Loud and punchy drums ?

Tom-D

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Jul 9, 2009
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Hi

Im struggling with making the drums loud and punchy in the mix.I have all the guitars, bass and such routed to a limiter.So I can make it as loud as I want with no clipping.But Im left with drums, and I dont know what to do to make them work on par with the rest of the music.Limiting is out of the question, because they are non existant afterwards.I have HP filters on most of the drums, they sound really good for me.But again, what to do to preserve this punch and crank up the db's ?
 
you leave out many details which is required for anyone to understand and give you tips of how to make things sound as wanting to explode out of the speaker.

Hp filter you say, at what freqs? It could be a load of possible scenarios making the drums sound bad, poor playing technique/bad drums/tuning/mics/room is probably the first things to look at, if thats the case, trigging is the easiest way to go to get them sound workable.

Good sounding/mixed drums will be able to handle a lot of limiting to bring up attitude/volume, if it sounds bad when limited, then the drums are bad in any of the earlier stages.

as suggested, give us a clip, and we could give you more tips.
 
One of the first steps before you start experimenting with clipping and such is to make space for the drums. Find a good, healthy frequency balance. Make sure the snare attack and body frequencies aren't too masked by other instruments, decide which low frequency range you want reserved for the kick and which for the bass and so on. If you have everything happening everywhere, you're in mud city and nothing sounds punchy or clear.

Example situation:
You crafted a nice drum sound. Your snare has some nice attack at around 5-6kHz, some upper-end snap at 8kHz and some pretty huge body at 200Hz. Your kick has a fat OOMPH at around 80Hz and some nasty, wet click at 8kHz. Shit sounds awesome when you solo the drum groups. However, when you bring up the rest of the instruments, all you hear is the snare's high frequency snap and the kick's clickyness with some uncontrolled bass frequency rumble.

Here's what might've happened:
You have a shit-ton of presence going on in the guitars in the snare's attack area. The bass guitar has lots of 200Hz in there, and the guitar's palm mutes have a nasty peak at the same area. Also, you have boosted the bass at 80Hz to give it that full, round, bassy tone and went overboard with it. It's taking away from the kick's low frequency power and making things a mess down there.

How to approach fixing it:
Decide what you consider the main, important elements for the instruments. You love the snare sound, so you want to keep it that way. Cool. Sweep around with an EQ to find where the key frequencies of the snare are. When you find them, start sculpting some room for them in the other instruments. Try to find a way to cut the guitars a bit around the same regions to make way for the snare. You have to use your ears here. If you feel it ruins the guitar tone, you need to make a different decision. The changes don't have to be drastic. Try to find the right frequency balance where things just kinda snap together, cut through and sound like a whole, full mix. One thing you might want to try (IF you just can't get the right results with EQ) is taming the guitars' 200Hz boom with a multiband comp. It doesn't need to be C4. You can even use a single band compressor with HP/LP sidechaining perfectly fine. All right, what about the kick, then? Consider dividing the low end a bit. You really like the bass tone you have going, so start from there. Try to find a better frequency for the kick's low end power. For an example, you might find a nice balance when focusing the bass on the 70-80Hz area and the kick around the 100-120Hz area, cutting them both to make room for the other.

Now, don't take these as magic numbers or anything. I pulled them out of thin air, so they might be totally off in your case. Experiment, listen, and learn to make the right decisions. It's a never-ending learning process. But at least it's fun :)
 
One of the first steps before you start experimenting with clipping and such is to make space for the drums. Find a good, healthy frequency balance. Make sure the snare attack and body frequencies aren't too masked by other instruments, decide which low frequency range you want reserved for the kick and which for the bass and so on. If you have everything happening everywhere, you're in mud city and nothing sounds punchy or clear.

Example situation:
You crafted a nice drum sound. Your snare has some nice attack at around 5-6kHz, some upper-end snap at 8kHz and some pretty huge body at 200Hz. Your kick has a fat OOMPH at around 80Hz and some nasty, wet click at 8kHz. Shit sounds awesome when you solo the drum groups. However, when you bring up the rest of the instruments, all you hear is the snare's high frequency snap and the kick's clickyness with some uncontrolled bass frequency rumble.

