Who's up for some Cross Dressing Metro Sexually Confused Prog/Power Metal?

[Michael TEOF]

Why do people keep calling this "J-Rock"? Can't it be Progressive Power Metal in the Angra, Symphony X, Rhapsody vein?

It's good music in the exact style everyone on this board loves so much. "Japanese Rock" just sounds so generic. This is power metal for christ's sake. Listen to the songs already!

I suppose Bruce Springsteen, Smashing Pumpkins, Maroon 5, and Dream Theater are all A-Rock

The Michael

 

[sh0kr0k]

Wow so much to reply to! Here we go....

I also saw some of the J-Rock bands at the recent tour wtih Avenged Sevenfold, Atreyu, et. al.

Unf! I missed the entire tour because I wasn't paying attention. I was up to my eyebrows in European and Brazilian bands so the Japanese bands and everyone else took a back seat for a while. Didn't intend for that happen, I don't listen to music by country (lol!)... not to mention I would never pay attention t the Taste of Chaos tour anyway. I could just slap myself for missing a single DéspairsRay or MUCC show in the U.S., muchless a whole major national tour *puts on the dunce hat*

J-Rock needs to be pushed more here

I'd love to see bands from Japan get more exposure definitely, especially in the U.S.!

Going to listen to Versailles more though and see if this can't grow on me.

\m/ Sweet! "Love From a Dead Orchestra" is my favorite, followed closely by "Red Carpet Day" --- all their songs can be found on YouTube.

this band is alright but I think they "borrow" a little too much from X-Japan, both image and music wise.

*falls prostrate and worships at the mighty alter of Hideto Matsumoto*
Everyone borrows from X JAPAN! It's impossible to be a metal band from Japan and not be compared to X JAPAN - even moreso for the visually-oriented bands. It's usually a bogus comparison.

1. Totally different image. Just because they're both metal bands from Japan with crazy hair and costumes and sing in Japanese =/= copy-catting. It simply means they share a style of music and like to put effort into their stage appearance.
2. X JAPAN is a classic metal/hard rock band and Versailles is a symphonic power metal band. This is like saying Angra borrowed from Motley Crue.
3. The immediate comparison to another Japanese band emphasizes my point that people see non-English music as a separate entity. Why not compare Versailles to Dream Evil? They sound more alike and both have elaborate stage costumes.

All that said, I'm not trying to pick a fight. Versailles love X JAPAN and even played on the Hide Memorial Summit last month honoring the late guitarist.

My favorite visual kei band is Malice Mizer! And Loudness (kidding). Dir En Grey are pretty much nu-metal imo....Galneyrus would be the best pick for prog power though!

LOL@Loudness! ((for the record, I love that band - they're just not the only band to come from Japan that's worthy of attention. See: Hizaki Grace Project))

Malice Mizer = classic. I was real upset when they disbanded, but at least they left behind a huge amount of material. Have you heard the guitarist's "new" band Moi dix Mois? Even heavier, darker, and creepier!

...that's a dude...........?

PRETTY huh? And yes he looks that flawless in person! *Note: this is a stage costume, people. I promise they don't go to the grocery store or pump gas in a Victorian dress. However, I did see them doing "normal" things while in their stage clothes and it was .... bizarre. They had just finished a photo shoot and were killing time before the next thing on their schedule. Watching Hizaki (the one in the picture) walk around the hotel lobby with a video camera and drinking from a water bottle while seeing Teru flipping through a magazine all the while looking like time-traveling aristocratic vampires =

My favorite J-rock band is definitely D'espairsRay, but Versailles kick ass too. I've only got a few others that I listen to currently, though (namely Suicide Ali, alice nine., and Malice Mizer).

All good bands! I'm still warming up to alice nine. after being put off by all the fangirls shoving them down my throat. Same with Gazette/the GazettE. Suicide Ali is a recent discovery for me but I really like what I've heard! Did you see DéspairsRay on the Taste of Chaos tour? I wish this topic came up a few months ago, then maybe y'all could have made it out here for the Versailles show!! ^_^

Japan... Sigh FTW.

YES! Sigh are great! http://www.myspace.com/sighjapan

For anyone who doesn't know, Sigh are going on a U.S. tour with Zimmer's Hole in September! Since the X JAPAN show has been post-poned, I won't have to miss this tour!

