OT: Seriously what happened to these guys?
- Thread starter ironmaidenfan09
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Deadnight Warrior87
The Tempest
Q: What happened to these guys?
A: Cliff Burton died.
LOL. Well I did love ...And Justice for All. But yeah I have a feeling if Cliff was still here, Metallica would have never gone down the road they did of comercial rock. But its not just that, they can't even sound decent playing the old songs live. James has completely lost it
RuntoHills
Lightside of Aquarius
Seriously, the band that was known as MetallicA has not made a masterpiece CD since "...And Justice for All". Since then, that band has gone straight down hill.
darthrya
Maiden fan since I was 9
I find it funny that Cliff gets the JFK treatment - a lot of people think things would have been better had he lived. I doubt it.
People forget that James, Kirk, and Lars were equally as wild and idealistic in their youth. People change over time. I'm sure Cliff would have settled down and gone along with the current musical path the band is doing right now.
I think the X factor in the change of the band belongs to Lars. He's always been about money and power (he grew up very privileged, whereas the rest were lower middle class), while the other three were about good times. Had the band chosen a different drummer which hadn't had as much of the type of influence on the entire group as Lars, I think it's possible the direction the band would have taken up to this point would not be as comical or pathetic.
People forget that James, Kirk, and Lars were equally as wild and idealistic in their youth. People change over time. I'm sure Cliff would have settled down and gone along with the current musical path the band is doing right now.
I think the X factor in the change of the band belongs to Lars. He's always been about money and power (he grew up very privileged, whereas the rest were lower middle class), while the other three were about good times. Had the band chosen a different drummer which hadn't had as much of the type of influence on the entire group as Lars, I think it's possible the direction the band would have taken up to this point would not be as comical or pathetic.
Deadnight Warrior87
The Tempest
Idk, Cliff always struck me as someone that thought outside of the box. I think if he did stay we would have seen a more experimental Metallica rather than a band that kept trying to search for its roots or purposely be different album after album. He was also the one to push the band in a more melodic direction which I think he totally achieved with Ride the Lightning.
Totally agree with you as far as the Lars thing goes. The man is just way too haughty in my opinion. He's talented, but I don't think that should be more important enough to be able to dictate the direction of a band. At least not totally.
Totally agree with you as far as the Lars thing goes. The man is just way too haughty in my opinion. He's talented, but I don't think that should be more important enough to be able to dictate the direction of a band. At least not totally.
Rendclaw
Wrathchild Panther
I look at it like this, and Metallica and Megadeth go hand in hand right down the road.
When they started out, they were young, full of piss and vinegar, and barely could keep themselves fed. James was getting out a lot of anger towards his father and fundamentalist Christianity, which he grew up with. They were all hungry and piss poor, and that hunger showed in their music.
As they got older, more experienced and more popular, they realized that Elektra was basically bending them over a barrel as far as money goes. They might have made all their money on the road, but they were not seeing a good percentage of it from their albums sales. That made them angry, and they focused that anger by putting on some of the best live shows in the mid-to-late 80s.
The Black Album is the lynchpin. I for one have never believed that they sold out on this record. It was a big departure from what they were known from before, almost too big. But the album retained enough of the "old" Metallica that after a time, it was embraced. There are maybe one or two tracks (in my opinion) that keeps this album from being in the rarefied air of Ride the Lighting, Master of Puppets, or even ...And Justice For All.
The writing was on the wall when Load was released and they were doing interviews, and they had gone alternative and cut their hair. By this time, or around the time of Reload that they had finally gotten out from under that contract and signed a better deal with Elektra, But now they are well into their thirties, and I am sorry, but you cannot maintain that level of anger that fueled some of the best albums in the history of rock music. So the way I see it, Reload was the downshift. Load had enough good tracks on it to still decent, though it still falls short of the impact that The Black Album had. The turning point for me when I was reading an interview with James and he was asked how the fans were digging the new music and basically what he said was that they were *making* the fans dig it. At that point, I realized that Metallica had crossed a line.
Then all of that crap happened around the recording of St. Anger, some of which had been a long time coming. Jason leaves the band and only in hindsight do James and Lars realize how shitty they treated him. The Napster backlash. James goes into rehab and they hire an on-site therapist, and you know the rest of the story. St. Anger was not a good album from them at all, and I started to wonder if they had started the downward slide into obscurity. Don;t get me wrong, I know that they are still popular, very much so, but this new album is make or break time for them. They can still pull out of this tailspin, but it is going to be H-A-R-D for them to do so, considering their age now, and how much the Heavy Metal landscape has changed (and not for the better but thats another rant for another time).
When they started out, they were young, full of piss and vinegar, and barely could keep themselves fed. James was getting out a lot of anger towards his father and fundamentalist Christianity, which he grew up with. They were all hungry and piss poor, and that hunger showed in their music.
As they got older, more experienced and more popular, they realized that Elektra was basically bending them over a barrel as far as money goes. They might have made all their money on the road, but they were not seeing a good percentage of it from their albums sales. That made them angry, and they focused that anger by putting on some of the best live shows in the mid-to-late 80s.
The Black Album is the lynchpin. I for one have never believed that they sold out on this record. It was a big departure from what they were known from before, almost too big. But the album retained enough of the "old" Metallica that after a time, it was embraced. There are maybe one or two tracks (in my opinion) that keeps this album from being in the rarefied air of Ride the Lighting, Master of Puppets, or even ...And Justice For All.
