true i wish more people thought like that, i know i do. reading this reaffirms this. i feel too many people try to just listen to sound and frequencies and make it sound cool or organized. i liketo listen to the message of the song as complex or basic and it is and build it around that. yeah bob


side note: bob uses apogees because of his wife but also because they are pretty much one of, if not the best on the whole planet.

 

[Mikaël-ange]

soo true i wish more people thought like that, i know i do. reading this reaffirms this. i feel too many people try to just listen to sound and frequencies and make it sound cool or organized. i liketo listen to the message of the song as complex or basic and it is and build it around that. yeah bob

I couldn't agree more.
What is the vocal point (isnt the vocal all the time btw), what emotion going one...etc. That what matter.

 

[Ermz]

I've worked on SSL's that were ultra modded 4000G+ with all the bell's and whistles that sounded shitty, and I've worked on god awfully maintained ones that sound awesome. It's really a total crap shoot, hence why I'd never ever buy one.

Wow, that's horrifying.

*hugs VCC*

 

[Charles J]

Wow, that's horrifying.

*hugs VCC*

LMFAO. i swear to everything, that's EXACTLY what I thought as well.

As these guys are legends in their own right.... kind of apples and oranges to me.....

So I'm assuming you're getting along well with VCC? I knew you would. =D

 

[Ermz]

Not entirely sure yet, CJ. It lacks the 'instant gratification' of the AlexB programs, but the effect on transients is way more pronounced. The whole thing is a lot more tactile, and dependent upon gain structuring. It feels like a saturator, whereas Nebula is more like a really pleasant EQ curve + 3dness injector. I have no idea which is more like a real desk.

Which one leads to better results.... well, hoping to find that out in a few days when this mix is done!

 

[Charles J]

for sure, dude. VCC is a very cumulative effect.

i've been using VCC for months on end now, and I've found you basically have to slap the channel plug on all your tracks and an instance of the mix plug on your 2BUSS from JUMP STREET. the reason being, as you know, to mix THROUGH it.

I don't mess with the drive knob at all usually on the channel plugs (where I use the input knob to get all my tracks hitting around 0dB or a little above on peaks). I'll use the drive knob on the 2BUSS sometimes but it really depends.

After you've finished a mix and bypass all instances of VCC, it's an instant 'WTF' moment. Not sure what it's doing but I love it and I can't ever mixing without it.

Nebula has always seemed cool to me and I was an early adopter but the GUI is too clumbsy and the plug itself isn't stable at ALL on my system, unlike VCC which always just 'works' and I can kind of set it and forget it....

a trim plug such as FreeG is essential when using VCC, though.... in my experience. actually, a basic trim plug is probably my most USED plugin out of everything I have. Some plugs just sound TERRIBLE if they're hit too hard either on the input or output.....

Hope it works out for you because it really is a fantastic tool.

My favorite thing about VCC, especially the most recent revision, is how DYNAMIC it is towards transients and the whole freq spectrum...

the beta didn't really have that yet, whilst still sounding fantastic, Steven and Fabrices' newest version sounds fantastic to my ears.

Not too sold on the RC-Tube yet like everyone else, I actually hate it on my 2BUSS but I haven't had the opportunity to mix through it from the start. I'm still stuck on the Neve for 2BUSS duties or the 4K if I'm looking for something to tame transients a bit more.....

 

[greyskull]

UGGGHHH bugger, I just bought Satson for this kinda thing as my old computer just couldnt handle an old mix full of VCC when i first demoed it!
Now I'm thinking I need to get involved!

 

[Superdatasatan]

for sure, dude. VCC is a very cumulative effect.

i've been using VCC for months on end now, and I've found you basically have to slap the channel plug on all your tracks and an instance of the mix plug on your 2BUSS from JUMP STREET. the reason being, as you know, to mix THROUGH it.

I don't mess with the drive knob at all usually on the channel plugs (where I use the input knob to get all my tracks hitting around 0dB or a little above on peaks). I'll use the drive knob on the 2BUSS sometimes but it really depends.

After you've finished a mix and bypass all instances of VCC, it's an instant 'WTF' moment. Not sure what it's doing but I love it and I can't ever mixing without it.

Nebula has always seemed cool to me and I was an early adopter but the GUI is too clumbsy and the plug itself isn't stable at ALL on my system, unlike VCC which always just 'works' and I can kind of set it and forget it....

a trim plug such as FreeG is essential when using VCC, though.... in my experience. actually, a basic trim plug is probably my most USED plugin out of everything I have. Some plugs just sound TERRIBLE if they're hit too hard either on the input or output.....

Hope it works out for you because it really is a fantastic tool.

My favorite thing about VCC, especially the most recent revision, is how DYNAMIC it is towards transients and the whole freq spectrum...

the beta didn't really have that yet, whilst still sounding fantastic, Steven and Fabrices' newest version sounds fantastic to my ears.

Not too sold on the RC-Tube yet like everyone else, I actually hate it on my 2BUSS but I haven't had the opportunity to mix through it from the start. I'm still stuck on the Neve for 2BUSS duties or the 4K if I'm looking for something to tame transients a bit more.....

big +1! CJ --> Was the new BTM also a VCC Neve mix? For some reason I've only been satisfied to mix with 4K on all channels & mixbuss.

 

[Ermz]

@CJ: The thing that bothers me is that keeping my tracks near '0VU' on VCC has me mixing quite a lot louder than normal. I know you can calibrate it... but I've got it set to -18dBFS, which is where I normally mix... It's to the point where my snares peak above -6dB on the master bus from time to time :s

 

[Ermz]

I can see why you use the Neve model on the master bus. Has a much more pronounced effect compared to the 4k, which feels like it almost does nothing.

I'm still mixing with these VCC models, but I dunno. Not sure I'm sold on them. I don't get the instant depth and analogue vibe I get with Nebula. It feels more like working ITB now, where everything is really separated and thin sounding, and I'm chasing the glue, whereas with Nebula the glue is already there, and I'm chasing the separation. I'm finding myself wanting to reach for the CLC programs so badly on certain busses, but have to show restraint.

Will stick in there, even just to make this blind A/B shoot-out happen.

 

[aramism]

even though this thread went on a tangent, fwiw, i tried the slate vcc and while it def has a presence to it as far as "wow you hear what its doing" nothing replaces actualy analog summing.


a lot of people really dismiss the "myth" of it by their own taste or scientific study but i shun the science of it and just listen to my own ears. i think it makes a huge difference vs ITB summing. its not something you can tell for a quick a/b like run it through here or run it through there. its something you dont fully understand unless you mix from the start with analog summing. again, to each his own, some people achieve great results using ITB but its not better or worse its just whatever floats your boat. i will say digital has gotten so good that it doesn't make it "less pro" or "less good" just has diff sound to it, and in the right hands and under the right circumstances it sounds awesome in its own right. however once i started otb i could not go back.

ermz as you say one gives you glue another gives you separation, great analog units give you a good balance of both. it also allows you to slam levels into it and produce nice slight compression and eq funky business.

so the argument boils down to taste not good or bad.