Speaker Cabinet - What do u think?

~BURNY~

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Apr 20, 2005
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Should I get it and swap the speakers with the V30's from my trusty shitty Harley Benton?
It's a 70's farfisa organ cabinet. It seems to be built like a panzer.
Dimensions: 31.75" tall, 29.5" wide, 15.2" deep (80x75x38 cm) . It weighs around 90lbs/40kg. The seller asks about 300 euros.
Same as the one pictured below.
f_front1.jpg

f_back.jpg

f_in.jpg

Sorry for the huge ass pics.:saint:
 
I don't know man... 300 euro seems like a lot for an empty cab (I'm guessing you have no use for its speakers). I'd try to find a carpenter and make him build me a nice Mesa clone with some good plywood.
 
You're probably right.
On the the other hand I could use the point you made to try to convince the seller drop the price.
Will try that.
 
If you could get him to drop the price, then yeah, I'd go for it, it looks solid (though of course you're in a better position to judge that than I :D) - I would DEFINITELY vote tearing out all that insulation though if you do get it, I've never been a fan of what they do to a cab's sound! (make it stuffier, like my old Engl cab, which I sold to a dude who then ripped out the insulation and said it was a massive improvement)

And Mesas, Marshalls, and Oranges (among others) have no insulation of any kind inside :headbang:
 
Inner insulation simulates a bigger cab, because it improves the inner volume.
I think it's usefull in a 2x12 cab, when you can contain the size (a little) of the cab and simulate a bigger one with insulation.
 
From Celestion.com:

GUIDELINES FOR CABINET DESIGN
A unique area Of loudspeaker design
A loudspeaker is usually a transducer, designed to faithfully reproduce the acoustics of the signal presented to it. An electric guitar speaker however is a creative part of the music, contributing its own character and tonality. The ‘instrument’ an electric guitar player uses is really a combination of guitar, amplifier and speaker. All three parts are vitally important to a good sound.

As guitar speakers are different, so their cabinets are different to hi-fi or PA cabinets. Deep, thunderous bass is not required (the low E of a standard-tuned lead guitar is 82Hz). High frequency reproduction is a positive disadvantage, allowing unpleasant harmonics and electronic noise to be heard. Distortion-free sound would be a disaster.

Two elements, a drive and a box
The box design is acoustically less critical than that for hi-fi or PA systems, but proper construction is essential. The cabinets should be solidly built to ensure no joint vibration (unpleasant buzzing), and be of adequate strength to withstand hard use. Remember that guitar speakers are quite heavy and amplifiers that sit on top of guitar cabs are even heavier. Internal bracing is generally not required, but battens inside the joints are good if your woodwork skills do not extend to complex corner joints, and a central bracing post can be advantageous in a 4x12.

Most quality cabs use 15-18mm plywood for the main cabinet, with MDF for the baffle (the part where the speaker(s) are mounted), but they can be constructed of any material. Many budget cabs are made of chipboard (cheap, but poor in terms of strength, ruggedness and sound) or MDF (easy to machine, but heavy and dead). Maple, mahogany and walnut are often used for high quality cabinets.

The important characteristics of the cabinet material are strength, sound and ease of use. Lively resonant materials, such as plywood or real woods, vibrate in sympathy with the speaker and enhance the sound, but should be at least 13mm / 0.5" thick, or they will unduly colour the sound. Most woods or wood composites will be strong enough at this thickness. When considering price, you should also consider cabinet finish. Cabinets can be painted or stained, or covered with a vinyl or carpet finish. Real woods finished with a stain can be very exclusive and expensive looking!

Generally, open back or sealed boxes should be used.Open back gives a looser low end with less depth, and 'figure 8' directivity (sound field looks like an 8 when looked down on from above the cab). Sealed boxes give tight, deeper low end but are more directional, giving less spread of sound. Vented / tuned / ported / reflex boxes do not generally offer an advantage to lead guitar speaker operation. If such a loading is required. it is recommended that the alignment should be chosen with care as inappropriate reflex designs can cause speaker damage. The box size is not critical. The baffle size is more important in open back boxes (larger = more low/mid presence), and for closed back boxes larger volume means deeper but looser bass. Do not use internal acoustic wadding, it is inappropriate for guitar cabs, reducing sparkle and life.Mount the speaker securely using bolts into T-nuts, not self tapping screws. Do not overtighten so the housing rim bends. Ensure the speaker is protected from the front, as the cone is easily damaged. The speaker can be front or rear mounted.

