As an American at tax time (and who is about to receive a 400 dollar refund check) I am contemplating the annoyance of funding my government. My crisis, is the fact I feel like I get nothing in return for my forced financial remuneration. The roads and highways are overcrowded, local taxes increase every year, I only got tax breaks for my years wasted in college, I dont get health care, or really any other perks for that matter. Plus, the knowledge from Katrina, that my government really doesnt care much if I was hit by a natural disaster, and the knowledge that billions are wasted in corporate lobby-based perks and loopholes, doesnt sit too well with me (not to mention the little civil war we started). I know I may sound like a Reaganite Republican, or a libertarian, but I for one, am seriously questioning why I pay taxes since I receive nothing in return. We essentially have a capitalistic system already in place, where the big companies run the show, why even bother with government anymore other than as a arbriter of interest rates ?
Taxes
- Thread starter speed
- Start date
LORD_RED_DRAGON
New Metal Member
speed said:
Although I think the tax system far from perfect, I believe we do get quite a lot for our government dollar. In the briefest of terms, we are afforded a high standard of living - a standard afforded by a system that allows us to live beyond our immediate means and that tends to our welfare.
Imagine if we were not able to purchase on credit. That car that you want (that you arguably need) could not be bought until you had saved monies in the amount of the purchase price. The credit systems in place exist because of federally insured lending institutions (e.g. the FDIC).
The roads we travel with that car are maintained by tax-supported, government dollars. The roads may not be perferct, but they achieve the goal of allowing people easy passage throughout the country. This, to my mind, is a successful endeavor.
Our tax dollar also funds the law enforcement that protects us - our endeavors and possessions. Again, this system is not perfect, but by and large, the government-funded law enforcement system succeeds at affording us a personal freedom.
speed said:
I would argue that we have a moderated capitalistic system - a Keynesian system as opposed to, say, the laissez faire ideology Adam Smith. This is, I think, a pertinent distinction because it speaks to the fact that the government does, in fact, have a meaningful hand in regulating the economy. There are numerous federal laws that disallow a given, private enterprise from reaching a point wherein it is able to truly priceset. This, as much as law enforcement, allows us an otherwise unattainable bounty.
Norsemaiden
barbarian
LORD_RED_DRAGON
New Metal Member
american income tax was originally illegal under the 4th and 5th amendments and also what i believe was called "article 1" that states that "the government shal not act as a bank"
when Lincoln created income tax, every single fucking penny went to coats/food/ammunition for the northern army
without this the south would have won
if every single fucking penny of every past year's income tax had gone to the american military then america wouldn't be in the fucking mess it is now because we could just threaten to anihilate the country every single time someone threatens to cut off trade with america
which has started happening almost every fucking day ever since Clinton comepletely gutted the military in order to pay off the national debt
a lot of other countries owed america money the day Clinton left office but now america is in worse debt than we've ever been before, and everyone thinks they can do whatever the fuck they want to america because we still don't have any fucking millitary
back to topic of taxes
america is in more debt than ever before
and america also still has income tax
and apparently NONE of this money is going toward millitary
so can anyone really honestly say our taxes are being used properly???
when Lincoln created income tax, every single fucking penny went to coats/food/ammunition for the northern army
without this the south would have won
if every single fucking penny of every past year's income tax had gone to the american military then america wouldn't be in the fucking mess it is now because we could just threaten to anihilate the country every single time someone threatens to cut off trade with america
which has started happening almost every fucking day ever since Clinton comepletely gutted the military in order to pay off the national debt
a lot of other countries owed america money the day Clinton left office but now america is in worse debt than we've ever been before, and everyone thinks they can do whatever the fuck they want to america because we still don't have any fucking millitary
back to topic of taxes
america is in more debt than ever before
and america also still has income tax
and apparently NONE of this money is going toward millitary
so can anyone really honestly say our taxes are being used properly???
Norsemaiden
barbarian
Anyone interested in income tax should see this interview by Alex Jones with former IRS Special Agent Joe Banister who used to be in involved in investigating criminal violation of tax laws.
http://www.infowars.com/video/interviews/banister_wmbb.htm
He says income tax is voluntary under the constitution and that the 16th Ammendment was never ratified. The federal income taxes don't go towards funding revenue for the US government. At first when he had heard this idea, Banister thought it was outrageous nonsense, but then he did his own investigations for 2 years. He was forced to resign when he informed his superiours about what he'd discovered.
The government borrows fiat money from the Federal Reserve and income taxes are used as a vehicle to pay interest to the Federal Reserve on that debt.
"They print the money and there's no value to it" "they make it out of nothing" because "they have the power to force us to use the currency".
As the tax is voluntary, it is "wrong and illegal to harass and seize money from people who don't volunteer."
"Constantly tell you we're trying to keep inflation under control, trying to minimise the effects of it. You look at it and over a period of decades it's always going up, it never goes down or disappears." "Eventually it ends up destroying the economy".
Banister had to find this out through his personal investigation because it isn't taught in the best accounting schools, etc.
http://www.infowars.com/video/interviews/banister_wmbb.htm
He says income tax is voluntary under the constitution and that the 16th Ammendment was never ratified. The federal income taxes don't go towards funding revenue for the US government. At first when he had heard this idea, Banister thought it was outrageous nonsense, but then he did his own investigations for 2 years. He was forced to resign when he informed his superiours about what he'd discovered.
The government borrows fiat money from the Federal Reserve and income taxes are used as a vehicle to pay interest to the Federal Reserve on that debt.
"They print the money and there's no value to it" "they make it out of nothing" because "they have the power to force us to use the currency".
As the tax is voluntary, it is "wrong and illegal to harass and seize money from people who don't volunteer."
"Constantly tell you we're trying to keep inflation under control, trying to minimise the effects of it. You look at it and over a period of decades it's always going up, it never goes down or disappears." "Eventually it ends up destroying the economy".
Banister had to find this out through his personal investigation because it isn't taught in the best accounting schools, etc.
Neith
Little Lady
LORD_RED_DRAGON said:
Needless to say I don't know much about taxes, especially American taxes, but how can you even have a working government if none of the money generated through tax gets spent on it?
derek
Grey Eminence
I believe in the tax system, I find it to be absurd that people demand tip-top facilities yet are not willing to pay for it. The masses always want to pay less taxes, but they still want better roads and cleaner play parks, so it becomes hard to strike a balance.
Norsemaiden
barbarian
The tax system should be more open and democratic. People should know how their money is being used and it should not be used for purposes like building extra nuclear weapons, or limousines for politicians' wives,etc. unless that has popular support. There should not be charities for things like kidney dialysis machines or for life boat crew. These things should be met through taxes and should be given priority over a lot of less worthy uses of public money. A huge proportion of taxes are misappropriated and illegally end up in the pockets of crooks within the establishment.
LORD_RED_DRAGON said:
So your advocating further military spending? I would like to see these sources that deny the increase in military spending since Bush II took office.
Silver Incubus
Dead Hands Justin
If we could say where out money went then I might not have a problem with taxes. But I don't want to fuel the corruptions and scandal that goes on in government. I'd rather not pay taxes simply because I don't want to fund criminals who don't care a whole lot about the public they are 'suppose' to be serving.
