EQ issues...never enough treble...help?

[bryan_kilco]

Starting some home pre-production at the practice space and I've noticed I have a problem with treble in my recordings.

Maybe its my preamp? (Fast Track Pro) but the mics I'm using are decent (Shure drum mic kit).

Anyway, I have a hard time getting enough treble in certain elements of my mix. The other day I mic'd up the kick drum (I think a Beta 52?) and a CO2 condensor over the snare/cymbals/toms, since I only have 2 inputs on the interface. I did this setup for the sole purpose of recording rough drums to create click tracks to. Now, I find that the kicks never seem to have enough high end in them. Right now he doesnt have a pad on the batter head so maybe that is where part of the problem comes from? The vocals I record also seem to have this issue. I feel like I am cranking WAY too much treble in the EQ to get vox and kicks to cut right.

Our room isnt the best. We insulated with sound control insulation and we use some eggcrate foam for make-shit vocal/guitar booths. But I still feel that there's a bunch of attack missing in these elements.

Any words of wisdom? Thanks.

 

[MF_Kitten]

i´ve had the same problem, but i figured it out! it´s not about how much treble you put in there, it´s about which part of the treble area you accentuate.

how are you raising the treble? a bump in one area, or a high shelf filter?

try making the kick high end focus onto one area. maybe even lower what´s before and after it. you can also do a high shelf boost until you can hear it in the mix, then start lowering the unwanted frequencies (you might get some "clackyness" in there, and some tinny slappyness in the really really high frequencies when doing this).

the same goes for vox. accentuate specific areas to focus on. be more specific about where the high end should be.

 

[timislegend]

with the drums... try some parallel compression. then apply an eq to boost the higher frequencies to the compressed drums.

fast track pro converters are not high quality so you will experience time smearing artifacts in the passband... as well as dull unpolished higher frequencies.

there isn't a whole lot you can do with regards to "quality" improvement. if you own gear that is the lesser of "quality" ...in theory you will end up with lower quality digital audio.

i am not trying to come off as inconsiderate. i am just saying that "you get what you pay for." (which is the obvious statement).

 

[SafeandSoundMastering]

Where you put the mic in the kick drum will dictate to some degree how much mid frequencies or attack
the sound will have. Kick drums in a mix normally have a rather radical EQ curve. The Beta 52 hs not got much going on above 4kHz

http://www.recordingeq.com/EQ/req1001/beta52.html

So you want to use some eq to get what you need, get close to the head to get strong attack and less
sub, for a balance put the mic midway between heads (you need a cut out on the front head)

The Audix D6 has a great metal curve built into the mics response IMO

I find myself pushing 6.5kHz in a kick (especially for metal genres) to get some attack if it's missing always bear in mind
EQ changes phase relationships in a mix and this can smear transients.

Do not be afraid of the radical EQ curve on kick either this or get a different mic that works.

MD421 works well too, it's actually my kick mic of choice you have to EQ the sub in (or mic outside with a LDC) but what is there
on a good quality/well tuned kick is very useable.

 

[SafeandSoundMastering]

so you will experience time smearing artifacts in the passband... as well as dull unpolished higher frequencies.

There will be plenty of that in the voltage that exits the Beta 52 !

As far as kick mics go it has the lowest hf content of any I know.

 

[timislegend]

There will be plenty of that in the voltage that exits the Beta 52 !

As far as kick mics go it has the lowest hf content of any I know.

i was referring to the a/d conversion with regards to the severity in the lpf slope... the fast track pro converters can cause massive rippling and time-smearing even if the mic is a condenser with which voltage is provided by the interface/computer.

you are certainly correct about the hf content... i think it's 20Hz - 10kHz

(which is absurd) even the akg d12 went as far as 12kHz!


it is a well known/well used kick mic (by all means).

 

[bryan_kilco]

thanks guys!!

timislegend: do you mean parallel compress the entire drum mix or just the kicks? I have experimented with parallel comp on drums before, but I am still pretty much a newb.

 

[timislegend]

thanks guys!!

timislegend: do you mean parallel compress the entire drum mix or just the kicks? I have experimented with parallel comp on drums before, but I am still pretty much a newb.

yes. the whole kit...

 

[BLUElightCory]

Does the actual kick drum have sufficient high end? Is it tuned properly, are you using a hard beater, is it being played hard enough?

Are you comparing the natural kick to CDs that have heavily sampled, aggressively EQ'd kick drums? Most natural kicks will seem like they lack presence if you compare them to finished mixes.

As far as the vocals, the lack of high end could be the mic, mic placement, pre, converters...take your pick. It's hard to tell without knowing more about the setup.

 

[darthjujuu]

you can get spank from a beta52 but it's definitely not the best choice if that's what you're looking for... D6, for sure. try a 57 in the kick instead (or both), harveys been doing just a 57 lately with delightful results.

 

[musikman1]

If you're having to add a shitload of treble and it's not cutting enough then start rolling off the bass frequencies. This could be the result from a room mode problem going on. IMO. "Egg Crate" kills way too many highs leaving you nothing but overpowered low frequencies. So maybe if cutting the lows out doesn't work, I'd start taking down the egg crate.

Try a different mic position as well, like the one SafeSound mentioned. It's a really good position.

But just as Corey said, it could be a handful of problems. You're just going to have to do some Trial and Error test.

 

[Omega_Void]

Possibility: are your cables shit?

When I started out I'd blow a stack of money on a piece of gear, and then I'd be skint so I'd buy real cheap cables to connect it. This was a great recipe for mud.

Cheap cables eat top end because there is too much capacitance between the signal conductor(s) and the ground conductor, which acts as the reactive element in a parasitic passive low-pass filter. You can't really get it back with eq 'cos you're bringing up the noise as well,so the top end winds up full of crap.

The longer the cable, the worse the problem. I have a cheap 6-inch Viper patch cable which sucks off so much top end it's not even funny, and a 20-foot Whirlwind which sounds fine. The difference isn't subtle.

Just a possibility.