Metal philosophy..

[NovembersDirge]

Okay, as a sociologist I consider myself to be a social philosopher. So here's my question, which is based on a few suppositions and maybe an historical inaccuracy or two.. debate and decide.

Do you believe that heavy metal's focus on the individual lends itself towards American style conservatism (classical liberalism) throughout the world? Do you think that heavy metal, then, is really just an extension of American culture? Is this why heavy metal culture lends itself towards racism, sexism and homophobia?

Do you agree or disagree? Do you think that this is not a relevant question? I think this is a fascinating question and am very curious as to the views from inside the scene--as I have already built my own opinion about this. (BTW: I take the 'mature discussion' thing very seriously, I am not here to get into a prolonged fight with anyone and would rather the post be closed if it becomes problematic.)

 

[Vimana]

I dunno, one thing I do know about Metal though is that because its usually dark it can make the listeners mind dark as well. Thats why you hear of murderers being associated with listening to Heavy Metal. Also the connection of Metal to Satanism, I'm sure theres lots of Metalheads that started out as normal people, started liking Metal, and later became Satanists from listening to Metal.

 

[NovembersDirge]

Yeah, but that's a cause-effect question, isn't it? Do individuals with 'dark minds' become drawn to metal? Or does metal change people? I'd lean towards the former rather than the latter. Sure, individuals may be exposed to ideas they've not seen before.., but I'd argue there's a predisposition. But that's not really the question here.. the question is a question of culture.

 

[Blowtus]

What is 'heavy metals focus on the individual'? Seems a substantial statement to make without justifying it...

 

[Seditious]

Do you believe that heavy metal's focus...

How does "Heavy Metal" differ from other metal like Black Metal, Death Metal, Pagan Metal, Thrash Metal, etc.?

...American style conservatism (classical liberalism)

what do you mean by "conservatism"?
what do you mean by "American style conservatism"

Do you believe that heavy metal's focus on the individual lends itself towards American style conservatism (classical liberalism) throughout the world?

what do you mean by 'lends itself towards'?

Do you agree or disagree?

Neither: I, as a non-sociologist, entirely do not understand the question.

 

[derbeder]

continue on one of the existing metal and philosophy threads please

 

[Blue_Jay]

Okay, as a sociologist I consider myself to be a social philosopher. So here's my question, which is based on a few suppositions and maybe an historical inaccuracy or two.. debate and decide.

Do you believe that heavy metal's focus on the individual lends itself towards American style conservatism (classical liberalism) throughout the world? Do you think that heavy metal, then, is really just an extension of American culture? Is this why heavy metal culture lends itself towards racism, sexism and homophobia?

Do you agree or disagree? Do you think that this is not a relevant question? I think this is a fascinating question and am very curious as to the views from inside the scene--as I have already built my own opinion about this. (BTW: I take the 'mature discussion' thing very seriously, I am not here to get into a prolonged fight with anyone and would rather the post be closed if it becomes problematic.)

Don't think so, don't think metal leads to conservatism because not a single metal band I know is political (except maybe Megadeth).
Metal is a part of American culture because people listen to it for a living, some might even listen to it for life. Although like religion, sometimes their musical liking well change to something else like rock, pop, or rap, you get what I'm saying. So in other words, metal is a part of music, and music is a part of the American culture.
I don't think metal has to do with racism,sexism, ect. I know people who listen to rap and country who do the same thing, it's just man.
I don't think the question is a big deal so umm not a revelent question imo.

 

[kingcarcas]

^ Exactly, America might have something to do with it, but i just consider racist, sexist, homophobic people stupid.

 

[Blue_Jay]

^ Exactly, America might have something to do with it, but i just consider racist, sexist, homophobic people stupid.

True to the America part. Racism,homophomism, and sexism are all influenced by society,family, peer groups, mass media, or another social force. People do it because it makes them feel fit in with their parents,friends,music, or group that they look up to that do one of the following things you mentioned. It's all society and the way the brain works man!

 

[llamaking]

Yeah, but that's a cause-effect question, isn't it? Do individuals with 'dark minds' become drawn to metal? Or does metal change people? I'd lean towards the former rather than the latter. Sure, individuals may be exposed to ideas they've not seen before.., but I'd argue there's a predisposition. But that's not really the question here.. the question is a question of culture.

I agree that the darkness is there already, and metal just draws it out and embraces it.

 

[bluebongbubbles]

unfortunately a lot of metalheads i know tend to be sort of racist and xenophobic, but i think thats just their personality, and theyd be that way without the influence of metal

 

[PonderTheMoment]

I believe that there are spirits in all music. In example, i used to listen to emo music and now that i looked back on that time in my life, i realized how much i changed through that time. I had grown quiet, shy, and full of.....nothing. Nothing mattered to me then. Not my future, my family or my life. Im happy i got out of that mindset...

 

[waif]

[

Okay, as a sociologist I consider myself to be a social philosopher. So here's my question, which is based on a few suppositions and maybe an historical inaccuracy or two.. debate and decide.