Sep. 06 - San Marcos, CA @ Jumping Turtle
Sep. 07 - Anaheim, CA @ Chain Reaction
Sep. 08 - Hollywood, CA @ Knitting Factory
Sep. 09 - Tempe, AZ @ The Clubhouse
Sep. 10 - Albuquerque, NM @ Launch Pad
Sep. 11 - Ft Worth, TX @ Ridglea Theater
Sep. 12 - San Antonio, TX @ White Rabbit
Sep. 13 - Houston, TX @ Meridian
Sep. 14 - Nashville, TN @ The Muse
Sep. 15 - West Springfield, VA @ Jaxx
Sep. 16 - New York City, NY @ B.B. King Blues Club & Grill
Sep. 17 - Montreal, QUE @ FouFounes
Sep. 18 - Sudbury, ONT @ Jubilee Centre
Sep. 19 - Toronto, ONT @ Wreck Room
Sep. 20 - Cleveland, OH @ Peabody's
Sep. 21 - Mokena, IL @ The Pearl Room
Sep. 22 - St Paul, MN @ Station 4

Actually, it looks like there is a bigger push for J-Rock in the states. At least, I see it a lot more at anime cons. It is kinda hard to get out of that niche, tho, particularly when you have mostly non-english vocals.

Eventhough I agree with you, I still don't understand the aversion to non-english vocals. I've been working real hard on opening up other avenues for these bands besides the anime cons. There are a few venues along the west coast and in New York that are hosting Japanese bands, so that's a start! GLAY just announced 3 shows in California, Versailles played there, Miyavi, the super group S.K.I.N.... \m/

There is definitely a bigger push for these bands in the U.S. and it's getting better and better! Did you know that there is an entire festival devoted to j-rock bands?! http://www.jrockrevolution.com The first one was held in 2007 and they plan to do another one, just not sure when yet. There's even talk of it possibly being in Dallas!

Why do people keep calling this "J-Rock"? Can't it be Progressive Power Metal in the Angra, Symphony X, Rhapsody vein?

+1

I think the first step to getting the bands more exposure is to stop pigeon-holing them with labels like "j-rock" eventhough I'm guilty of using it too. I won't get too deep but it's amazing how much a simple "tag" or "label" can affect a band. For example the "Christian" label on many metal and rock bands. Many of them are brilliant musicians who deserve as much recognition as many other "secular" artists, but that label puts off (many) people in the metal world. You've all seen it :Smug: "J-Rock" tells people "this is different than rock, therefore you don't have to treat it the same" yet the musicians are playing the very same styles we all love - and sometimes better!

On the other hand, many bands from Japan DO have melodic differences from regular Western rock and metal and the "J-Rock" tag serves to distinguish that fact, as well as the language of the lyrics. I still hate the label and I use it begrudgingly. The whole community perpetuates it, perhaps to set themselves apart from other fans...? Not sure. Creating a festival that is just for "j-rock" bands and calling it "J-Rock Revolution" doesn't help in preventing sub-categorization.

I can't tell you how bizarre it was to be in the crowd at Versailles. One thing I gotta say for j-rock is it brings together people who wouldn't be in the same room otherwise. I stood there wondering why other symphonic power metal bands don't have legions of rabid 15 year-old fangirls, or if these girls in lolita dresses or vk makeup would even LIKE power metal or be there to see Versailles if the band weren't already lumped in with the "j-rock" and "visual kei" tags. It still confuses me. I guarantee if I played, say, Angra (a big influence on the band) for any of the people in that room, 95% wouldn't have heard of them before, 60% of those people would probably automatically hate it and say "I don't like metal" ("but... Versailles IS metal") - yet ALL of them screamed for the band and sung along with every lyric. That confuses me more than a man in a dress on a stage.

Sorry for the long reply! Thank goodness for the multi-quote button! I'll leave you all with an example of Hizaki's guitar chops:

 

[PM1metal1]

J-Rock or not J-Rock, whatever. It's actually pretty good stuff at its base (yes, the vocals are rough yet somehow typically Japanese to my ears) so that merits some serious investigation IMO.

 

[Bryan316]

That's it.


Every woman I meet, gonna have to give them the Crocodile Dundee check.

