A New Argument

[glennsmetal]

Ok, here's a new arguement for us. I bring this up because this 18 year old kid at school thinks Zepplin started metal and is metal and swears that Jimmy Page is a heavy metal guitar player. Granted Page is fabulous on guitar but in no way, are Zepplin metal, or that Page is a heavy metal guitar player. I also love Robert Plant's voice. Hell the kid thinks that Def Leppard is metal and the only thing Ozzy is known for his biting a head off a bat and does nothing but screams and yells. I tiried to get this kid to listen to a CD I made for him and he won't. All he does is claim stupid arguemens with no grounds. I'm about ready to throw this kid into a pit.

GLENN:

 

[LIZ METAL]

Some people think it was Zepplin.....some Black Sabbeth....others say it was this band, that band.....I say: who cares? Metal has evolved so much and has branched off into so many genres, it's hard to say what band belongs to which genre. Metal then was pretty much anything loud and offensive....and morals were strict then. Everything was taken to heart and seriously back in the day. Soceity is laid back moreso now. Metal is more aggresive and hard.

This is what I think anyways...if I'm wrong(I'm young...what the Hell would I know? ) then maybe one of the Old-schoolers would like to throw in their input.

 

[Deadly Embrace]

I agree with most of what Liz had to say, Led Zeppelin was heavy back in their time period, Zeppelin is as much Metal as it is Blues.........It's a mixture of both, but was instrumental in influenceing other musicians & bands to break ground that was barely touched upon(back then). Metallica is today, what Zeppelin was yesterday. But Metal has evolved through its history, & has gone to extremes, as well as regress(back to older styles). What we do know is that history repeats itself, as well as in music. I'm lucky enough(& old enough) that I saw them once(Presence Tour), & they defineatly influenced me & my musical tastes. I would list them, along with early Ted Nugent, U F O, Aerosmith, Sabbath, & AC/DC, as bands that shaped me while I was young. I continued getting into heavier & heavier types of music because of them. Always evolving farther, as friends of mine stopped where they were. I still have friends that only listen to the older Classic bands, & think what I listen to is shit(to loud & to fast). I still enjoy the old classics, but I've always been ahead of the mainstream, & continue to evolve............................Nice Topic Glen.......

 

[glennsmetal]

Well, when I first started listening to music as a youngster back in the late 70's early 80's I started listening to bands and people like Pat Benatar, Fleetwod Mac, Rush, and a whole slew of others. I didn't even know what heavy metal was then but at that time Zepplin was popular as Sabbath was. I just never really got into metal until about 81 or 82 when I first heard Dio's "Holy Diver". From that point on, I knew my life was going to change and for the better. In some ways I consider that album one of metal's greatest influences. Zepplin did a good job of starting things with their own style of music and influencing bands. They allowed bands and metal music to go into all different directions but, I still don't consider Zepplin Metal. That's just me though. I never will say I didn't like Zepplin. I have the upmost respect for them and how they changed the face of music and allowed music for what it came to be today. Did that make sence. I guess all I'm saying, nobody really knows where metal started. That wasa good observation Liz pointed out. Hell some people say that bands like Yes had a roll in it, in some ways they did but they weren't metal. Same with Rush but with Rush they were more metal back in those days than the other bands mentioned. Anyway, I'm rambling now. Glad I opned this topic up.


GLENN

 

[neal]

id say zepplin is just as metal as sabbath. i wouldnt really call either one metal though. i think metal started in the very late 70s early 80s with bands like maiden and metallica. i think thats kinda where it changed from rock/blues to actual metal with metal riffing and speed and power an shit.
-neal

 

[MindInsane]

OK..you know what they say about opinions..but here goes..

Zeppelin definetly got the ball rolling in the right direction..but the true metal godfathers were Sabbath. I think Zep was more on the alternative/prog side of the coin..where Sabbath was truley metal to the bone!

I'm very thankful to both of them for getting rid of the happy go lucky I wanna hold your hand main stream and adding an awesome pair of genres to the mix..which left room for the endless variations of both which we headbang to today!!

 

[MacMoney]

Led Zeppelin weren't that metal in the early days. Achilles Last Stand for example does have metal moments but it appeared in Zeppelin's mid-70's albums.

