Loudness Maximization?

[arv_foh]

Personally I hate clippers on the master bus. It has always sounded like ass when I've tried it, like if there is a spot where the guitars ring out with nothing else playing it definitely creates audible distortion. I hear it a lot on label release albums (the guitar issue) and it bugs the living shin out of me.

 

[Therion_Prime]

Personally I hate clippers on the master bus. It has always sounded like ass when I've tried it, like if there is a spot where the guitars ring out with nothing else playing it definitely creates audible distortion. I hear it a lot on label release albums (the guitar issue) and it bugs the living shin out of me.

Then the clipper is set too agressive. I use clippers with mild settings on most tracks and two on the master bus -> no distortion

 

[Max Morton]

Personally I hate clippers on the master bus. It has always sounded like ass when I've tried it, like if there is a spot where the guitars ring out with nothing else playing it definitely creates audible distortion. I hear it a lot on label release albums (the guitar issue) and it bugs the living shin out of me.

Just check that nothing with big sustain, like vocals or guitars, or tom's low mid sustain tails, hit the clipper's threshold. Plus control the low mids and the clipper will be the most transparent thing to increase loudness.

 

[ttrentt]

Bump. Sorry. Are you guys still high passing your slate kicks around 110? That does seem to clean things up, but you lose the nice sonics of it. Anything to bump the low back up a little bit and still keep a decent master?

 

[waltz mastering]

Are you guys still high passing your slate kicks around 110?

Really ? People do that? Don't believe everything you read on the internets...

 

[arv_foh]

Bump. Sorry. Are you guys still high passing your slate kicks around 110? That does seem to clean things up, but you lose the nice sonics of it. Anything to bump the low back up a little bit and still keep a decent master?

Low shelf to knock off 5-10db depending on the sample. Not high passing anything, that's too steep of a rolloff

 

[amarshism]

i like the sub in the slate kicks

 

[ttrentt]

Really ? People do that? Don't believe everything you read on the internets...

I got my term incorrect, ment low shelf, but that comes straight from Slate.

 

[guitarguru777]

I still do

 

[Slate]

My kicks have sublow meant for medium tempo stuff... the faster the tempo, the more sublow needs to be knocked off so you don't muddy shit up. Just mixed a metal tune yesterday that was so fast I had to knock off 150Hz shelf down 5db. Sounds awesome though.

 

[guitarguru777]

See .. from the man himself

 

[Lasse Lammert]

I never reduced bass on the slate samples...then again I only used them for blending.
want bass in my bass drums

 

[guitarguru777]

Ya but you dont want SO much that it muds shit up. Kick 10 has that annoyance factor on the bottom end when its being played double bass anyything over 160 bpm imho. So cutting at around 100hz (for me personally) with a low shelf tends to really clean it up.

 

[slashvanyoung]

I never reduced bass on the slate samples...then again I only used them for blending.
want bass in my bass drums

Yeah, I can't stand bass drums that are pure click and no meat. That doesn't mean there shouldn't be cuts to avoid mud and to free up headroom though.

 

[ttrentt]

My kicks have sublow meant for medium tempo stuff... the faster the tempo, the more sublow needs to be knocked off so you don't muddy shit up. Just mixed a metal tune yesterday that was so fast I had to knock off 150Hz shelf down 5db. Sounds awesome though.

Thanks for the backup. I actually have a list of quotes from you about this subject...

Slate:
"Take the Black Kick and mix it with Kick5, drop down a low shelf under 100Hz and you have a seriously slammin metal kick...

I also like Panty Kick + a bit of Kick15 to the GClip to make it slam hard... Again, drop the sublow stuff.

You just have to think about frequency vs time.. the faster the song, the less sublow you need..

So I'd put an eq shelf at 100Hz.. start cutting 1db, 2db should usually do it. If you find yourself having to cut more then 3db, then its an issue somewhere else in the mix..

-try another sample
-for kicks, as it says right in the manual, adjust your low end
-turn the drums UP!!
-spike some more upper mids on the snare
-adjust your other instruments dynamically in the mix
-i'll say it again, watch the sub lows on the kicks, the faster the song, the more sub to knock off"

For Lassie: I actually dug up a quote form dave otero about this when I doing slate research in the forum...

"OTERO: Funny, I've only had the Slate pack for a little while now but I find myself using his kick samples specifically for that sub energy. Kick 10 > LPF around 200hz > comp with a short release > tuck in about 10db or so under another sample and love the luscious low end "

The point here its 10db below another kick. This is a great idea.

 

[BlackwingGabriel]

So over the past few months I have been kicking around the threads here about the subject and for some reason I am not getting it. Not getting it in the fact that my mixes never seem "loud enough" and Not getting in it terms of understanding how its done properly.

I think my main issue with mixing right now is really how to handle the Master bus. I have a fairly decent understanding of compression, multi band compressions, getting a good tone thats usable with guitars bass & drums but whenever I try to get my mixes loud it always winds up just a muddy mess.

I dont have the best plugins in the world, I have the Waves platinum bundle and Ozone but every time I try and use the Loudness Maximiser with either one the low end just gets unbelievable uncontrollable.

I know its not as simple as HEY DUDE DO THIS! and you will be golden, but any pointers on where to start on the master bus to begin to get things loud?

Any help would be appreciated.

Sorry, don't want to seem like an ass, but if you don't mind me asking, why would you want your mixes to sound 'loud'? Are you mixing and mastering in the same session? And how loud do you mean? (using dbrms/dbvu, for instance?)

Gabriel

 

[guitarguru777]

Its more the final mixes, I guess that was implied instead of stated

After getting a mix I am happy with they always wind up sitting at around -6 on the meters and they just dont seem to be the same volume as "professional" recordings. All the tips in the thread really helped and my mixes are getting "louder" and starting to match the pro stuff. Most around here call it the "loudness war"

 

[BlackwingGabriel]

I see.

What I think is, I'll leave the loudness thing to mastering engineers. Let them take the mix to 'pro level' volume. Or, if I have to master my own mix, I'll do it in a different session, with different perspective (mixing is always a right brain task, while mastering is a left brain task).