Sin

[MURAI]

I think if you're trying say we use genetics to determine if a person is going to be a criminal and then punish them then we are heading down the wrong path.

That's a bad way to go if you ask me. The whole basis of laws in the world are that you are inocent until proven guilty. If you are just assuming a person is going to commit a crime you're going to create a very messed up world where people are punishd because of something beyond their control. You're looking to make a world where only those with "acceptable genes" will go on to have a good life without worry of punishment. That would just be a horrible 1984/Brave New World/Minority Report style world, somewhere i'd never want to live in.

Also, i don't think we are anywhere near being able to predict a persons behaviour based on genetics.
They may play a role but not a person alive can say they know exactly how genetics affects behaviour. We are a long way off having such an understanding, and even when we do you still have to take into account that environmental factors have an effect on development also.

No, I'm not saying lets kill off people with "inferior" genes. I am saying most people dont take account that their DNA blue print from their anscestery makes up their being. And not just your "individual self".

 

[speed]

You have some definate artistic talent Murai. Especially the drawings, and the potrait of the man with a small neck. I suppose this talent was inherited?

 

[Dushan S]

Thats maybe the best post Ive seen on this forum.

Agreed, makes alot of sense.

Thanks, appreciated. It is only thing working for me anyway, so...

No, I'm not saying lets kill off people with "inferior" genes. I am saying most people dont take account that their DNA blue print from their anscestery makes up their being. And not just your "individual self".

Well psychology as a science has a lot of explanations why someone born in terrible family, in very bad social position has serious issues, and is almost hopeless case. On the other hand, scientists admit they have no clue why there is considerable number of persons that have all genetic and psychological reasons to be idiots and criminals but have become normal human beings, actually a lot of great artists became extraordinary persons because of pain and hardship... What makes a difference, why someone wins and another person fails, is still unknown, ate least, this is what science says.

So I am basicaly against giving too much weight to genetics and social enviroment. It is there, take it into account, but it is not all and all.

 

[MURAI]

You have some definate artistic talent Murai. Especially the drawings, and the potrait of the man with a small neck. I suppose this talent was inherited?

What? If you're being sarcastic, in my work I dont give a shit if the drawings look a little too exaggerated. I dont make work to be representational and pretty. I dont make work just to please people. I've gotten some shit from people for drawing and painting too rough and they don't get it and what not. If you're being serious about my drawing/painting abilities, my mother can draw alright actually.

 

[derek]

C'mon now fellows. I think too much weight is put on genetics when we actually know almost nothing tangible about their effects on us. We can stimulate part of the brain for pleasure, for sure, but we know jack about how exactly that works.

Psychology sometimes gets caught in the trap of trying to explain away everything as if it has all the answers, when it has anything but.

I think who we are depends on so many different factors that it is impossible for anyone to absolutley dictate what we will turn out like. On that basis I think its scientifically impossible for someone to say "this child will grow up to kill". The danger is that if a scientist says this we tend to believe him/her.

My fear is that science tries to explain away more than it is capable of and we are all left, quite literally, screwed.

 

[speed]

What? If you're being sarcastic, in my work I dont give a shit if the drawings look a little too exaggerated. I dont make work to be representational and pretty. I dont make work just to please people. I've gotten some shit from people for drawing and painting too rough and they don't get it and what not. If you're being serious about my drawing/painting abilities, my mother can draw alright actually.

Jeez, I was being serious. I like the exaggeration and the roughness. Your work has a dramatic quality to it. Now I am no art expert, but yours is pretty good.

 

[MURAI]

Well then. Thanks. I am just real edgy recently so.

 

[MURAI]

I think who we are depends on so many different factors that it is impossible for anyone to absolutley dictate what we will turn out like. On that basis I think its scientifically impossible for someone to say "this child will grow up to kill". The danger is that if a scientist says this we tend to believe him/her.

Males have XY chromosomes and females have XX chromosomes. I heard that some more violent criminals have an extra X chromosome.

Yes, it's not scientifically possible to explain all about one's personality but it seems that North American society dont really think about anscestory when it comes to life in general.

 

[T_man357]

Have to agree with Hubster on that one.

People aren't really becomming more bad, just things a lot of the world says is ok is deemed un-christian by the strongly religious people.

You don't need to worry about sins to be good to yourself and to others. You don't need to worry about sins to be a caring person. Likewsie you really don't need a god to do all of these either.

Dude, while I respect your right to an opinion you can't honestly believe that people aren't becoming worse over time. I mean just for laughs lets go back say 30 years (1975) Do a little investigating into how many school shootings there were, or how many little kids were being raped and killed or prostituted. how many people were in prison or on death row as opposed to now.And the list goes on and on.

This isnt a sin argument from me but the world is a violent place that seems to get more violent with every passing year and eventually we're probably going to have to face the fact of nuclear war which will probably be the ultimate climax of violence that we're capable of as people.....Just something to think about.