A7X - Nightmare

[Fire breath]

Definitely talented but this album isn't even worth a free download IMO. I hate the stupid cursing for a start, makes them sound childish. I don't like the vocals too much as he sounds like a whiny little bitch. The production is good though, the guitar solos are the best thing about it by a mile, but this is not enough to save it for me. Sticking to cheesy power metal here. Over to you.

 

[Bear]

I like it, very cool imo. Portnoy sounds great too as usual...

Bear

 

[nomisofsiman]

It's amazing how this band is either loved or hated. I don't get it. I thought the album was pretty damn good. A return to form to the City of Evil-type sound apposed to the atrocious self-titled. Guitar work is fantastic and I like the vocals. No one sounds like Shadows. So what if the guy swears? It's not like the songs are covered with them and they're doing them for the sake of doing them, i.e. Taking Dawn.

 

[hoodaman]

I've never liked them. I've tried to listen to them multiple times and every time it's the same thing. Bait and switch b.s. The song starts off decent enough with a fun heavy riff then about 90 seconds in it turns into whiny punk rock. Not for me.

 

[Palabra de Dios]

False metal to the extreme. Up there with Trivium in the category of 'metal' bands that annoy me most.

 

[AngraRULES]

False metal to the extreme. Up there with Trivium in the category of 'metal' bands that annoy me most.

I have two questions for you, mainly out of curiosity.

1) What do you classify as false metal? What makes a band a "false metal" band?

2) Does it really matter if they don't fit into the "real metal" class? Is metal really the only style of music that you listen to and therefore you think other music sucks?

Mind you, I am not trying to cause controversy or be an ass. I am just curious as to what your personal opinion on the matter is.

As for the song in the video, I think it's very uninspired. The chorus final line sounds like one of the crappy new Metallica choruses.

 

[Palabra de Dios]

I have two questions for you, mainly out of curiosity.

1) What do you classify as false metal? What makes a band a "false metal" band?

2) Does it really matter if they don't fit into the "real metal" class? Is metal really the only style of music that you listen to and therefore you think other music sucks?

I do not only listen to metal. I've only really been listening to true metal for about seven years now, so I there's no way I can say that I only listen to metal. And there are many, many, MANY bands and artists I love and respect who are not metal. But they are also not charlatans.

There are many reasons as to why Avenged Sevenfold is false metal. Mostly not from the band themselves. I don't know if the band thinks they are a metal band. If they do, they are wrong. But they've gotten everything wrong. Nothing they do comes close to the attitude, feeling, or reason behind metal or why the style is even played. They changed their style to sell more records. Fuck that.

They are marketed, sold, accepted, and discussed through mass media as a metal band. The same way fucking stupid shit like Enuff Z' Nuff and White Lion was back in the day. Most of those hair bands weren't metal either, and neither is this shit. Neither was KoRn or Mudvayne. Neither was Saliva or Linkin Park. Neither was Godsmack. Neither was like 90% of the bands talked about on VH-1 classic. It's false. And metalcore is false too. They all bear striking resemblances to metal. Riffs. Double Bass. Even these bands can shred (ooh boy, they play this shit outta those harmonic minor scales). But it's not metal. It doesn't come close.

But back to Avenged Sevenfold. They started out as a sort-of-okay hardcore band with cool album art, and turned into a mockery of a genre that they didn't even belong to. Trivium did the same thing. THE SAME FUCKING THING. And Matt Heafy is even more annoying that Slim Shady or whatever the singer of Avenged Sevenfold calls his ass. That shit's stupid too. I barely like it when black metal bands do it.

So, the answer to your questions boils down to this: just because a band isn't metal doesn't mean I won't like them. At all. But this band is sold as metal and they're not--even close. Like Kool-Aid being sold as juice. Not at all. Looks like it could be juice. It's liquid, like juice. Sweet, like juice. Not at all juice. Same with Avenged Sevenfold. False juice. False metal.

 

[mitchgx]

Eh...I think the whole "false metal" rant is a load of horseshit. There's no true or false; there's just music. I think it's cool that a band like Avenged Sevenfold, that is something of a "Hot Topic" band with a gothic/punk/emo fanbase, incorporates influences from classic Euro power metal. Think of them as a gateway band...maybe that kid with the eyeliner and Jack Skellington knit cap will be inspired to pick up a Maiden or Helloween album to check out where some of Avenged Sevenfold's musical ideas came from.

