define the genre "metal"...

[Blitzkrieg]

I'm in the middle of an online, message board arguement about "metal" as a genre, and I need you guys input on how to define "metal".

I absolutely blasted a guy for saying "metal is just heavy punk" in reply to my saying "you ppl don't even know what metal is", but then I thought to myself, what am I gonna say when they ask me to define it!

I need help! ARGH!
All input welcome.

 

[phlogiston]

Oooohhh, you're in trouble now. I don't know, but I'll contribute what I can.

It's more technical and melodic than punk. Punk has three or four chords, and no time changes. Metal (generally) has more.

The attitude is different. Punk is "I hate everthing and everyone, and everyone hates me". Metal is more along the lines of "We hate most things, but we all get along fairly well after that". Both are agressive, Punk edges Metal in terms of "total" attitude, but Metal sounds tougher.

But as far as _what_ metal is, apart from heavy guitars and reasonably complex songs, then your guess is as good as mine.

 

[9mm]

... and don't forget the guitar solos.

 

[TRrEiTxIxRiE DTrash]

Punk/Hardcore:
Anti-social "angry" type attitude, lyrics with a social commentary (usually anti-establishment), guitars are just a wall of noise behind the vocals, the vocals are nasal or angry screaming in hardcore punk, and punk bands are against the whole over-the-top rock n roll thing and claim to be more about musical integrity.

Heavy Metal:
Escapist attitude (rock n roll spirit in 80s metal), lyrics are about fantasy/escapism, guitars are the highlight of the music with songs being driven by catchy riffs, guitar solos being a standout aspect of the songs, vocals melodic and powerful except in the extreme styles, image usually important with hair/leather/etc.. being a big part of metal, big rock n roll stage shows (when the bands are big enough to afford it).

Of course there are exceptions, for instance thrash metal usually has socially conscious lyrics and aggressive screamed vocals, however thrash metal actually is known to be a hybrid of heavy metal and hardcore punk (Metallica, Slayer, Anthrax and Megadeth are all big fans of early punk).

Oh, and also the comparison between metal and punk also helps my argument that "nu-metal" isn't metal too, because every aspect of nu-metal is exactly the same as hardcore punk, it just has a few hip hop (vocals, bass, drums) and metal influences (heaviness in the guitar) mixed in.

 

[Mark]

Metal is whatever you want it to be

I'm so Snoopy sometimes!

 

[Southy]

to a main part i reckon its actually in the eye of the beholder

 

[duellist]

Metal is just Punk for people who have more time....
or to quote Billy Joel - "It's all rock and roll to me!"

 

[spanner]

I agree for without punk or rock there would be no metal.

 

[phlogiston]

:glug:

 

[spawn]

Just tell them to listen to Painkiller. Thats heavy metal pretty much defined.

 

[Icarus]

metal is also tight black jeans a leather jacket and white hi tops

 

[Lord Tim]

metal is also tight black jeans a leather jacket and white hi tops

YES!!!!!

 

[Goreripper]

I think Trent pretty much summed it up. "Metal" is hard to define. It's not punk and it's not exactly rock. But then, thrash can come close to punk sometimes, and prog metal is pretty close to prog rock but heavied up a bit (and sometimes not that much). "Nu-metal" is, as Trent said, hardcore mixed with metal and hip hop, but not really any of them. The definition between "metal" and "rock" became blurred in the 80s when the media started calling bands like Bon Jovi and Poison metal, and they've become blurred again now that they're calling bands like Soulfly and SOAD metal because they don't know what else to call them. "Metal" is pretty much open to your own interpretation, far more than it is for most of the other sub-genres.

 

[Morticia]

Metal to me is such bands as Iron Maiden, Twisted Sister etc. 80's metal differs greatly as to what is descrived as metal in today's genre.....if you cannot appreciate the original metal artists then you really can't call today's heavy rock....metal....... yes it is in the eye of the beholder but 80's metal has defined and influenced a lot of today's bands.

I like a lot of the hard rock that is coming out at the moment, but nothing compares to the 80's rock that has been produced by Alice Cooper, Rob Zombie, Iron Maiden, Twisted Sister, Judas Priest, AC/DC, Bon Jovi, Aerosmith, Ozzy Osbourne, Metallica, Guns N Roses, Kiss etc. Some of the ballads and rock songs they have produced are awesome and the musical talent that all the members involved in these bands have displayed would be hard to match by any modern artists........it's just a matter of the ignoramuses sitting down and listening to some really good honest rock music and appreciating the talent involved in producing such classic rock......if they can't appreciate the origins of this type of music - then I woulnd't waste your breath.

 

[TRrEiTxIxRiE DTrash]

Look who's back!!

 

[KoichCPA]

the musical talent that all the members involved in these bands have displayed would be hard to match by any modern artists.

You have no idea.

 

[TRrEiTxIxRiE DTrash]

I think she has a good idea.

 

[KoichCPA]

How Trent?

considering musicians these days have more talent and technical ability from a younger age how she has a good idea?

Tell me how newer musicians build on the techniques used by older musicians and create new techniques the older musicians didn't have?

Tell me about when people learn songs, they learn to play these old songs first before writing their own material.

Musicians these days are exponentially better than the previous generation of musicians, as will the generation after this current be better than their predecessor.

Fucking hell Trent, you are a cool guy, but you need stop being such a bias fuckwit and wake up to yourself.

 

[Goreripper]

I think I have to side with Josh on this one Trent. Chrissy's made a pretty big call by saying that the musical talent of bands like Kiss and Twisted Sister couldn't be matched by today's artists. Just because you don't prefer their music, doesn't mean they're not talented.

 

[TRrEiTxIxRiE DTrash]

I didn't say that. I said I think she has an idea of what she's talking about. I know where she's coming from...

And I'm not talking about musical talent in terms of technique because of course modern bands have better technique than older ones. But when it comes to songwriting I think it isn't as good as it used to be, and songwriting is the most important skill in music.