First attempt at "clayman" technique

A

ab

New Metal Member
Jan 31, 2009
16
0
1
Hi,

I discovered this site a few days ago and found the clayman sticky post to be very interesting.

I'm also a newbie to recording, and for your critique, I've posted my first attempt (called "test") using the "clayman" mic technique....

www.myspace.com/qwerty01qwerty01

Unfortunately I don't have the kind of equipment described in the clayman article (and I'm not able to afford it any time soon either (Wife...Kids...Mortgage yaday yada). So the equipment that I've used is...

Seymour Duncan Custom pickup
USA Jackson Rhodes
Digitech Metal Master
Marshall JCM 800
Marshall 1960B Quad loaded with 4 English Celestian G12T-75's
2 Shure SM57's
M-Audio Fast Track Pro

The track only last for 16 seconds and I'm just chugging in C#. I'm just after some feedback on how I can improve the sound (of the guitars). There seems to be this (I think) low midrange hum thats quite annoying. If necessary I can provide more detail on the setup.

I've also uploaded a complete track (1099) of one of my first efforts at recording to give some sort of indication of the style of our band...
Similar equipment was used for this track except for a Randall RX120D head and the mics were not in the "clayman" position.

Ultimately someone else is going to mix and master the recordings but I would like to create the best raw material that I can.

Cheers,
 
Honestly, I didn't even know that was a guitar :OMG:

I would suggest working with one mic, really start trying to understand phase and then move on to two.

Since your fast-track pro doesn't have a phase reverse button, I couldn't recommend the white-noise mic placement technique to you.

Essentially, both mics need to be exactly the same difference from the source (when you're working SO close) to achieve an "in phase" and full sound.

Even a millimeter or two can make a huge difference. See if you can get someone to play guitar for you while you do this:

Place the first "clayman" technique mic, get it to sound good.

Next, hit record and monitor through some nice headphones that have good isolation. Start placing your second mic (be sure to record the first and second mics together now) and move the microphone INCREMENTALLY and SLOWLY until the two mics sound great together.
This isn't gonna be something that takes a few seconds, it make take days to get perfect.

Good luck.

-Greg
 
guys I think there must be something wrong with the myspace player. don't really think this was made by intention, cause the other song sounds much better!
really sorry if it was though!
 
it sounds like a fucking old car trying to start :lol:

It's a joke or something? :zombie:
 
ab said:
Hi,

I discovered this site a few days ago and found the clayman sticky post to be very interesting.

I'm also a newbie to recording, and for your critique, I've posted my first attempt (called "test") using the "clayman" mic technique....

www.myspace.com/qwerty01qwerty01

Unfortunately I don't have the kind of equipment described in the clayman article (and I'm not able to afford it any time soon either (Wife...Kids...Mortgage yaday yada). So the equipment that I've used is...

Seymour Duncan Custom pickup
USA Jackson Rhodes
Digitech Metal Master
Marshall JCM 800
Marshall 1960B Quad loaded with 4 English Celestian G12T-75's
2 Shure SM57's
M-Audio Fast Track Pro

The track only last for 16 seconds and I'm just chugging in C#. I'm just after some feedback on how I can improve the sound (of the guitars). There seems to be this (I think) low midrange hum thats quite annoying. If necessary I can provide more detail on the setup.

I've also uploaded a complete track (1099) of one of my first efforts at recording to give some sort of indication of the style of our band...
Similar equipment was used for this track except for a Randall RX120D head and the mics were not in the "clayman" position.

Ultimately someone else is going to mix and master the recordings but I would like to create the best raw material that I can.

Cheers,
Click to expand...

love it! can i use this for a fear factory style industrial sort of intro?
 
hoehlentroll said:
what about that strange cymbalish sound in the background?
Click to expand...

That made me think also that the song has been uploaded wrong. I think it's a loop of the first second going on and on...

love it! can i use this for a fear factory style industrial sort of intro?
Click to expand...