 

[Creeps]

Don't you recall folks at first glance with some old hair metal bands going.. those chicks are pretty cute? Some promo pics of Stryper come to mind. They had more makeup on than some strippers.

Welcome to the next generation.


Although wearing a damn dress playing live has to suck, that's gotta be hot.

 

[spag]

I wish this thread had been started last month. I saw that Versailles played in LA on June 3rd, and I totally would have gone to check it out. Show was off my radar.

 

[Perditions Ghost]

All good bands! I'm still warming up to alice nine. after being put off by all the fangirls shoving them down my throat. Same with Gazette/the GazettE. Suicide Ali is a recent discovery for me but I really like what I've heard! Did you see DéspairsRay on the Taste of Chaos tour? I wish this topic came up a few months ago, then maybe y'all could have made it out here for the Versailles show!! ^_^

Nah, I was going to bum a ride off a few of the kids I know that are into Avenged Sevenfold/Atreyu/etc, but didn't have the money to go see D'espairsRay and MUCC only play 20/25 minute sets each.

I'd also love to go see Sigh in NYC, but can't make it with all the other shows going on at the time (And my lack of a license until a few weeks after that)

 

[Cheiron]

And their sound was crappy and they were stuck on one side of the stage but if I recall correctly MUCC was very good.

 

[Daybreaker]

I once knew a guy who was all into this Japanese stuff. So much so he cross dressed. He bought wigs, dresses, make up, and dressed up like a woman. All the posters on his walls were of guys in drag. I found that a little odd. Yes they were "metal bands" but, ehhhh. It was still a little weird for me.

 

[TheLongshot]

Eventhough I agree with you, I still don't understand the aversion to non-english vocals. I've been working real hard on opening up other avenues for these bands besides the anime cons. There are a few venues along the west coast and in New York that are hosting Japanese bands, so that's a start! GLAY just announced 3 shows in California, Versailles played there, Miyavi, the super group S.K.I.N.... m/

Well, I know there was kind of a minifestival of Japanese groups last year at Jaxx. Course, that was footed by a local promoter and might have been more J-Pop from what I saw.

As for the non-english vocal thing, there is a good reason why there are a lot of english language albums from groups of non-english speaking countries. They know that it is a hard sell otherwise. Bands like Rammstein are a rarity.

I think the first step to getting the bands more exposure is to stop pigeon-holing them with labels like "j-rock" eventhough I'm guilty of using it too. I won't get too deep but it's amazing how much a simple "tag" or "label" can affect a band. For example the "Christian" label on many metal and rock bands. Many of them are brilliant musicians who deserve as much recognition as many other "secular" artists, but that label puts off (many) people in the metal world. You've all seen it :Smug: "J-Rock" tells people "this is different than rock, therefore you don't have to treat it the same" yet the musicians are playing the very same styles we all love - and sometimes better!

Maybe someone needs to push Glenn into signing a Japanese metal band, particularly one that isn't a big name like these guys. I mean, that's the point of festivals, isn't it?

Course, there are many barriers for a Japanese band in this country. The travel time just to the west coast is pretty huge. Also, importing stuff from Japan has always been a costly enterprise.

That being said, if NEARFest can bring in Japanese bands, Glenn can too.

Jason

 

[sh0kr0k]

I wish this thread had been started last month. I saw that Versailles played in LA on June 3rd, and I totally would have gone to check it out. Show was off my radar.

I'm sorry I posted a little about Versailles in a Galneryus thread (an older one) a couple months back. No one said anything so I didn't go any further with it. I had known about the shows for months but never thought to post the dates here Well, here are some things going on out your way. Maybe you'll like these bands too:

July 3-6: GaGaalinG @ Anime Expo, Los Angeles, CA
Aug 15 & 16: GLAY @ House of Blues, Los Angeles, CA
Sept 8: Sigh (w/Zimmer's Hole) @ Knitting Factory, Los Angeles, CA
Nov 7-9: Suicide Ali @ PMX 2008

There's a lot more than that, but those might interest you. Please, everyone, check out these sites for other dates/bands:
http://www.jrockeventsusa.com
http://www.jrockrevolution.com

Nah, I was going to bum a ride off a few of the kids I know that are into Avenged Sevenfold/Atreyu/etc, but didn't have the money to go see D'espairsRay and MUCC only play 20/25 minute sets each.