I think they write some decent stuff. More power to 'em.


eta: Also, no dissin' of Enuff Z'nuff. It's not entirely their fault they got lumped into the hair metal camp (ok, maybe it is...they chose to look that way). They were essentially a power pop band with heavier guitars, and they wrote some seriously tasty and catchy tunes.

 

[Rick Pierpont]

I like these guys and just heard this CD for the first time today and like it. Portnoy does a great job, but so did the Rev. In fact, Portnoy plays in the style of Rev on this disk (that is what they were going for). I even love the "atrocious" self-titled CD. I thought it was genious and more adventurous than some of the formulaic prog that is becoming more prevalent these days. The guitar players can really play, their old school Maiden, Megadeth, etc.. influences come out loud and clear (especially on City of Evil) too. I don't care what genre it is, all I know is that they do make good music and I like it. I do agree that the singer takes getting used to, but his voice matches the music.

 

[halcyonwayband@aol.com]

I like this album as well. Nightmare is the best song IMO, it has the best hook, but the rest of it is pretty good. I don't care if a band is "metal" or "metalcore" or "prog" or whatever, if they write good songs I like them.

 

[AngraRULES]

I do not only listen to metal. I've only really been listening to true metal for about seven years now, so I there's no way I can say that I only listen to metal. And there are many, many, MANY bands and artists I love and respect who are not metal. But they are also not charlatans.

You surely come across differently than that. Why would you consider a band a group of "charlatans" simply because they play a style that you don't like? I don't wanna sound like a dick man, but really, who are you to call ANY artist in the world charlatans? I mean sure, if you wanna say that to a pop artist who lip-synchs, doesn't write their own music and such (Paris Hilton comes to mind), than I'll agree. A7X may not play the best music in the world, but they certainly are not charlatans.

There are many reasons as to why Avenged Sevenfold is false metal. Mostly not from the band themselves. I don't know if the band thinks they are a metal band. If they do, they are wrong. But they've gotten everything wrong. Nothing they do comes close to the attitude, feeling, or reason behind metal or why the style is even played. They changed their style to sell more records. Fuck that.

You surely are entitled to your own opinion. All I can say (if I may), is that the whole "True Metal" and "False Metal" argument is a load of crap. It's stupid and childish if you ask me. Sure, heavy metal is consider a lifestyle and more than just a genre of music, but ultimately it simply is A STYLE OF MUSIC. I don't know about you, but A7X sounds like metal (not all the time, though, I agree). The whole attitude, feeling, reason thing... I don't know if I buy crap. When I think of bands that are amazing metal bands (Redemption, let's say for instance) don't really strike me as a group of people who go around eating metal and shitting chains. I don't know man, I don't think it's worth it the whole "Battle against "False Metal". To me it's almost like waiting until you meet Santa Claus. But that's just my opinion, not a fact.

They are marketed, sold, accepted, and discussed through mass media as a metal band. The same way fucking stupid shit like Enuff Z' Nuff and White Lion was back in the day. Most of those hair bands weren't metal either, and neither is this shit. Neither was KoRn or Mudvayne. Neither was Saliva or Linkin Park. Neither was Godsmack. Neither was like 90% of the bands talked about on VH-1 classic. It's false. And metalcore is false too. They all bear striking resemblances to metal. Riffs. Double Bass. Even these bands can shred (ooh boy, they play this shit outta those harmonic minor scales). But it's not metal. It doesn't come close.

No offense dude, I'll agree with you about Enuff Z Nuff, Linkin Park, Saliva, KoRn, Godsmack and Mudvayne. Other than that, all I have to say is that quote was a big LOL. There's no such thing as false metal. Get over it. Believe me, this is the type of shit that someday you're gonna look back and think "Wow, how pointless it was to argue that for years." It doesn't make you look more metal in the metal scale.

