Wasted time / drum tracking failure / Help?

[bryan_kilco]

My band has been working on our own EP for some time now. Drums aren't even finished since we are limited to about 3-6 hours a WEEK to track at our bassists place. 2 days ago, drummer calls me and tells me the drums sound different since last session....toms dropped tuning, somehow the kick sounds higher pitched....so, yeah. We basically have the majority of the drum tracks done, with a few spots that needed punching-in ..... which is obviously going to sound like total shit now that things lost their tuning.

We were going to keep the drums all natural, but now I'm thinking about trying to talk them into sampling the kit and replacing everything, as we apparently just wasted a shitload of time.

Has anyone had this issue? I imagine it's the change of weather that may have caused it? Or....there was some water that had leaked into the basement we are recording at when it rained really hard for 2 days....maybe the moisture caused the problem?

All I know is, I'm not happy....and I'm sure as hell our drummer is way more unhappy about it. I'm seriously about to just fucking program the drums, as much as I don't want to....but it'd yield much cleaner results.

 

[C_F_H_13]

Yeah you're fucked. It happens. Honestly I wish I could give you some drum tracking saving advice, but really you have 3 options and none of them are great...

1. Retrack everything and do it all in a day and watch the tuning as you go.

2. Punch it in and deal with the change in tone either by sample replacing or just dealing with the change period.

3. Don't punch and fix what you got the best you can.

 

[Trevoire520]

If you can only record 3-6 hours at a time, and the drummer isn't happy with the tuning drifting then you've got no choice but to samples replace dude.

 

[jipchen]

Sorry to hijack this thread but can someone (CFH13? ) give an estimate on the time a drumset stays in tune - roughly?
I guess it depends on lots of factors like temperature, humidity, amount of them being played etc.
Let's say the drums stand in an air-conditioned room and the drummer only plays them for the actual recordings and not between.
Would 2-4 weeks be okay or would it be important to check the tuning (or re-tune every day you track anyway)?

 

[MacoySIN]

Sorry to hijack this thread but can someone (CFH13? ) give an estimate on the time a drumset stays in tune - roughly?
I guess it depends on lots of factors like temperature, humidity, amount of them being played etc.
Let's say the drums stand in an air-conditioned room and the drummer only plays them for the actual recordings and not between.
Would 2-4 weeks be okay or would it be important to check the tuning (or re-tune every day you track anyway)?

drum heads change tension the moment you hit them. its good to tune after a few takes. or even after each take if you're crazy about it. also depends how hard your drummer hits. try using drum dial, it'll save you the trouble even if the takes are weeks apart. though drum heads sound quality change a bit fast too so don't take too long to finish a song.

 

[C_F_H_13]

drum heads change tension the moment you hit them. its good to tune after a few takes. or even after each take if you're crazy about it. also depends how hard your drummer hits. try using drum dial, it'll save you the trouble even if the takes are weeks apart. though drum heads sound quality change a bit fast too so don't take too long to finish a song.

Yep pretty much.

On sessions when I actually have the time, snare gets tweaked every take, toms get checked every other take, and kick is just checked a few times a day.

 

[jipchen]

Wow okay, didn't expect that. Well good to know
I was unsure about whether to buy a DrumDial because I was like "the numbers alone won't make the drums sound good", but I guess it's ideal to be able to "full-recall" ( ) the tuning of each drum. Plus I actually think about taking lessons from a drum tech / drum teacher just to learn how to properly tune those damn things, haha.

Thank you guys.

 

[C_F_H_13]

Wow okay, didn't expect that. Well good to know
I was unsure about whether to buy a DrumDial because I was like "the numbers alone won't make the drums sound good", but I guess it's ideal to be able to "full-recall" ( ) the tuning of each drum. Plus I actually think about taking lessons from a drum tech / drum teacher just to learn how to properly tune those damn things, haha.

Thank you guys.

Drum dials are ok. Honestly I use em to get the head on straight and properly, and then I don't touch it almost ever. In my experience the numbers are useless after a point. In fact my drum dial if I even gently tap the top of it the number will completely change, sometimes if I lift the dial and place it in the same spot it changes. I thought my dial was busted till I used another drummers once and his did the same thing.

I'd recommend getting one, but it's not the holy grail of drum tuning.

 

[MacoySIN]

yeah i agree since drum dial don't really "hear" the drum. its a great guide to drum tuning though but use your ears too.

 

[Tommy Gun]

My band has been working on our own EP for some time now. Drums aren't even finished since we are limited to about 3-6 hours a WEEK to track at our bassists place. 2 days ago, drummer calls me and tells me the drums sound different since last session....toms dropped tuning, somehow the kick sounds higher pitched....so, yeah. We basically have the majority of the drum tracks done, with a few spots that needed punching-in ..... which is obviously going to sound like total shit now that things lost their tuning.

We were going to keep the drums all natural, but now I'm thinking about trying to talk them into sampling the kit and replacing everything, as we apparently just wasted a shitload of time.

Has anyone had this issue? I imagine it's the change of weather that may have caused it? Or....there was some water that had leaked into the basement we are recording at when it rained really hard for 2 days....maybe the moisture caused the problem?

All I know is, I'm not happy....and I'm sure as hell our drummer is way more unhappy about it. I'm seriously about to just fucking program the drums, as much as I don't want to....but it'd yield much cleaner results.

Why are you even trying to get a natural drum sound worth keeping from tracking in a basement? Also, why would you ever have any gear at all in a basement that obviously lets moisture in to that extent. I'm sorry man, but you are being unrealistic about the tracks you're going to get and you're being irresponsible with your gear.

If you want good sounding, natural drum tracks, go to a studio with a well-designed, properly treated drum room. A studio with an engineer who knows how to stay on top of keeping the drums tuned between takes. (your drummer obviously doesn't). And last but not least, a studio with the right mics and outboard gear to give you that great drum sound you want.

If that's not in the budget, then my best advice would be to track the drums somewhere with nice high ceilings to get decent overhead/cymbal tracks. Then sample replace the rest of the kit.

 

[bryan_kilco]

Well, it was either at our jam space (a cold shed) or in our bassists basement. Right now we really don't have the funds to fork out to a studio, but it IS what I would really like to do - get 1 or 2 GOOD, pro sounding songs out instead of an 8 song EP of mediocre quality.

I honestly didn't know the basement would leak water, and if I did - we wouldn't be there. I guess they somewhat sorted things out today but I'm curious to go back and listen to it.

 

[WellfearJoe]

Check out Bob Gatzen's videos on youtube for a nice tutorial on tuning drums. Also you can make your own drumdial/tension watch from a pressure gauge and a hockey puck - search for how-to on pearldrummersforum.com or drummerworld.com.

But in the ongoing situation, convince the drummer to let you sample replace the drums.

 

[jeid]

The Bob Gatzen videos are really good... and rather funny

 

[Fredrik-Ablaze]

why not simply reference the drums allready recorded and tune the kit the same and then record?

 

[bryan_kilco]

why not simply reference the drums allready recorded and tune the kit the same and then record?

They tried it and apparently got close.....I wasn't there to witness it. I'll keep this updated. Maybe I can post some raw drums if I can get them and you guys can tear it apart.

 

[Morgan C]

If you're going to rerecord, do each song one at a time until its perfect. You shouldn't be going back AFTER recording the drums, to do a few punch-ins, because you should have got it right the first time. That way, if the tunings change from week to week, it'll be different tunings per song (which is fine, some bands change the drums themselves for each song, not just the tuning), not different tunings per segment of a song, which will sound dodgy if kept natural.