Actually the sound could fit perfectly in that style :kickass:

Let's see if the mistery is solved!
 
Hi again,

Yes, the "test" track that sounds like an old car starting is simply a short passage that I've looped. Trying to make it sound like anything meaningful was the least of my concern - rather I'm after advice on the most fundamental problems with the guitar tone so that I can start to zero in on a decent sound for the material that I'll ultimately release. As the bugs are ironed out I'll record passages with more variation so that the subtleties of the sound can be critiqued.

The actually song that I've uploaded (1099) is a rough recording of one of the tracks that I'll be releasing. This should give you some idea of the style that I'll be recording. Hopefully then I can also get some perspective on things I should consider to bring my material to life...

Anyway, thanks for the advice Greg - I'll take onboard your suggestions and try them out this weekend. If I make some progress I'll post it - hopefully I can at least get a grip on the phasing problem by then...
 
I've had a bit more of a tinker and using a single sm57 I tried all of the speakers on the cabinet. Three of them sounded very similar - harsh and gritty. I thought the speaker on the top left had the best sound although it swings the other way - being more muffled.

So I placed the mic about half an inch from the grill and found the best place to be just off center of the dust cap on the top left speaker.

I've uploaded another raw test recording which is a just the guitar on it's own. It's called test2_single_sm57...

www.myspace.com/qwerty01qwerty01
 
Roomy. That's the word I'd use to describe it too.

The room that I'm recording in is 10' x 10' x 7' with plasterboard walls.

In terms of volume...hard to describe... I'd say it's moderate

What would your suggestion be to start overcoming the roomy sound?

I'll also do a test recording to compare the speakers and upload it tomorrow.
 
Crank the amp up pretty good. It should be somewhat uncomfortable to listen to in the room without earplugs. You'll get more cab involvement in the tone that way too.
 
Do you have the option to record in another room that isn't so square. Acoustics in square rooms are never great and in my experience recording in a small room gives a roomy sounding recording. If you don't have the option to record in another room try putting something absorptive around the front of the cab that should help cut down on the roomy sound.
 
Thanks for the suggestions.

I cranked the amp harder this time...

I recorded in a larger room 13' x 20' x 7' (still square but one of the walls is mostly taken up by to large archways...so I set the cab up on an angle in the corner and aimed it toward the archways (thats the most unsymetrical feature of the house). For good measure I also added some sound dampening around the cab.


All tests have single SM57 just off center of the dust cap of 1960B cab with english G12t-75 celestian speakers. The tests for each amp retains the same settings (slightly reconfigured for the randall). In each case I tried to keep the gain to a minimum as well as the lower end.

So the sample has 4 tests each separated by a brief pause....

1. marshall jcm800 top left
2. marshall jcm800 top right
3. randall rx120d top left
4. randall rx120d top right

Here's the link...

www.myspace.com/qwerty01qwerty01

I could have tamed the grit on the "top right" tests but wanted to show a comparison between the speakers for each amp. Which one is the best to try and work with from here?

BTW. There is a chance that a friend of mine can lend me a 5150 with a v30 cab in a few weeks, but at this stage I'll assume the worst and keep plugging away with my current setup...at the very least I'm learning...
 
Why do the first and third chugs sound so much different? The other two are probably what you're aiming for, but there's no way to comment without hearing it in a mix or at least more than just some palm mutes.
 
Thanks for responding so quick.

Why are they different...beats me. I've never had the opportunity to compare with anything else. I found the top left speaker (despite the roominess effect) to have this nice metallic zing whereas the other speaker on the top right definitely has more presence and seems to leap out of the speaker.
Most of my recording efforts have involved the top left speaker (the 2 tracks on the myspace player for example) However, given your comment on the other two I will try and get a sound with the randall and mic on the top right speaker. I'll also record something more elaborate to get a better sense of the overall sound. Hopefully I can upload that in a couple of days time...

Thanks again for your help and I'll post again soon.
 
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