In Summary
Plywood or real wood construction is preferable
Strong, rigid construction means no buzzes or rattles
Size is not critical
Ensure the speaker is adequately mounted and protected
Avoid air leaks if using sealed box construction
CAUTION
We do not advise mixing different impedances of driver within the same cabinet. This can lead to uneven power sharing between speakers, causing one speaker to be overdriven and damaged, while the other is underdriven.

Thiele-small parameters
Thiele Small parameters are useful for controlling the low frequency response of sealed or ported cabinet systems by changing the cabinet internal volume, and port dimensions. However they are of limited use when designing a guitar speaker cabinet.

Electric guitar speakers do not reproduce 'low' frequencies (the low E string of a lead guitar has a fundamental of 82Hz) and so the frequencies at which Thiele Small parameters have significance are mostly below the operating range.
Also, the parameters are measured at very small signal levels. Guitar speakers become non linear at very low levels compared to other types of speaker, greatly reducing the significance of Thiele Small parameters in actual speaker use. Using the Thiele Small parameters of a typical guitar speaker, you will find that halving or doubling the cabinet size makes minimal difference to the response.
They have no relevance to open back cabinets.
Care should be exercised designing ported (or reflex) cabinets for guitar speakers as the increased cone excursion below the tuning frequency can cause speaker damage.

The cabinet size, shape and construction are of far higher significance than the internal volume. Cabinet design using Thiele Small parameters ignores these most fundamental aspects. Important factors include the material you make the cabinet from, the panel sizes and shapes, how they are joined, how the cabinet is finished, the mounting of the speaker, etc. These, not Thiele Small parameters are the critical factors in the design and ultimately the sound of a guitar speaker cabinet
 
Nice one, Shadow Walker.

I'm amazed at acoustic dampening inside a cab decreasing the sound quality. Though given the depths people would be using, I'm not surprised. I mean you'd need about 6" thick Rigid fibreglass to even start touching low frequencies. What those 1 or 2" layers would do is just suck out all the highs and leave you with a boomy and muddy sound.

The cab would need to be absolutely massive to get an adequate amount of acoustic insulation in there.
 
Thanks shadow walker that link was really helpful!

I've got an older Line 6 spider(?) cab lying around that i was thinking of upgrading/fucking around with. It's got stock celestion designed line6 speakers in it,pretty terrible sounding but the cabinet itself seems pretty well built - VERY solid construction, with a central bracing post as mentioned above. Overall weight and look seems to indicate MDF to me - but isn't that what engl cabs are made of? :)

i'll be looking at upgrading the speakers for starters - aiming for the tightest low end response for distorted chugs possible. i've already got an OS recto (v30s) and 1960a (G12T75s) so its more of a fun project than my main recording cab. perhaps reinforcing the joints/overall construction as well.

any speaker recommendations? not looking at v30s/G12T75s - want a different flavor. I was thinking eminence man o' war's, but haven't heard anything about em in a recorded scenario.

also, i'd probably only be swapping out 1 or 2 of the speakers, given its main use for recording (i usually close mic 1 speaker). does anyone know how much of an issue colouration and bleed from the other speakers would be?

and oh man..300 euro seems way steep for that farfisa - i got the line 6 for the equivalent of 100 euros ;)
 
Yeah, I don't agree with a few things in that article either. I'm not sure they had drop-tuned distortion guitars in mind when they were writing it.
 
I've just pull out my cab's insulation and the sound seems less controlled, drier and thinner (a little) playing palmutes, heavier and more edgy in some aspect....don't know if I prefer it now of before... It's a 2x12 so, as I said, probably the insulation affects more the little cabs.
 
do you think that this cabinet can sound similar to a mesa boogie with v30? or what make's sound so f**ing good at mesa boogie cabinets??
 
AFAIK Mesa's sound so good because of 3 things:

The large dimensions of the cab resulting in a reduction of boxy low mids.
The Mesa V30's being voiced slighty brighter than normal V30's.
The solid construction of the Mesa cab.