My perspective on modern double-kick drumming...
- Thread starter Pelata
- Start date
I really got burned out on power metal bands that just rode the double-base constantly, which seemed to be just about everything that came out a few years back. Really makes you appreciate those truely talented drummers that don't rely on it all of the time.
- Nov 24, 2002
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+1
I was thinking about it while checking the new Angra song. I do love power metal, but if the drum goes like that all the time, on all songs, on all the albums, just got on my bollocks
(something that pisses me off of last Cage album).I dont like it, its grooveless, it lacks accents the fundamental element of expression. I'll take a good old dose of Bonzo or Paul Hammond anyday.
poundingmetal74
Demons Will Fly
I'm not a huge fan of constant double bass. Although it can certainly make a song more upbeat, hearing it constantly is boring. It's partly why we only employ it's use sparing on FS records.
Caveman Ninja
It's a carnival... of monsters!
I love double-kick, but only if it's interesting. The power-metal thing I hate. Paul Bostaph's work in Forbidden, on the other hand, I love...
No-Mercy
Feanor
being a drummer, i have to say double bass sure is fun as hell. lol but in seriousness, i dont think it should be looked down upon or seen as a drummer's inability to do something else if they do it too often. not to say i enjoy it...i dont think it drums should be layed out in a cookie-cutter fashion (cough sonata arctica, even though i love the music)
what i see it as (if it's a repetitive and constant method for a given drummer) is a result of the way most drummer's, and musicians in general, operate when it comes to the percussion.
i think its often viewed as the backing, something that isn't really it's own line of the song but rather solely for keeping all the other lines of the song in check and rhythm. while drums do that, i personally think they should be viewed more as a lead instrument. i write my drum tracks as i would write my guitar or keyboard tracks in the sense that they are their own musical instrument that should shape and carry a melody and flow rather than, in the words of james hetfield, "just be the beat, part...ya know?"
as for me, its really pretty simple. most questions like these are in my opinion. its what best suites the song, and what makes it most interesting- and of course that is up to debate depending on a listener's personal tastes.
what i see it as (if it's a repetitive and constant method for a given drummer) is a result of the way most drummer's, and musicians in general, operate when it comes to the percussion.
i think its often viewed as the backing, something that isn't really it's own line of the song but rather solely for keeping all the other lines of the song in check and rhythm. while drums do that, i personally think they should be viewed more as a lead instrument. i write my drum tracks as i would write my guitar or keyboard tracks in the sense that they are their own musical instrument that should shape and carry a melody and flow rather than, in the words of james hetfield, "just be the beat, part...ya know?"
as for me, its really pretty simple. most questions like these are in my opinion. its what best suites the song, and what makes it most interesting- and of course that is up to debate depending on a listener's personal tastes.
I don't think the drums should just blend into the background either. The drummers I mentioned in my blog post, Peart, Rockenfield, McBrain, Holland, Zonder, Arrington, etc...none of them went unnoticed...they each had a distinctive sound & style...they played for the song with interesting fills & hi-hat work and employed doubke-kick as a means of spicing things up when needed...
No-Mercy
Feanor
I like to quote a Clapton song for various reasons one of which applies to music and in this case drums. "Its in the way that you use it"
Theres alot of great drummers out there, many of which dont always use it all that well.
Theres alot of great drummers out there, many of which dont always use it all that well.
Judasciple
Member
I've been learning drums over the last 7 months (although had lessons several years ago, though had no kit to practice on so lost interest). I feel like I can play interesting and inventive grooves/beats call them what you want, but by the same token I feel like it's part of a drummer's responsibility nowadays to know how to double-kick like a beast so that he can use it if he needs to and really I think that this is the way that any up-and-coming drummer needs to approach the double-kick. Much like Lars Ulrich, even in his most demanding song, Dyer's Eve, you don't really see constant "BZZZZTBZZZZZZZZT" drumming as Pelata put it. It has become a false necessity - something that drummers starting bands in the mid 00's thought essential but in reality it just dumbed down the creativity involved in their drum tracks...
TribunalRecords
Record Label(s)/Vocalist
another drummer (besides all those shawn mentioned) i thought used it well was Vinnie Paul. Never relied on it heavily, but man when it hit...it hit hard!
but for me the last power metal album i could totally stand not stop double kick was ANGRA's Rebirth album. it was all over that album, but i enjoyed it plus he did some really clever stuff on there with his feet. but since then it's gone to points of absurdity like Dragonforce, whom i do enjoy, but speedy kicks for 7 minutes? i can only take so much! hahaha.
but for me the last power metal album i could totally stand not stop double kick was ANGRA's Rebirth album. it was all over that album, but i enjoyed it plus he did some really clever stuff on there with his feet. but since then it's gone to points of absurdity like Dragonforce, whom i do enjoy, but speedy kicks for 7 minutes? i can only take so much! hahaha.
- Nov 24, 2002
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Curious you mention it. I downloaded Angra's last song and the aforementioned drumming got on my nerves. I said to myself how come they can't even go back to an album like "Rebirth"? I may have a different recalling of the album, have to check it again.
TribunalRecords
Record Label(s)/Vocalist
i think it's their best, hands down. better than all the Matos years in my opinion.
SickBoy
Croatian Panzer division
- Nov 24, 2002
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No way!
Everybody knows that "Holy Land" it's their best ever, even as much as I like "Fireworks" better than the debut, HL will always make the top notch.
Bryant
Mr. Sleepy
Rebirth was killer. Acid Rain and Heroes of Sand were two of the best songs Angra has ever done. I think whoever mentioned it being constant double bass was probably mistaken.
As far as the double bass thing.... I really like razoredge's comment. It is indeed the way you use it. Of course No Mercy is going to defend double-bass drummers because he is one, but he, just like everyone else in here has heard some drummers that just constantly hammer away through most of the song. It sounds like a lawn mower idling or something. Sure that is boring and either the drummer lacks skills or songwriting qualities. Having said that, there are still masterful modern drummers out there. I think Stian Kristoffersen of Pagan's Mind is a flat out incredible drummer. He is very modern in his approach and uses quite a bit of double bass, but he also mixes things up very well and accents his equally impressive guitarist very nicely.
I am not just trying to pump up Stian and PM, but he is just a great example of some modern drummers that still are able to put their personality in their playing, as opposed to just hammering down on the double bass.
Bryant
As far as the double bass thing.... I really like razoredge's comment. It is indeed the way you use it. Of course No Mercy is going to defend double-bass drummers because he is one, but he, just like everyone else in here has heard some drummers that just constantly hammer away through most of the song. It sounds like a lawn mower idling or something. Sure that is boring and either the drummer lacks skills or songwriting qualities. Having said that, there are still masterful modern drummers out there. I think Stian Kristoffersen of Pagan's Mind is a flat out incredible drummer. He is very modern in his approach and uses quite a bit of double bass, but he also mixes things up very well and accents his equally impressive guitarist very nicely.
I am not just trying to pump up Stian and PM, but he is just a great example of some modern drummers that still are able to put their personality in their playing, as opposed to just hammering down on the double bass.
Bryant
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