How to Mix in Bass without affecting individual notes?

[Seizure.]

I've been having a problem:

My bass and kick are somewhat colliding around 60/100 hz.

I can't EQ alot under 200/180 hz, because if i do, some notes will fall flat (atleast in my latest observations)
And Multiband compression doesn't help enough to seperate them as much as i would like.

Because i want every note to come out evenly loud, a good example of this can be heard on unearth's the oncoming storm, on a track like Zombie auto pilot.

Puuuuuurrrrrfect bass sound IMO

and the kick seems live happily next to it.

So the question is: how do i make the basssound big, clear and not disturbing other pieces in the mix without severly scooping it and thereby affection tonality?

Any feedback and experiences apreciated, because this has been bugging me for a while!!

Thanks in advance!!

 

[Torniojaws]

From what I've heard and read, the balls of a song are either in the bass guitar or the kick drum, never both.

Dunno how this helps your situation though

 

[Seizure.]

I see your point and it does help 1 issue abit, but that still leaves my tonality problem ya know?

 

[Noumenon]

tried ducking the bass when the kick is hit?

 

[chadsxe]

tried ducking the bass when the kick is hit?

set up a side-chain....

 

[Noumenon]

my point exactly

 

[~BURNY~]

Also make shure room modes aren't involved in your problems.

 

[KeithRT99]

can someone explain sidechains to me?

it seems like the majority of the low frequencies are from the bass in that unearth song, but it's not a drastic difference is bassiness from the kick.

 

[Mendel]

maybe a little tip.
on hat unearth record you can hear the bassdrum really clearly but it isnt bassy ( this is in most mixes ) the baskick isnt mix so you can feel it. it's just there.

hope this helps.

 

[Noumenon]

can someone explain sidechains to me?

it seems like the majority of the low frequencies are from the bass in that unearth song, but it's not a drastic difference is bassiness from the kick.

well. the basic idea is that you slam a compressor on the bass track and you send the kick to the compressor's key input.

in cubase setup a group channel, send the bass to the group panned hard left. then send the kick to the hard right. put the Waves C1 on the group channel and then you set C1 up so that the right side is the key. what's coming out of the group channel is a bass that's being ducked

And yes, I'm a bit fluffy on the settings for C1, been a while.

 

[SickBoy]

Or if you happen to have TC Native Bundle, there's separate plugins for Key Input and Compressor, so you don't have to mess around with groups...

 

[Seizure.]

Fuck, side chaining... pretty simple solution, but should work perfectly!! thanks dudes!!
And yeah mendel i see your point, but there are parts in the songs were the lacking or masking of lows so to say wont be masked by the Lows of the bass and distorted guitar, makes it a bit tricky!!

Anyhoo, i'm out trying the side chaining right know, and i'll be back with results if it'll work (and i'm pretty sure it will )

 

[Noumenon]

Sick. sweet! gate too?

 

[madmuso]

Hi Seizure,

what you are encountering is very common. Here area few things I try which seem to help.

When Im setting up a bass sound for tracking I dont usualy listen to the bass
gtr, (I do but I dont) I pay more attention to the kick drum while setting my preamp,eq,etc, for the bass.
I know this may seem strange but theres a reason, usualy if a bass gtr sounds big, huge,thumping and pounding on its own then it usualy doesnt work once in the mix. Often, the bass sound we think wont work actualy does. The minute the kick drum starts to change (for the worse) I start eq'ing my bass all over again, I start from scratch. I dont hit record until I am happy with a bass sound that hasnt affected the kick in a bad way, it may take a while but it saves a lot of pissfarting around later. I notice that when I use the above method, im listening to the bass in relation to the whole track and energy of the track rather than just focusing on the bass by itself.

Also, during mixing, if I find that the bass gtr and kick are masking each other
I solo the bass gtr and kick channels, raise the bass gtr to a good level, lower the kick fader so its around half the level or so, then I start eq'ing the bass gtr while listening to the kick, you will find that while eq'ing the bass gtr in this manner, the kick drum will expose itself in particular areas, or just start to sound better, these are the spots you wanna make a note of.

hope this helps,

madmuso

 

[stringyo]

Holy hell, I always wondered exactly what sidechaining was. I just messed around with the C1 on some kick and bass tracks and it's pretty damned cool.

My host program doesn't have a "sum-stereo-to-mono" feature on the busses, so it took some creative routing through two busses to get the bass track into mono up the center again.

Thanks for the tips guys. From my little bit of experimenting I don't know if sidechaining during heavy double kick work will fly...but it'll definitely help during slower groovy stuff.

 

[Noumenon]

In cubase you can choose to pan each side how you want. So I panned the left side on the group channel to the middle

 

[stringyo]

In cubase you can choose to pan each side how you want. So I panned the left side on the group channel to the middle

Yeah, see I don't have that handly little feature. It would have been nice, fucking people at Cakewalk!!!

 

[Where She Wept]

what ever happened to using your ears? try a boost/ cut scheme. boost the bass gtr by 3db around 300hz and cut the same freq on the kick by about 3 db. the 300hz range will give a little definition to the bass.


http://www.homerecordingconnection.com/news.php?action=view_story&id=154