Drum Triggering

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

I was talking to a fiend who is a drummer, and real knowledgeable on drumming in the metal scene. . . or, I guess it would be fairer to say I'm trying to find out if he is knowledgeable or not.

We listened to a song by Dino Cavarez's new band Divine Heresy, and he thought he was triggering. I didn't know what triggering was. He explained it is this process that will electronically put in more beats when you hit a drum. So, when you hit the bass drum, it sounds two beats (you can use it for any of the drums, though, apparently). We thought that was how he was getting his insane speed. But then I looked him up on Youtube (drummer's name is Tim Yeung), and nope, he is just fast as hell.

Now, to me, no self respecting metal band would put drum triggering in their music, or if they did, they would just come out and admit it. It just seems like cheating. Now, I don't care if it is used a little bit--on Between The Buried and Me's Colors, they use it in a couple spots in one of the songs (or he has inhumanly fast feet), and that's cool. It is pretty obvious. But if metal bands are using it all the time to get those crazy runs, that is down right lame.

Like I said, I have a hard time believing many metal bands are doing this, but it seems like the double bass players are getting faster and faster. I was just listening to samples of a band called Despised Icon, and it is INSANE. I looked up a video, specifically one of the drummer, and I couldn't help but notice that they never showed his foot work, even though he does brag about it. A little suspicious.

So, does anyone know what the deal is with triggering? Personally, if a band falls back on triggering, I don't want to listen to them. But these double bass players have to peak at some point. There can only be so fast. And yet I keep hearing ones faster and faster. Now this triggering thing is always in the back of my head, like a nuisance.

 

[V.V.V.V.V.]

Most modern death metal bands use triggers because double bass is extremely stupidly hard to keep in time going some of the speeds a lot of bands do. Get over it. It's not cheating; it's not a crutch. They still have insane stamina and skill, it just makes one of their jobs that much more efficient and simple.

 

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

They can't go fast enough on the double bass, so they speed it up electronically. Can you please elaborate on how that isn't a crutch? So, if a guitar player records a solo, but wants it to be faster and speeds up the track, that isn't a crutch either?

I just think it's kind of lame. They are giving a false impression. If you can't go fast enough on the double bass, then don't. There are other drums there to keep time. I think the double bass thing is getting overused anyways with bands like Dimmu Borgir. It gets way too repetitive.

 

[Krow]

So, does anyone know what the deal is with triggering? Personally, if a band falls back on triggering, I don't want to listen to them.

*calls the WAHHHHHmbulance*

Seriously... if the music is good... but you have to complain about how they're doing it... you're just being a bitch.

 

[V.V.V.V.V.]

Please stop making arguments about things you don't understand.

 

[MasterOLightning]

OP is not understanding triggers. It doesn't put in two beats. If you use your brain a little you can see how there would be a world of problems that would arise if that was indeed the case. Triggers do not make you faster. It plays a pre-recorded sample, "triggered" by hitting the drum. It is primarily used for bass drums because the size of the resonance chamber and drum head make it hard to get a clear and consistent sound at high speeds. I don't think it is extremely challenging to play fast double bass with a very high quality pedal.

Triggers can make sense for snare drums too, because it can be tough to hit the snare with much force when playing fast blastbeats. You'd have a huge difference in sound between fills and hard hits, and blasting hits. In a studio you can work around this with mic placement and mixing, but it's easier to go with triggers live.

 

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

Well, then could you explain it to me?

And I'm sorry if it makes me a "bitch," but yes, I do care about how they are doing it.

I wasn't trying to insult anyone. I was just trying to learn what triggering was about. I apologize. (sarcasm)

 

[V.V.V.V.V.]

You can Google it.

 

[Krigloch the Furious]

who the hell speeds it up?
Go listen to George from Nile. It's triggered for a reason. So every time he hits the bass drums, they have the exact same sound and volume.

 

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

OP is not understanding triggers. It doesn't put in two beats. If you use your brain a little you can see how there would be a world of problems that would arise if that was indeed the case. Triggers do not make you faster. It plays a pre-recorded sample, "triggered" by hitting the drum. It is primarily used for bass drums because the size of the resonance chamber and drum head make it hard to get a clear and consistent sound at high speeds. I don't think it is extremely challenging to play fast double bass with a very high quality pedal.

