Gunther Grass

speed

Member
Nov 19, 2001
5,192
26
48
Visit site
Mr. Grass--a German noble prize winner in literature, with two really good books The Rat and The Tin Drum, and a host of well-written but mediocre moralizing others--revealed he was a member of the SS as a teenager growing up in Danzig (now Gdansk--a lovely city that I've visited). The Poles are demanding he give up his honorary polish citizenship, writers and critics around the world say his image is now eternally tarnished, and his books will no longer carry any of the moral weight they used to. For anyone that didnt know, Mr. Grass wrote much of his work on or about Nazi Germany. In addition, Mr. Grass has a new book coming out this October, about his adolescence in Nazi Germany.

I would like to get everyones opinion on this issue, as it involves an internationally known and recognized great in late 20th century literature.

Is Mr. Grass a hypocrite for spending his life and art, creating works that denounced Nazi Germany? Is the stain of being apprently drafted into the SS, and being connected with Nazi Germany, so great, that even a lifetime of work trying to change ones past is not good enough--is there no forgiveness for Nazis? And thus, are those attacking Mr. Grass, hypocrites themselves? And finally, is this merely a publicity ploy by Mr. Grass to sell his next book?
 
A German youth in the 1940's in the German military:OMG:
Yeah, a big shocker.

He was drafted into the "SS" which is a boogeyman for the ignorant. The SS at the time possesed a large fighting unit (Waffen-SS) and was not limited to running the camps, or security detail for leadership. His actions and experience in the Waffen-SS would have been no different that any other typical soldier. In the BBC article it also stated that he was rejected from the Submarine force, and then drafted into the Waffen-SS.

The interesting issue here is not Gunther Grass, but social/political memory and the world it creates.
 
Justin S. said:
A German youth in the 1940's in the German military:OMG:
Yeah, a big shocker.

He was drafted into the "SS" which is a boogeyman for the ignorant. The SS at the time possesed a large fighting unit (Waffen-SS) and was not limited to running the camps, or security detail for leadership. His actions and experience in the Waffen-SS would have been no different that any other typical soldier. In the BBC article it also stated that he was rejected from the Submarine force, and then drafted into the Waffen-SS.

The interesting issue here is not Gunther Grass, but social/political memory and the world it creates.

It is beyond Gunther Grass; but, if a nation (germany) has been forgiven, shouldnt Mr. Grass? I'm shocked that many are now calling for Mr. Grass to give up his Nobel Prize. If they were born in Germany at the same time, they would have faced the same circumstances as Mr. Grass. Furthermore, it is obvious why Mr. Grass kept the secret to himself all of these years, as I think the international community wouldnt have accepted him as they did; there always would've been that nagging feeling he was a Nazi, thus, can we really take him seriously?

And I am in no way implicitly supporting the nazis here--I think most on this board know this--I just find it ridiculous that a person who was drafted by his erstwhile country at the time, and sent into the military wing of the SS without his input, should not be treated all the sudden as a pariah. Its quite the double standard.
 
Here in Britain our government is overflowing with ex- Communist Party members
http://www.eurabiantimes.com/archives/2004/11/new_labour_exco.php

And as Communism was/is even more brutal and murderous than anything "Nazis" have ever done this shows up the double standards even more. Can you imagine ex "Nazis" being in a mainstream political party without substantial media outrage? Gunther Grass' treatment is an indication of the situation.
 
Norsemaiden said:
Here in Britain our government is overflowing with ex- Communist Party members
http://www.eurabiantimes.com/archives/2004/11/new_labour_exco.php

And as Communism was/is even more brutal and murderous than anything "Nazis" have ever done this shows up the double standards even more. Can you imagine ex "Nazis" being in a mainstream political party without substantial media outrage? Gunther Grass' treatment is an indication of the situation.

Well, you know a dirty little secret is that in Italy, most who were in power post WWII, were in fact fascists, and Germany I know, had more than its fair share take places of political power and influence. In fact, America has acitively supported a number of fascists, or fascist dictators from Somoza, to Pinochet, Pappadopoulos, Trujillo, a whole host of Africans; the list goes on.

So I think its the Nazi nature of the problem--not fascism. Nazi's have been villified as the monsters of all history. Should they deserve this place? Maybe. Personally I think Stalin was much more of a monster in this century, and Pol Pot in sheer hatred and brutality in such a small backwards and agrarian country, probably tops them all.