Black Sabbath on the other hand had metal songs in their albums from the beginning. The self-titled song, N.I.B etc.

 

[batmura]

-

 

[batmura]

Originally posted by Mezarkabul
The kid is right about Ozzy. He fucking sucks. He's an overrated charlatan. Nothing else. Everything he's done after Diary of a Madman sucks shit. He died when Randy died.

 

[Officer Nice]

There is no debate.
There is no argument.
All that heavy metal is, is ONLY because of
the godfathers of heavy metal, BLACK SABBATH.
The Lyrics, The image, the riffs, the concepts...the sound
all given birth in 1970 by Ozzy,Tony, Geezer and Bill.
Zeppelin isn't hard rock, it's not metal. It's just rock.
A reflection of the hippie shit days.

Hands Down Period.

-OfficerNice

 

[MindInsane]

Originally posted by OfficerNice
There is no debate.
There is no argument.
All that heavy metal is, is ONLY because of
the godfathers of heavy metal, BLACK SABBATH.
The Lyrics, The image, the riffs, the concepts...the sound
all given birth in 1970 by Ozzy,Tony, Geezer and Bill.
Zeppelin isn't hard rock, it's not metal. It's just rock.
A reflection of the hippie shit days.

Hands Down Period.

-OfficerNice

Hey Officer...why don't ya quit sugar coating it and start telling us what you really think

 

[glennsmetal]

Well like I said I will never say Zepplin was a bad band. I will always respect them. They had a little hard rock bluesy style to them that made people think they have had some influences to metal or that they are metal. They are NOT metal. Ok, that is as far as I can go with this debate lol.

GLENN

 

[speed]

Yes, I too am wondering if Officer Nice dislikes Led Zeppelin, utter blasphemy I say.

 

[Deadly Embrace]

____________________________________________________
Originally Posted By Glennsmetal:............."They had a little hard rock bluesy style to them that made people think they have had some influences to metal or that they are metal. They are NOT metal. Ok, that is as far as I can go with this debate lol. "
____________________________________________________

Well Glenn, so you are saying that the 1977 Concert I went to, featuring Led Zeppelin------Judas Priest-------&-----Rick Derringer,
was not a metal concert? Come on I've always been into metal, & this was Metal, no way this was a Blues Festival, this was a concert with Metal fans, complete with women, drugs & alcohol, thats Rock'n Roll, thats as heavy as it got back then................I was at AC/DC concerts in that period also, but thats not metal either according to your previous posts, AC/DC also has alot of Blues in it, but its more Metal, & heavier than Zeppelin. I'm old enough to see Metal form before my eyes, I did not close them while it was starting, I lived it.............................then evolved from its conception..............Alot of younger people were born after its conception & don't know how it started, it was just already there............Not my case.

 

[Officer Nice]

Originally posted by speed
Yes, I too am wondering if Officer Nice dislikes Led Zeppelin, utter blasphemy I say.

It's not a question of like/dislike. Zep did great music.
But I'm so sick and tired of everyone and everything in
commercial mainstream media calling them the founders
of metal. They're not.

So to respond to the utter blasphemy comment-
read my post.

-OfficerNice.

 

[desert_demon]

I agree with OfficerNice - there is no argument. Black Sabbath started it all, the ominous sound and heavy riffing started with Sabbath, not Zeppelin. That's not to say that Led Zep weren't heavy every now and then, but the base of their sound, particularly in their first albums was the blues, hell, they even covered many blues standards in ther live shows. True enough, Black Sabbath were originally a blues band back when they were an unsigned band called Earth but from their first album they had definetly gone into a new direction with a sound unheard of before - metal!

 

[speed]

Well i reread your first post, and Led Zeppelin hippie shit? Hmm, i cant figure that out, I do know that all of those lame terrible 80's hair bands, seemed to be trying with their incredibly limited talents, to recreate Zeppelin, and they all of course failed. Yet in the end, I think it is safe to say Zep was a far better band than Sabbath- although i love sabbaths very first album- anyway Zeppelin tried so many ideas, and styles it doesnt matter if they werent metal- Zep is timeless- like the stones- and will always have a significant impact on anyone that plays hard rock, or metal.