Annette of Nightwish walks off stage!

[edgeofthorns]

I Love people whining about her "unprofessionalism". She bailed on ONE show....oooooooo! Hell, maybe if she keeps it up, she'll be accepted as a true pro just like Axel Rose, Sebastian Bach, Blackie Lawless and all those other asswipes who hit the stage drunk. You know....professionals. Give her a break folks. It's easy to sit behind a computer and bitch about someone when you haven't walked in their shoes or not know what else might be going on behind the scenes.

I don't think people are "whining" as you call it. Hell, maybe if she'd get drunk she could deal with the jerks better! Regardless, some of us aren't as "in touch" with Annette's feelings as you are.

~Brian~

 

[nailz]

Unless you're a sexist and believe women and men aren't equal (I actually believe women are superior... my wife won't have it any other way), then her gender shouldn't be an excuse for her not being mentally tough enough to cope.

Women and men are clearly different Physiologically. To deny that is just plain stupid. There's nothing sexist about the fact that, emotionally, (edit: most) women are much more sensitive than men.

*shrug*.

 

[No Username]

Women and men are clearly different Physiologically. To deny that is just plain stupid. There's nothing sexist about the fact that, emotionally, (edit: most) women are much more sensitive than men.

*shrug*.

QFT.
To extend the analogy: If you yelled at Annette "whore whore you suck bring Tarja back" she might well up in tears and leave the stage.

If you yelled at Dio "fag fag you rape little boys" you are gonna see what it looks like to have his boots land right on your face. Over and over.

 

[yardleybates]

QFT.
To extend the analogy: If you yelled at Annette "whore whore you suck bring Tarja back" she might well up in tears and leave the stage.

If you yelled at Dio "fag fag you rape little boys" you are gonna see what it looks like to have his boots land right on your face. Over and over.

And see, if you yelled that to me, Lish, Freakchylde, MetalRose or many of the chicks in this community, you'd likewise have our boot land right on your face.

 

[General Zod]

I think that people have to draw that "professionalism" line somewhere--and nobody draws it in the exact same spot.

Agreed.

One thing we might agree on is that Annette better get her shit together quick. She will face worse treatment from the assholes, and turn some of her fans against her as well.

Agreed again. Unfortunately, her reaction plays right into the hands of the assholes who would barrage a performer with such insults. Hopefully she'll come to the realization, that it wouldn't matter if she was the greatest singer on Earth. To some folks, if she's not Tarja, then she's not good enough.

Zod

 

[General Zod]

Women and men are clearly different Physiologically. To deny that is just plain stupid.

Where did I deny women and men are physiologically different? As I noted, I'm married. I get that men and women are different.

There's nothing sexist about the fact that, emotionally, (edit: most) women are much more sensitive than men.

Again, I'm not sure how that speaks to what I wrote. None the less, when she steps on the stage, she's a performer and a professional one at that. If I were to hold her to a diminished standard because she's a woman, that would be sexist. Instead, I hold her to the same standard I would hold a male vocalist to. And to my mind, that standard means being able to endure a rough crowd and perform through it.

Zod

 

[nailz]

I don't think women being more emotionally prone than men to being verbally attacked on stage could be considered sexist. That's what I'm saying. In fact, I'm pretty sure science has proven it to be true, and I don't think it's a fair comparison.

 

[St Enigma]

It took Nightwish almost four full years (1998 - 2001) and three CD releases to reach the 160 gigs mark. Now the band is close to reaching their 500th gig matk in 11 years and Anette has been along at almost 1/3 of them. Anette has performed over 160 gigs in only 13 months and two weeks already.

Now, she failed finishing *one* show for some unknown reason (to us) after singing 50 mins. Does that make her unprofessional? Kiss my ass!

She's performed four shows after that incident already and again tonight and three more gigs to follow this week. Then Nightwish will take a three month break during which Anette will tour in Europe with Pain & Brother Firetribe in Jan-Feb 2009.

 

[crazycamera]

Dang... who needs a singer when the crowd is screaming louder than the singer!!

Kiitos, Petri!

BTW, much difference a day makes. Here is Poet and the Pendulum from the same show.

 

[SharkBlack]

I think it's time Annette did an Axel Rose on them fans next time they act up!

That would be awesome!!!

 

[Stingray11214]

I think it's time Annette did an Axel Rose on them fans next time they act up!

That would be awesome!!!

I'd pay to see that!

 

[General Zod]

I don't think women being more emotionally prone than men to being verbally attacked on stage could be considered sexist. That's what I'm saying. In fact, I'm pretty sure science has proven it to be true, and I don't think it's a fair comparison.

I don't think anyone is debating that women and men aren't physiologically different. Nor is anyone arguing that women (generally speaking) aren't the more emotional of the two genders.

Just to be clear, I didn't raise the specter of sexism. My original comment was merely that walking off the stage in the middle of a performance is unprofessional, and I stand by that comment. No Username then suggested that comparing her to male replacement singers is unfair, because she's a woman. If that's not sexist, it's certainly dangerously close. Any time you suggest that a woman should be held to a lesser standard than a man (in a professional environment), you're nearing the textbook definition of sexism.

Zod

 

[Pellaz]

Maybe she should start a Nemo band.
Her behavior would be acceptable then!

Spacing corrected.