But back to Avenged Sevenfold. They started out as a sort-of-okay hardcore band with cool album art, and turned into a mockery of a genre that they didn't even belong to. Trivium did the same thing. THE SAME FUCKING THING. And Matt Heafy is even more annoying that Slim Shady or whatever the singer of Avenged Sevenfold calls his ass. That shit's stupid too. I barely like it when black metal bands do it.

M. Shadows is the vocalist for A7X. Slim Shady is Eminem. Is he false metal too?

So, the answer to your questions boils down to this: just because a band isn't metal doesn't mean I won't like them. At all. But this band is sold as metal and they're not--even close. Like Kool-Aid being sold as juice. Not at all. Looks like it could be juice. It's liquid, like juice. Sweet, like juice. Not at all juice. Same with Avenged Sevenfold. False juice. False metal.

I am glad to hear that you like stuff way beyond the metal scene. I will say that although I disagree with you in most of what you said in your post, your Kool-Aid to juice comparison and quote is great. It seriously turned your post from a big senseless rant into something that I will remember for a long time. I am dead serious. I will probably steal your analogy and use it many times. But not with metal. After all, there's no such thing as real metal and false metal.

By the way bro, keep in mind that the fact that I disagree with you does not make me like you any less. I hope to see you next year since I'm missing PP this year.

 

[TribunalRecords]

the band has always been crap in my opinion, both musically and the life that they lead and promote. hell, i remember reading a story that sounded like it was taken from Motley Crue book, and then a few years later one of them is dead due to an overdose (aka "natural causes" in California). but for me musically, they are boring and haven't evolved one bit from their Good Life days. the first album was decent for the time.

i can understand Portnoy wanting to get his "rock on" but i wish he could have picked a more respectable band because i have lost a bit of respect for him for this and the fact that he continues to believe himself a "singer" which he most definitely is not. he should take a lesson from Neil Peart. you don't have to sing the words you write. haha. ok, that is my pot shot at him for the night.

 

[nomisofsiman]

i can understand Portnoy wanting to get his "rock on" but i wish he could have picked a more respectable band because i have lost a bit of respect for him for this and the fact that he continues to believe himself a "singer" which he most definitely is not. he should take a lesson from Neil Peart. you don't have to sing the words you write. haha. ok, that is my pot shot at him for the night.

So, because Portnoy liked this band (before the Rev died) and out of respect, played in the studio and on the road after he died, you've lost respect for him? It's cool if you don't like the band, but I don't think Portnoy did this because he wanted a chance to be with a more popular band. He did it out of respect, especially considering their drummer was a fan of his. If anything I respect him more for doing something like that as a person. Though I agree with you as he really needs to stop trying to sing when he can't.

 

[nomisofsiman]

You surely are entitled to your own opinion. All I can say (if I may), is that the whole "True Metal" and "False Metal" argument is a load of crap. It's stupid and childish if you ask me. Sure, heavy metal is consider a lifestyle and more than just a genre of music, but ultimately it simply is A STYLE OF MUSIC. I don't know about you, but A7X sounds like metal (not all the time, though, I agree). The whole attitude, feeling, reason thing... I don't know if I buy crap. When I think of bands that are amazing metal bands (Redemption, let's say for instance) don't really strike me as a group of people who go around eating metal and shitting chains. I don't know man, I don't think it's worth it the whole "Battle against "False Metal". To me it's almost like waiting until you meet Santa Claus. But that's just my opinion, not a fact.

You said it better than I probably would've in a response. No offense to him personally, but I cannot stand people who do the whole "real metal" vs "false metal" thing. I find it especially weird we're having this debate on a progmetal forum, where a lot of the bands discussed actually aren't even as heavy as A7X. Yeah, like you said there are songs of theirs that aren't metallic, but for the most part they do give off that vibe. They have heavy guitars with solos, double bass drumming, etc. His vocals at times can be sort of punkish I'll admit, but since when do the vocals alone make you metal or not? It's almost as if he's saying if something is good, it's real metal and if it isn't, it's false metal. Oy is all I have to say to that.