I'd also love to go see Sigh in NYC, but can't make it with all the other shows going on at the time (And my lack of a license until a few weeks after that)

Ugh, yeah that's true about the short sets. I'd bust my ass to get there and spend money I don't really have just for an hour of music. Thankfully, that tour helped those bands gain enormous exposure and popularity, so I'm sure they'll be back soon. Then I'll be able to exorcise this ghost that's haunting me. *crosses fingers* At least it wasn't BUCK-TICK

And their sound was crappy and they were stuck on one side of the stage but if I recall correctly MUCC was very good.

Ain't that always the way :Smug: I had heard a lot about MUCC before but dismissed them as a "nu-metal" thing. I'm glad I took time to listen, because I really enjoy them! Methinks they'll be back soon too!

I once knew a guy who was all into this Japanese stuff. So much so he cross dressed. He bought wigs, dresses, make up, and dressed up like a woman. All the posters on his walls were of guys in drag. I found that a little odd. Yes they were "metal bands" but, ehhhh. It was still a little weird for me.

That happens to everyone! ..at first! As for your friend cross-dressing on a regular basis, well, that's just his thing. If visual kei bands were his model, I bet he probably looked better than most girls!

Well, I know there was kind of a minifestival of Japanese groups last year at Jaxx. Course, that was footed by a local promoter and might have been more J-Pop from what I saw.

Oh really? Do you remember the name of the event, by chance? There's a minifestival of sorts at SXSW each year too. Still haven't seen anyone on that bill that I'd be interested in though, but it's only a matter of time. I'm guilty of liking more than my fair share of J-Pop.

As for the non-english vocal thing, there is a good reason why there are a lot of english language albums from groups of non-english speaking countries. They know that it is a hard sell otherwise. Bands like Rammstein are a rarity.

Oh I'm not disagreeing, I just wonder WHY it's true. It's too bad that the general market has an aversion to non-English music. I'm sure I already know why, but I probably better keep my mouth shut and wish for happy things. It's true that a lot of bands are making English-language discs because there is more of a call for it... but again, why insist on the language of the music? Seems silly to me, really. Many bands include lyric sheets or have translations that are a click away. I don't see Japan demanding that Dream Theater sing in Japanese. Or any other country for that matter. The "English is the most dominant language" argument doesn't work for me either. Whether it's in Japanese or German, Greek, Swedish, Portuguese or whatever - the fact that American's can't consume it until it's in English irritates me to no end. But you know I understand what you're saying. It's a fact. I just hate it.

Maybe someone needs to push Glenn into signing a Japanese metal band, particularly one that isn't a big name like these guys. I mean, that's the point of festivals, isn't it?

The travel time just to the west coast is pretty huge.

That being said, if NEARFest can bring in Japanese bands, Glenn can too.

If BAR Fest can do it--- well, I don't know the circumstances around that, so I can't use that as an easy example. BAR Fest might have gotten a deal or Concerto Moon could be local or paying for it themselves, so that might be an exception. I don't know if NEARFest and ProgPowerUSA have the same budgets, but Glenn also has to take into account the sponsor submissions. So between cost, all the other variables, AND if anyone puts a band on the sponsor list... there are just many barriers. But it's not impossible! It might require some coordination with other events like J-Rock Revolution or a con or two, but that's not so bad. I think the biggest part is having the desire to see the band instead of the financial benefits of hosting them, so I don't know if it would be in the cards for ProgPower. Glenn brings us bands we want to see, yes, but it's a balancing act with other important factors.

Anyway, you know all of this already. Maybe it will happen! Afterall, the PP family are showing the also like bands that don't fit neatly in the box (see: Volbeat, Mustasch, Amorphis) and I suspect that trend will continue. I could easily see bands like Meshuggah, Dark Tranquillity, or even Moi dix Mois, UnsraW, and others fitting in with the PP crowd if it continues to move forward in the direction it is. Now if Glenn, by a miracle of the gods, could pull of a reunion show of an old favorite from the Japanese scene, that would bring in all kinds of new fans! Malice Mizer, Sex Machineguns, X JAPAN, or Phantasmagoria would have people coming out of the woodwork. Then again, we'd be over-run with 15 year-old fangirls too.