Here's what might've happened:
You have a shit-ton of presence going on in the guitars in the snare's attack area. The bass guitar has lots of 200Hz in there, and the guitar's palm mutes have a nasty peak at the same area. Also, you have boosted the bass at 80Hz to give it that full, round, bassy tone and went overboard with it. It's taking away from the kick's low frequency power and making things a mess down there.

How to approach fixing it:
Decide what you consider the main, important elements for the instruments. You love the snare sound, so you want to keep it that way. Cool. Sweep around with an EQ to find where the key frequencies of the snare are. When you find them, start sculpting some room for them in the other instruments. Try to find a way to cut the guitars a bit around the same regions to make way for the snare. You have to use your ears here. If you feel it ruins the guitar tone, you need to make a different decision. The changes don't have to be drastic. Try to find the right frequency balance where things just kinda snap together, cut through and sound like a whole, full mix. One thing you might want to try (IF you just can't get the right results with EQ) is taming the guitars' 200Hz boom with a multiband comp. It doesn't need to be C4. You can even use a single band compressor with HP/LP sidechaining perfectly fine. All right, what about the kick, then? Consider dividing the low end a bit. You really like the bass tone you have going, so start from there. Try to find a better frequency for the kick's low end power. For an example, you might find a nice balance when focusing the bass on the 70-80Hz area and the kick around the 100-120Hz area, cutting them both to make room for the other.

Now, don't take these as magic numbers or anything. I pulled them out of thin air, so they might be totally off in your case. Experiment, listen, and learn to make the right decisions. It's a never-ending learning process. But at least it's fun :)

This... and we'll need your first born. It's procedure.
 
One of the first steps before you start experimenting with clipping and such is to make space for the drums. Find a good, healthy frequency balance. Make sure the snare attack and body frequencies aren't too masked by other instruments, decide which low frequency range you want reserved for the kick and which for the bass and so on. If you have everything happening everywhere, you're in mud city and nothing sounds punchy or clear.

Example situation:
You crafted a nice drum sound. Your snare has some nice attack at around 5-6kHz, some upper-end snap at 8kHz and some pretty huge body at 200Hz. Your kick has a fat OOMPH at around 80Hz and some nasty, wet click at 8kHz. Shit sounds awesome when you solo the drum groups. However, when you bring up the rest of the instruments, all you hear is the snare's high frequency snap and the kick's clickyness with some uncontrolled bass frequency rumble.

Here's what might've happened:
You have a shit-ton of presence going on in the guitars in the snare's attack area. The bass guitar has lots of 200Hz in there, and the guitar's palm mutes have a nasty peak at the same area. Also, you have boosted the bass at 80Hz to give it that full, round, bassy tone and went overboard with it. It's taking away from the kick's low frequency power and making things a mess down there.

How to approach fixing it:
Decide what you consider the main, important elements for the instruments. You love the snare sound, so you want to keep it that way. Cool. Sweep around with an EQ to find where the key frequencies of the snare are. When you find them, start sculpting some room for them in the other instruments. Try to find a way to cut the guitars a bit around the same regions to make way for the snare. You have to use your ears here. If you feel it ruins the guitar tone, you need to make a different decision. The changes don't have to be drastic. Try to find the right frequency balance where things just kinda snap together, cut through and sound like a whole, full mix. One thing you might want to try (IF you just can't get the right results with EQ) is taming the guitars' 200Hz boom with a multiband comp. It doesn't need to be C4. You can even use a single band compressor with HP/LP sidechaining perfectly fine. All right, what about the kick, then? Consider dividing the low end a bit. You really like the bass tone you have going, so start from there. Try to find a better frequency for the kick's low end power. For an example, you might find a nice balance when focusing the bass on the 70-80Hz area and the kick around the 100-120Hz area, cutting them both to make room for the other.

Now, don't take these as magic numbers or anything. I pulled them out of thin air, so they might be totally off in your case. Experiment, listen, and learn to make the right decisions. It's a never-ending learning process. But at least it's fun :)

This is pretty much how you mix. But most of us pull it out of our arses, rather than thin air.

Hey Tom-D, you know anything about sidechaining and parallel compression?