 

[TribunalRecords]

So, because Portnoy liked this band (before the Rev died) and out of respect, played in the studio and on the road after he died, you've lost respect for him? It's cool if you don't like the band, but I don't think Portnoy did this because he wanted a chance to be with a more popular band. He did it out of respect, especially considering their drummer was a fan of his. If anything I respect him more for doing something like that as a person. Though I agree with you as he really needs to stop trying to sing when he can't.

honestly, i question anything members of DT do at this point. call me a skeptic, but Portnoy is a businessman through and through and i believe somewhere in his decision to play on the album and now TOUR with the band he wants to draw in their fan base to DT's in some form. again, me being skeptical and not taking everything someone says at face value because musicians have proven themselves to be a little full of themselves at times and say one thing, but do another.

so yes, in my book i have lost some respect for him. like i said he could do it with any other band (regardless of a death being involved) and i might not have some reaction.

plus, yes his death was tragic but that has little relevance to me at this point especially being the drug fiend he reportedly was. i mean it was a shame, as all deaths are.

 

[Palabra de Dios]

By the way bro, keep in mind that the fact that I disagree with you does not make me like you any less. I hope to see you next year since I'm missing PP this year.

I would love to talk about this in person or over the phone, as I'm sure the discussion would not come off as if we're bickering, arguing, or even angry at one another, dude.

My beef is an industry that sells stupid people "metal." And this is what they think it is. Other bands that truly are metal...aren't recognized as such. It does annoy me. And I agree with you that this is a petty thing to argue about, Milton. I will likely always love metal as my top genre. Thus, I will continue to defend my favorite genre against shit that's called metal but isn't.

A7X are not charlatans to the extreme that your pop artist example goes to. But they certainly sold themselves into the fact that the record company and the media will call them "the new metal sensations." Fuck them. It's the same shit Metallica did in 1991. This is the same "street cred" argument that rap artists would have. It's false.

I do feel bad about their drummer dying, though. Just like the Slipknot bassist. That's very sad. I still don't have to like either band's music. At all. Nor do I have to worry about coming off like a dick when I blast what I deem false metal. Every time I see 14 year old kids wearing Avenged Sevenfold shirts, I want to shake them, and hand them Seventh Son of Seventh Son and say, "Listen...and learn."

 

[Palabra de Dios]

And, I think I must also add in that I think I'm the only person on this board that does not worship the band Redemption. I mean, they're pretty good I guess, but nothing has truly grabbed me and made me go "YEAH!" yet. :-/

 

[Artizan]

honestly, i question anything members of DT do at this point. call me a skeptic, but Portnoy is a businessman through and through and i believe somewhere in his decision to play on the album and now TOUR with the band he wants to draw in their fan base to DT's in some form. again, me being skeptical and not taking everything someone says at face value because musicians have proven themselves to be a little full of themselves at times and say one thing, but do another.



hit the nail on that.

 

[Element_man]

I have listened to all the A7X albums except this new one. I had a soft spot for them when I was in high school, something about their songwriting and riffs really got to me, despite the obvious metalcore leanings. They had some interesting ideas. One song from the first album even had a drum solo on it, which turned out quite well.

When their third CD (City of Evil) came out it was a huge surprise for me and everyone else I'm sure, because they totally switched styles. They went from playing metalcore to heavy/power metal, some of the songs sounded like they could have come from a Gamma Ray or Helloween album. The vocals were brutal though. However, the cool guitar solos, catchy licks and more familiar style made it stick for a brief while. The main issue? They became stale and boring. I already know a bajillion power metal bands, and A7X aren't nearly the best. Even though they were one of the best metalcore bands, I don't like metalcore enough to justify listening to them that much.

Calling them false metal? Well that's your perogative. I think the style change was something to do with their singer seriously damaging his vocal chords from improper technique or something. Their image is also ridiculous, and I don't like the cursing in their lyrics. I would never go as far as to say that I hate them. Listen to some of their albums and try to avoid the singles. Waking the Fallen has some neat songs and ideas in it, I may even go back and revisit it now.

 

[Palabra de Dios]

To Element man: in my post I did say they were a somewhat ok hardcore (maybe should have said metalcore) band with their first two albums. I still stick to that. Before metalcore got sickening, they were one of the better bands. Maybe.

But, their image is ridiculous. And their fans annoy the shit out of me. Which yes, as shallow as it is, does influence my decision to hate them as well. It probably just pushes me further over the edge against them.