Do you believe that heavy metal's focus on the individual lends itself towards American style conservatism (classical liberalism) throughout the world? Do you think that heavy metal, then, is really just an extension of American culture? Is this why heavy metal culture lends itself towards racism, sexism and homophobia?

Do you agree or disagree? Do you think that this is not a relevant question? I think this is a fascinating question and am very curious as to the views from inside the scene--as I have already built my own opinion about this. (BTW: I take the 'mature discussion' thing very seriously, I am not here to get into a prolonged fight with anyone and would rather the post be closed if it becomes problematic.)

err...I sorta don't think that heavy metal lends itself towards racism, sexism, and homophobia. Racism doesn't really come up because pretty much all heavy metal fans are white. The only point at which race comes up would be some of the Aryan Nationalist black metal bands, and I don't really think of those guys as "metal" because what they stand for is much closer to Nazism than actual metal ideology.

In terms of homophobia, I don't really think that's a problem, unless you consider Skid Row "metal." Ask Rob Halford about that one; last I heard, his career was doing fine.

Sexism is a tricky one; the stereotype is that metal appeals more to lower-class uneducated morons, which is of course untrue. This would probably be the source of all these stereotypes; the "redneck" image is projected onto the headbanger. However, I don't think sexism is more prevalent in metal than elsewhere. I am of course excluding glam metal from my definition of metal.

Overall, I'd say that racism, sexism, and homophobia are no more prevalent in metal than elsewhere; in other words, metalheads may be racist, sexist, or homophobic, but there's no connection between the music and racism, sexism, and homophobia.

In terms of metal as an extension of American culture, I'd say that American metal is generally an extension of American culture; thrash metal bands tend to espouse working class American ideology when they're sober enough to form coherent sentences, while American death metal band's obsession with z-grade slasher flicks is a pretty clear reflection of the general American obsession with violent media; video games, movies, books, etc.

Some metal is more of a social commentary. Therefore, a band might be an extension of their culture in that they're a critical mirror of it, such as Skyclad and Megadeth's last 2 albums.

A lot of bands favor cultural revivalism, particularly pagan metal bands. Viking metal is a definite revivalist subculture within metal. This would seem to be a rejection of current Scandinavian culture.

Basically, metal bands frequently draw extensive influence from their culture, no matter how they portray their native culture.

Individualism in metal is fairly prevalent, but I don't think most bands favor American conservatism so much as mindless hedonism. I'd say you're overanalyzing what is essential a spontaneous and organic movement.

 

[death metal black metal]

Do you believe that heavy metal's focus on the individual lends itself towards American style conservatism (classical liberalism) throughout the world?

I don't think metal is about the individual. I think it's about what is heavy, that is, what extends beyond the individual.

"Racism" and "sexism" and "homophobia" are made-up words to lie about noticing the obvious. No intelligent philosopher uses them.

 

[b.good]

well just like everything else in life heavy metal has different "genres" if you will. some bands may indeed focus on those subjects that you posted but remember not every metal band is that narrow minded and I'm not saying you think that way. Also rap music (at least in America) has more of an impact on kids today because more people listen to it and it deals with the same subjects and more kids try to be "hardcore" and try to act the same way the rappers do.

 

[Έρεβος]

The only point at which race comes up would be some of the Aryan Nationalist black metal bands, and I don't really think of those guys as "metal" because what they stand for is much closer to Nazism than actual metal ideology.

"Actual metal ideology"?

What, does metal have a ten commandments now?

 

[eliudhs]

I'm too tired (1:55AM here on the Eastern Coast) to really understand/answer that question - though from what I can tell it is a good one. All I will say is that many metal bands address important social or political issues.

For example, Rage Against The Machine (I know they may not technically be metal, but their earlier work is closer enough) lyrically are focused on nothing but the problems with society and the political/government structure. Another band that addresses these issues is Nasum. Bands such as Meshuggah focus on the dangers of technology being incorporated into the human world (along with other uplifting topics that I don't wish to touch upon).

I'm thinking of some basic examples here, but metal is that one genre that no one can fuck with. When done well, the messages being conveyed are subtle and brilliant. When NOT done well, they are flat-out stupid (Slipknot, Korn...).

Rap is also important in expressing these ideas, but the genre today is overrun by absolute shitgeists who consistently rap about bling, drugs, booze, and hoes, while metal continues to at least attempt interpreting dark issues.

 

[iampastastorytotelltellit]

I think individiulism brings people to heavy metal.But,before discussing something,definitions sould be clear.What is heavy metal culture,is it a culture?

 

[death metal black metal]

What is heavy metal culture,is it a culture?

Yes, but like all cultures it has a caste system, and you should read/listen to the kings, not the peasants.

 

[kmik]

Why would metal have an ideology? Is there a literature ideology? Every work should be judged on its own merits. Plus, art that expresses "ideology" suck because didactic things suck. Art should be about inspiration, feelings, abstract ideas, not earthly ideologies with a bottom line