Burning Human "close" mix
- Thread starter James Murphy
- Start date
Sorry James if i've offended you but i thought the title of this thread was 'rate my mix', that's exactly what ive done as an avid metal fine i've offered you means to improve it, i didn't realise rate my mix really meant 'enquire for my settings' or 'lick my arse'. So i apologise profusely for that.
Regarding your your comment what metal song doesn't sound over triggered, try most things by sneap, tuey marsden or jason sucof, they seem to still keep a live vibe about there mixes whilst having triggers.
Don't get me wrong i do think its good, if you want to promote your band, shop your demo for gigs i just don't think its to a professional standard.
Please in future if you are not proud your your work dont post it for people to listen to.
Sorry to offend you, i only post as you and sneap are producers us metalers aspire towards.
I am very metal.
Regarding your your comment what metal song doesn't sound over triggered, try most things by sneap, tuey marsden or jason sucof, they seem to still keep a live vibe about there mixes whilst having triggers.
Don't get me wrong i do think its good, if you want to promote your band, shop your demo for gigs i just don't think its to a professional standard.
Please in future if you are not proud your your work dont post it for people to listen to.
Sorry to offend you, i only post as you and sneap are producers us metalers aspire towards.
I am very metal.
Chryst Krispies
Vanilla Gorilla
No i'm not joking, Its opinion my friend just like yours, something we are entitled to.
are you refering to something specific in my post?
I am very metal.
x
are you refering to something specific in my post?
I am very metal.
x
well i think you mean Samples.. not Triggers.... since no one ever hears the triggers, and they don't even have to be used to add samples to replace or enhance existing acoustic drums. i always do the latter. i have zero problem hearing samples in all the aforementioned peers of mine's work... especially that last one you mentioned. neither does most anyone else here, i'm sure... which is why i'd imagine CC commented as he did. in fact i always use mostly original toms, 60/40 real snare vs sample and 20/80 sample real kick vs Sample kick... so the only thing you're hearing that's mostly sample is the kick..... and that's down to needing the solid low end in a modern metal mix.
i Love Andy's work of course, and i'm very fond of lots of Tue's.... and a couple of JS's are being enjoyed right now on my current playlists...
try doing some A/B-ing. i really love TBDM's Nocturnal and think JS did a great job... but just listen to it... sample city.... and so what? beginning of track 8 anyone?
i never said i wasn't "proud" of my work, but i put it up primarily to steer more hits to the band's myspace sites.... especially the ones looking for deals, as these guys are.... so if that means every once in a while i have to field some things i strongly disagree with (and know perfectly well better than) then so be it.
there are two very obvious (to my mind/ears anyway) problems with this mix that no one yet has picked out... either that or they noticed i didn't ask for a critique and they kept it to themselves... OH's are a bit sizzly (rode my parallel cymbal compression bus a bit hard) and i was a bit liberal with how hard i sent the snare to the verb.
you are indeed welcome to your opinion. and i'm welcome to disagree strongly with it and to trust my ear over yours.... and to say so.... and this mix sounds no more "triggered" than most other modern metal.
additional note... the "splatty" part of the snare sound you hear in this track is the original snare.... or more correctly,the orginal snare and the hats/cymbal bleed on the snare track as the gate opens..... it was tracked, not by me, with quite a bit of cymbal and hat bleed on the snare track. the "pop/stick" part of the snare sound is the sample, tucked in just under the real snare. the snare track itself, in addition to having a great deal of cymbals and hat on it, was distorted.... not at the converter, as the level was somewhat low... but it was flat-topped, making it obvious the engineer was overloading the input of either the pre or a compressor, most likely the latter, and failed to properly gain-stage to eliminate the input overload and to make up gain loss/reduction by setting the output properly.
Radd
Self Portrait
Djabthrash
Member
Djabthrash
Member
give me an example of a current metal record which does not sound "over-triggered" in your opinion..... please.
HATESPHERE: "ballet of the brute" "bloodred hatred"
UNEARTH : " III : in the eyes of fire"
ANIMOSITY : "Animal"
All of those albums are modern but not "clicky/over triggered" sounding, and the production (the songs also
) is AWESOME to me.I always prefer this kind of "natural" production than the latest Suecof/Sneap/Madsen/Hansen productions (the Black dahlia murder new album is a good example... the production is great but it sounds very "artificial" to me... then i just listen to the new ANIMOSITY album which is more "natural" and it sounds 10 times better ! )
Djabthrash
Member
I can also add :
Cannibal corpse : "kill" " the wretched spawn"
Alabama Thunderpussy : "open fire"
Mastodon : "blood mountain" and the 3rd album also (can't remember the name)
Sepultura : "Chaos AD" "Against" "Dante XXI" "roorback" "nation"
Madball : "Look my way" " Hold it down"
Terror : "one with the underdogs"
Carcass : "swan song"
Slipknot : "s/t" "iowa" (even if this one sounds more "triggered" than the first one... but it doesn't sound "overtriggered" to me)
So to me a badass organic production will always beat a badass "overtriggered/artificial" production, but i think a badass organic production is harder to achieve, therefore most producers prefer using triggers/POD/this kind of stuff for recording because it's very flexible : you just choose the samples you want, and then shape it with EQs and stuff to make it sound great and to your liking.
Anybody has other examples of recent badass "not overtriggered sounding" metal/hardcore albums ?