The writing was on the wall when Load was released and they were doing interviews, and they had gone alternative and cut their hair. By this time, or around the time of Reload that they had finally gotten out from under that contract and signed a better deal with Elektra, But now they are well into their thirties, and I am sorry, but you cannot maintain that level of anger that fueled some of the best albums in the history of rock music. So the way I see it, Reload was the downshift. Load had enough good tracks on it to still decent, though it still falls short of the impact that The Black Album had. The turning point for me when I was reading an interview with James and he was asked how the fans were digging the new music and basically what he said was that they were *making* the fans dig it. At that point, I realized that Metallica had crossed a line.
Then all of that crap happened around the recording of St. Anger, some of which had been a long time coming. Jason leaves the band and only in hindsight do James and Lars realize how shitty they treated him. The Napster backlash. James goes into rehab and they hire an on-site therapist, and you know the rest of the story. St. Anger was not a good album from them at all, and I started to wonder if they had started the downward slide into obscurity. Don;t get me wrong, I know that they are still popular, very much so, but this new album is make or break time for them. They can still pull out of this tailspin, but it is going to be H-A-R-D for them to do so, considering their age now, and how much the Heavy Metal landscape has changed (and not for the better but thats another rant for another time).
Lord of Delusions
Member
Rendclaw made some very good points. You can't stay pissed off all the time, and if music is your life, it will change accordingly. I'm not like I was when I was younger, and it wouldn't do me or anyone else any good to pretend that I was. If they don't want to be a thrash metal band anymore like they were way back when, who the hell are we to say different? I know one thing though, I've been a fan long enough to hear just about every single one of Metallica's members say at one time or another "We make music for us.". You can't ignore that when you like what they are doing and bitch when you don't.
People compare Metallica's longetivity to Maiden or AC/DC, and while both of those bands have been around seemingly forever without changing their fundamental sound, neither bands music/format/content were based around anger and aggresion. Maiden has an almost endless supply of history to write about, and AC/DC's drinkin' and fightin' and womanizin' songs never go out of style. Metallica's history, however, has almost been a case study of anger management. They've slowly worked their way through from really pissed to wherever they are now, and the music reflects that.
Don't be all butt-hurt and heart broken because they don't play fast like they used to. Personally, I'd rather not see them try it if they aren't into it. Otherwise it'll sound exactly like the video at the top of this page. Shitty.
People compare Metallica's longetivity to Maiden or AC/DC, and while both of those bands have been around seemingly forever without changing their fundamental sound, neither bands music/format/content were based around anger and aggresion. Maiden has an almost endless supply of history to write about, and AC/DC's drinkin' and fightin' and womanizin' songs never go out of style. Metallica's history, however, has almost been a case study of anger management. They've slowly worked their way through from really pissed to wherever they are now, and the music reflects that.
Don't be all butt-hurt and heart broken because they don't play fast like they used to. Personally, I'd rather not see them try it if they aren't into it. Otherwise it'll sound exactly like the video at the top of this page. Shitty.
Metallica has always been hindered by Lars. He's just not that good. I always thought Testament were severely limited by their original drummer, and look what happened when Lombardo joined. "The Gathering" was a monster.
James is about the only metal singer in history whose voice has gotten cleaner with age. Most get worse and rougher. But like others have said, all of Metallica died on that icy road in Sweden in 1986, not just Cliff Burton.
What made it worse, though, was that they were never given time to get over it. They started auditions for a new bassist the day after Cliff's funeral. That was so fucking unfair it's not funny. The label execs who pushed them back to work should be shot for that. They had no time to grieve or get any help or anything. You can see it in Some Kind of Monster. They are still dealing with it.
I thought Rush would never be the same after the hell Neil went through. Hell, I thought the band was done, and they were, really. They were effectively broken up for 3 years. But they came back very well, same as they always were, because they came back when he was ready, and that was a long, painful slough.
What was done to Metallica in 1986 was so far beyond unfair it isn't funny, and it changed them forever, permanently.
James is about the only metal singer in history whose voice has gotten cleaner with age. Most get worse and rougher. But like others have said, all of Metallica died on that icy road in Sweden in 1986, not just Cliff Burton.
What made it worse, though, was that they were never given time to get over it. They started auditions for a new bassist the day after Cliff's funeral. That was so fucking unfair it's not funny. The label execs who pushed them back to work should be shot for that. They had no time to grieve or get any help or anything. You can see it in Some Kind of Monster. They are still dealing with it.
I thought Rush would never be the same after the hell Neil went through. Hell, I thought the band was done, and they were, really. They were effectively broken up for 3 years. But they came back very well, same as they always were, because they came back when he was ready, and that was a long, painful slough.
What was done to Metallica in 1986 was so far beyond unfair it isn't funny, and it changed them forever, permanently.
Actually, I think his voice is AWEFUL now. It's not clener its just straight up bad. He has the same voice but he now TRIES to sing and its embarrasing. These guys are so bad now that its seriously rediculous. It's like a football player that is 40 years old trying to continue on because his heart won't let him step down because he loves what he does. Metallica is at that phase.
Just look at Iron Maiden, Bruce is better than ever, the band is tighter than ever and they did all of this without compromising their core sound. That is why Iron Maiden is respectfully the best Heavy Metal band of all time
Totally agree.
I give them points for attempting to 'stay relevant' ... but for my tastes the band was pretty much broken when they lost Cliff.
I thought Injustice was crap. And everything since - worse. My friends in high school owned a single injustice for all tape and we kept trying to give it away to each other - no one really wanted it. I still don't own it. I think one of us ended up tossing the tape into a trash can at school.
I don't think Lars anti-Napster thing did much for the band either