Triggers can make sense for snare drums too, because it can be tough to hit the snare with much force when playing fast blastbeats. You'd have a huge difference in sound between fills and hard hits, and blasting hits. In a studio you can work around this with mic placement and mixing, but it's easier to go with triggers live.

Okay, so triggering doesn't necessarily mean that it will put in another beat when you hit the drum, just that it doesn't matter how hard you hit. I can deal with that.

Thanks for actually explaining triggering, rather than just insulting me.

 

[V.V.V.V.V.]

Google can also do that pretty well

 

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

You can Google it.

Or you could have explained it to me, rather than being a dick. Or just said Google it from the get go, rather than, again, being a dick.

 

[AchrisK]

Or you could have explained it to me, rather than being a dick. Or just said Google it from the get go, rather than, again, being a dick.

I don't think HE understood what triggering was.

 

[Vossyrus]

I can understand why triggers are used and everything but gah, I'm not very fond of hearing triggered drums on an album. It makes everything sound so monotonous and soulless to me, regardless of how fast the guy is drumming.

And I'm not sure if it's directly associated with drum triggering, but I fucking hate "clicky" sounding drums.

 

[Rumpole]

I agree, clicky drums are a deal breaker for me.

 

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

I can understand why triggers are used and everything but gah, I'm not very fond of hearing triggered drums on an album. It makes everything sound so monotonous and soulless to me, regardless of how fast the guy is drumming.

And I'm not sure if it's directly associated with drum triggering, but I fucking hate "clicky" sounding drums.

Exactly. When a band goes insane with the double bass (especially when blasting) it all kind of muddles together and sounds the same. I like double bass and blasting, but use it a bit more sparingly for effect rather than falling back on double bass for the normal tempos. I am amazed by these drummers, but some of them need to calm down a bit.

 

[AchrisK]

I like it all different ways. Whatever. Yeah, I think it takes more musical talent to keep from relying on pure speed and precision, but pure speed and precision is also hella-cool, as long as it is part of music that is worthy.

 

[waif]

OP is not understanding triggers. It doesn't put in two beats. If you use your brain a little you can see how there would be a world of problems that would arise if that was indeed the case. Triggers do not make you faster. It plays a pre-recorded sample, "triggered" by hitting the drum. It is primarily used for bass drums because the size of the resonance chamber and drum head make it hard to get a clear and consistent sound at high speeds. I don't think it is extremely challenging to play fast double bass with a very high quality pedal.

Yeah, that's what I thought; I was wondering if maybe I was wrong but in fact the more probable assumption is true; the noob knows nothing.

I can understand why triggers are used and everything but gah, I'm not very fond of hearing triggered drums on an album. It makes everything sound so monotonous and soulless to me, regardless of how fast the guy is drumming.

That's not really true, though. You can't really tell the difference until the speed really picks up, unless the drummer does a lot of subtle work and various the force of the hits, in which case a band would use an acoustic set in the studio. Triggers are often used live by bands that use acoustic drums in the studio, I believe, because in the studio as masteroflightening pointed out you can use mic placement to get the sound you want but live the double bass have to hit full force.

And I'm not sure if it's directly associated with drum triggering, but I fucking hate "clicky" sounding drums.

Not at all associated; very common with acoustic drums as well. I like a slightly clicky sound, but many bands, especially death metal, overdo it.

 

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

Yeah, that's what I thought; I was wondering if maybe I was wrong but in fact the more probable assumption is true; the noob knows nothing.

Fuck you, WeAreInFlames, you have done pretty much nothing but insult me in threads, whether it be my musical taste or anything else for that matter. Did you not read the part where I SAID I was trying to find out if this was correct? Hell, in one thread where I actually asked for some recommendations on bands that you deemed were "good," you didn't answer. I guess when you can't be a douchebag, you take less of an initiative in answering questions. Whatever.

 

[Episteme]

Calm down.

The best way to get a good drum sound in the studio for a record is to mic up the bass drums with proper placement as well as triggering it. That way you get the dynamics from the air vibrations in and around the bass drum and also you get the thick consistent sound that you require. Contrary to layman's belief, there is NOTHING wrong with triggers.