Moi dix Mois
​

 

[sh0kr0k]

Links to buy Versailles' 'Lyrical Sympathy' and/or 'The Revenant Choir'


As expected, you can purchase "Lyrical Symphony" from their State-side distributor Tainted Reality.
http://www.taintedreality.net - just click on "shop", scroll down to "shop by band"... BTW, a "mini-cd" is not a 3" disc. It's a term used by a lot of Asian labels to describe a CD that is longer than an EP but not quite an LP. This has only 7 songs, and "The Revenant Choir" isn't on it (for some stupid reason)

CDJAPAN
http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/detailview.html?KEY=SASCD-27
This is a highly-respectable vendor. You can read reviews too. On the right is a pre-order for the first full-length disc "NOBLE" w/DVD (region 2 though).

EBAY
Auction #1...You know this already. Versailles have major fangirl support, so you're never too far away from something related to the band.

Cheers!

 

[TheLongshot]

Oh really? Do you remember the name of the event, by chance? There's a minifestival of sorts at SXSW each year too. Still haven't seen anyone on that bill that I'd be interested in though, but it's only a matter of time. I'm guilty of liking more than my fair share of J-Pop.

Akiba Fest

http://www.afxakibafest.com/

It looks like they put on multiple events on the east coast.

Oh I'm not disagreeing, I just wonder WHY it's true.

Probably because most of us as a culture are very English-centric. In general we don't usually have to deal with another language. Now, that might be different if you live in a multicultural environment like I do, where going down the street you could be dealing with 4-5 different native languages, but for most Americans, they aren't really exposed to that kind of multiculturism.

Also, some of it probably comes from record executives, who don't think that that kind of thing would go over with the general public.

If BAR Fest can do it--- well, I don't know the circumstances around that, so I can't use that as an easy example. BAR Fest might have gotten a deal or Concerto Moon could be local or paying for it themselves, so that might be an exception.

BARFest is also on the West Coast, which makes it easier.

Anyway, you know all of this already. Maybe it will happen! Afterall, the PP family are showing the also like bands that don't fit neatly in the box (see: Volbeat, Mustasch, Amorphis) and I suspect that trend will continue. I could easily see bands like Meshuggah, Dark Tranquillity, or even Moi dix Mois, UnsraW, and others fitting in with the PP crowd if it continues to move forward in the direction it is. Now if Glenn, by a miracle of the gods, could pull of a reunion show of an old favorite from the Japanese scene, that would bring in all kinds of new fans! Malice Mizer, Sex Machineguns, X JAPAN, or Phantasmagoria would have people coming out of the woodwork. Then again, we'd be over-run with 15 year-old fangirls too.

I hope Glenn does continue to push the envelope. It is that aspect that still makes NEARFest attractive to me, even tho I'm bummed for not being able to go this year.

Jason

 

[Perditions Ghost]

Anyway, you know all of this already. Maybe it will happen! Afterall, the PP family are showing the also like bands that don't fit neatly in the box (see: Volbeat, Mustasch, Amorphis) and I suspect that trend will continue. I could easily see bands like Meshuggah, Dark Tranquillity, or even Moi dix Mois, UnsraW, and others fitting in with the PP crowd if it continues to move forward in the direction it is.

I could see Meshuggah (Though maybe they're edging towards too big? I don't really know how big they are), and to be honest I've never heard Moi dix Mois or UnsraW (though I'll check them both out right now, especially since you just posted a MDM video), but - Dark Tranquillity? I don't think I could ever see them on the ProgPower stage.

 

[Entropiastrife]

@ sh0kr0k

dude, did you listen to both the versailles tune and x japan tune that I posted back to back? You can clearly hear a very similar structure, when the band comes in: an intro riff that sounds the same, then a similar melodic guitar section, and then a similar verse riff. And I hear other similar influences with the chorus, bridge, solo section as well. It really sounds like versailles listened to silent jealousy all day on monday and then tuesday thought they were coming up with a completely original song. I am not even saying that I do not like them, but I consider them just a revamped version of x-japan fans trying to write x-japan music, kind of like what primal fear is to judas priest. And anyway, both x-japan and versailles are visual kei bands as well, and x-japan have a tone of symphonic and power metal elements... so comeon now

 

[TBJ]

Two years ago I would have laughed at this, however, having a boyfriend who is into J-Rock and J-goth has made me open my mind to bands like Malice Mizer, Moi dix mois and these guys.