My advice to Anette when she sees idiots in the front acting up? Just imagine every one of them naked.

It'll put a smile on her face, and put the miscreants in the mental dustbin where they belong.

 

[nailz]

My original comment was merely that walking off the stage in the middle of a performance is unprofessional, and I stand by that comment.

To which, I would agree. However, even a broken clock is right twice a day.

No Username then suggested that comparing her to male replacement singers is unfair, because she's a woman. If that's not sexist, it's certainly dangerously close. Any time you suggest that a woman should be held to a lesser standard than a man (in a professional environment), you're nearing the textbook definition of sexism.

Zod

I don't think, in this case, under these circumstances, and in this enviroment it could be considered sexist. This isn't, as has already been established, your standard professional work enviroment. I imagine that the stress level for this kind of "job" has to be on par with a CEO of a large company (or worse), and yes, I get it, women hold those offices all the time, but it also takes a certain mindset to GET to that place, a trial by fire. Annette sent in a demo tape, sang some songs, and got invited to join the band. Not exactly what I would call years of dedicated service to a company. The fact that she was able to shake it off in ONE DAY speaks volumes for her professionalism.

 

[General Zod]

To which, I would agree. However, even a broken clock is right twice a day.

I guess that means you should be right again in roughly 12 hours?

I don't think, in this case, under these circumstances, and in this enviroment it could be considered sexist. This isn't, as has already been established, your standard professional work enviroment. I imagine that the stress level for this kind of "job" has to be on par with a CEO of a large company (or worse), and yes, I get it, women hold those offices all the time...

As I said, I didn't raise the issue and quite truthfully, it's not that big a deal. I see your point and I think it's a fair one. I see it as a gray area.

The fact that she was able to shake it off in ONE DAY speaks volumes for her professionalism.

So you're commending her for not having to miss multiple shows from being insulted? Again, we can agree to disagree.

Zod

 

[No Username]

I don't think anyone is debating that women and men aren't physiologically different. Nor is anyone arguing that women (generally speaking) aren't the more emotional of the two genders.

Just to be clear, I didn't raise the specter of sexism. My original comment was merely that walking off the stage in the middle of a performance is unprofessional, and I stand by that comment. No Username then suggested that comparing her to male replacement singers is unfair, because she's a woman. If that's not sexist, it's certainly dangerously close. Any time you suggest that a woman should be held to a lesser standard than a man (in a professional environment), you're nearing the textbook definition of sexism.

Zod

I compared her to the same male singers you brought up. And she is not the same, so it is a fair and un-sexist statement.

I don't think Annette is going to put a boot in anyone's face. I say that because she is Annette, not because she is a woman.

If those idiots tried the same thing with Kitty, L7, or Whore, they would find themselves on the wrong end of an ass-kicking.

One thing I have not heard mentioned yet is that the other members of the band did nothing while these guys went after Annette. Frankly that is the best recommendation of their perception of her professionalism that I can point at. And I bet that, if it happen(s)(ed) at a subsequent show, they let her handle it on her own again.

When she was first announced as the new singer, the naysayers tried to point at her talent level as reason for what they considered a "bad choice." My response was the members of this band have forgotten more about music than many of us know, so I will abide by their decision process and results. The same holds true to how they handled the situation then, and how they handle it going forward.

 

[General Zod]

I compared her to the same male singers you brought up. And she is not the same, so it is a fair and un-sexist statement,

I judged her against the standard established by previous replacement singers, with no reference to gender. You said...

And maybe that is the key word here: Guys. You named a bunch of male leads who never had to go through what she did.

You raised the issue that she shouldn't be compared to the replacement singers I listed, because she's a woman. And as I said in a response to nailz, whenever you suggest that a woman shouldn't be expected to meet the same standard to which you'd hold a man, you're flirting with sexism.

Zod

 

[No Username]

I judged her against the standard established by previous replacement singers, with no reference to gender. You said...



You raised the issue that she shouldn't be compared to the replacement singers I listed, because she's a woman. And as I said in a response to nailz, whenever you suggest that a woman shouldn't be expected to meet the same standard to which you'd hold a man, you're flirting with sexism.

Zod

As long as sexism flirts back...

I have no problem standing by my interpretation of the posts, or yours. And if it is sexist, then it is. Please find me a completely non- sexist person, and I will bow before her.

 

[General Zod]

As long as sexism flirts back...

LOL.

I have no problem standing by my interpretation of the posts, or yours. And if it is sexist, then it is. Please find me a completely non- sexist person, and I will bow before her.

Quite honestly, I never intended for the thread to take this turn. I don't think you're sexist, and meant only to suggest that the comment could be construed as such. I think you and nailz more than made your case. It's actually an interesting debate, once you factor in the uniqueness of the role and the proximity issue you mentioned earlier.



Zod

 

[OrbWeaver]

One thing I have not heard mentioned yet is that the other members of the band did nothing while these guys went after Annette. Frankly that is the best recommendation of their perception of her professionalism that I can point at. And I bet that, if it happen(s)(ed) at a subsequent show, they let her handle it on her own again.

I'm not sure that it says much about their perception of her professionalism. When Tarja was molested on stage, the guys didn't do anything THEN, either. Maybe I'm just naieve, but I would think, especially in that situation, that one of them would have done something to help her.

If they didn't go to Tarja's aid, why would they bother going to Anette's?