All great bands, if you can get past the melodramatic vocal style.

 

[Pellaz]

@ sh0kr0k

dude, ...

Anyone who would look at sh0kr0k's pic and call her 'dude'........


.....has probably been looking at a lot of J-Rock visual kei band-pics lately!

 

[sh0kr0k]

Akiba Fest

http://www.afxakibafest.com/

It looks like they put on multiple events on the east coast.

Thanks for that link! I'll be keeping an eye on it for updates!

Probably because most of us as a culture are very English-centric. In general we don't usually have to deal with another language. Now, that might be different if you live in a multicultural environment like I do, where going down the street you could be dealing with 4-5 different native languages, but for most Americans, they aren't really exposed to that kind of multiculturism.

Also, some of it probably comes from record executives, who don't think that that kind of thing would go over with the general public.

Yeah, you're probably dead on with both. Maybe things will change in the future, as demand grows. It's promising when bands like Dir en grey are embraced with open arms, even if it took a tour with KoRn for people to discover them.

I could see Meshuggah (Though maybe they're edging towards too big? I don't really know how big they are), and to be honest I've never heard Moi dix Mois or UnsraW (though I'll check them both out right now, especially since you just posted a MDM video), but - Dark Tranquillity? I don't think I could ever see them on the ProgPower stage.

You don't think Dark Tranquillity could fit? I'm talking about in the future if the fest continues to pursue bands that don't fit neatly into the prog or power genres but appeal to the fans. MdM doesn't fit the current mold either, and certainly not UnsraW.... Meshuggah could get away with being on the bill right now as an oddball band. It would have to be in the future, but I don't see DT or any of them being out of the question. Then again, maybe the fest won't keep going down this path and will just stick to straight prog and power metal with an occasional divergent act.

@ sh0kr0k

dude, did you listen to both the versailles tune and x japan tune that I posted back to back? You can clearly hear a very similar structure, when the band comes in: an intro riff that sounds the same, then a similar melodic guitar section, and then a similar verse riff. And I hear other similar influences with the chorus, bridge, solo section as well. It really sounds like versailles listened to silent jealousy all day on monday and then tuesday thought they were coming up with a completely original song. I am not even saying that I do not like them, but I consider them just a revamped version of x-japan fans trying to write x-japan music, kind of like what primal fear is to judas priest. And anyway, both x-japan and versailles are visual kei bands as well, and x-japan have a tone of symphonic and power metal elements... so comeon now

Did you just ask me if I've ever listened to Silent Jealousy? There are a lot of similarities between the songs.. a lot. But I'm not ready to admit that Versailles is an X JAPAN wannabe, sorry. There are still way too many differences to say anything other than X JAPAN being an influence. Just because both bands have symphonic and power metal elements and are visual kei (only a term since they look nothing alike) doesn't mean one band is a revamped version of the other. I don't see it. You could say the same thing about Malice Mizer... or Phantasmagoria, Moi dix Mois, Gram∞Maria, Raphael, Sadie, Maximum the Hormone, and Onmyouza all fit that description, even have similar riffs to X JAPAN but aren't clones. I can admit there are similarities but I can't say Versailles are a ripoff. I think Versailles bring other things and influences to the table too. Just my opinion, I guess.

Two years ago I would have laughed at this, however, having a boyfriend who is into J-Rock and J-goth has made me open my mind to bands like Malice Mizer, Moi dix mois and these guys.

All great bands, if you can get past the melodramatic vocal style.

Glad you found some bands to enjoy! Good choices too If you want something a little easier on the ears but still different enough (and good enough! lol!) try BUCK-TICK.

Anyone who would look at sh0kr0k's pic and call her 'dude'........


.....has probably been looking at a lot of J-Rock visual kei band-pics lately!

too bad I just changed my icon the day before!

 

[sh0kr0k]

A little something for those who like their girls to actually be girls

Onmyouza (陰陽座 or Onmyo-za)
Song: "Kouga Ninpou Chou" theme song for the anime "Basilisk"
​

 

[TheLongshot]

Heh. I just picked up the complete series of Basilisk last month.

Jason