Cannibal corpse : "kill" " the wretched spawn"
Alabama Thunderpussy : "open fire"
Mastodon : "blood mountain" and the 3rd album also (can't remember the name)
Sepultura : "Chaos AD" "Against" "Dante XXI" "roorback" "nation"
Madball : "Look my way" " Hold it down"
Terror : "one with the underdogs"
Carcass : "swan song"
Slipknot : "s/t" "iowa" (even if this one sounds more "triggered" than the first one... but it doesn't sound "overtriggered" to me)
So to me a badass organic production will always beat a badass "overtriggered/artificial" production, but i think a badass organic production is harder to achieve, therefore most producers prefer using triggers/POD/this kind of stuff for recording because it's very flexible : you just choose the samples you want, and then shape it with EQs and stuff to make it sound great and to your liking.
Anybody has other examples of recent badass "not overtriggered sounding" metal/hardcore albums ?
i only like the sound of ONE of the albums you mentioned.... Mastadon, but i think it's more a thing that suits them and wouldn't do for many other bands. this does NOT mean i do not like albums without samples... it just means i'm not fond of all the albums you listed, production-wise. why the hell does the mere mention of samples always turn into this debate?? samples are a tool.. nothing more, nothing less... in this case the solid kick vibe was desired, the snare sample was needed to enhance a poorly recorded, (though well played) snare.. and the toms are pretty much the "organic" as you put it, original toms.
bottom line is NOT what i like or prefer in this case... it's the band's desires and overcoming problems with distorted/ low-level snare. i already made this clear... glad you like it but i'd prefer this thread die than get hijacked OT with examples of "not overtriggered sounding metal/hardcore albums"
anyway, if you'd read all my posts in this thread you'd know there were no triggers.. none at all.
i did, as i've mentioned, add samples to enhance a bit.... but the real sounds... even the distorted, low-level snare.. are louder than the samples except for the kick. ok?
fist of all, this is a world class drummer.. .and he's very consistent... so the only real reason i needed some sample on snare was because of how poorly recorded it was. get it?... i've said it several times now... but yet every couple posts someone pops up that has clearly not read that.
and sorry buddy.. i love Terry Date... White Pony is one of my top albums of all time, production-wise..... but that Unearth sounds like ass in a bucket.... i'll take this mix over that, thank you.
bottom line is NOT what i like or prefer in this case... it's the band's desires and overcoming problems with distorted/ low-level snare. i already made this clear... glad you like it but i'd prefer this thread die than get hijacked OT with examples of "not overtriggered sounding metal/hardcore albums"
anyway, if you'd read all my posts in this thread you'd know there were no triggers.. none at all.
i did, as i've mentioned, add samples to enhance a bit.... but the real sounds... even the distorted, low-level snare.. are louder than the samples except for the kick. ok?
fist of all, this is a world class drummer.. .and he's very consistent... so the only real reason i needed some sample on snare was because of how poorly recorded it was. get it?... i've said it several times now... but yet every couple posts someone pops up that has clearly not read that.
and sorry buddy.. i love Terry Date... White Pony is one of my top albums of all time, production-wise..... but that Unearth sounds like ass in a bucket.... i'll take this mix over that, thank you.
Djabthrash
Member
Héhé thanks for the straight answer James
For me the problem is not using samples (i do some drum programming myself and i am happy to use badass Steven Slate / DFH samples to make my drums sound decent before i can get a real drummer, and i DIG the Deftones drum demos on Steven website), it's just that nowadays too many metal productions sound too much "artificial/overtriggered to me" (overtriggered for the bass drum and the snare, and artificial for some rythm guitar tones), and sometimes it's a bit too much to me, and hence lack of "in your face-ness"
I love some albums were trigger use on bass drums is obvious, but i love them because the producer knew how to make it sound big (even for really fast/extreme brutal death metal stuff) instead of "thin/clicky as hell".
For me good examples of badass "triggered sounding but not too much" sounds are (i'm not sure about the trigger use on some of the following):
Malevolent creation : "the will to kill" (crushing drum sound !!!)
Misery Index : "Dissent" (ep) (the drums are awesome but the guitar sound is just average to me)
Dying Fetus : "Destroy the opposition"
God forbid : "determination" (i love the big drum sound)
Deftones : all the records except the first one (amazing drum sound)
from "Around the fur" (Abe Cunningham drumming + Terry Date production = AWESOME DRUM SOUND)
Pissing razors : "cast down the plague" and the next one (can't remember the name)
Cryptopsy : "the whisper supremacy" "and then you'll beg"
Aborted : "the archaïc abbatoir"
Pantera : "the great southern trendkill" "live 101 proof" "reinventing the steel"
Soilwork : "a predator's portrait" "natural born chaos"
36 crazyfists : all albums
Knuckledust : "universal struggle" (i dig the drum sound but i don't like the guitar sound on this one)
Machine Head : first two albums
Morbid angel : "domination"
Djabthrash
Member
Djabthrash
Member
I'd like to add that i personnaly don't think the drum sound on the "burning human" song sound "overtriggered"
(for me overtriggered = over clicky/artifical). I don't have anything against the use of triggers or/and samples (forthe same reasons than you basically)I think the production on this song is great (not crushing but great). And the band sounds great also.
p.s: sorry for all the "off-topic" debate
i personally have to say i am a massive fan of your drum sound and i would love some more insight (i know you have already presented some very useful information on the sampling aspect of things but, but i cant seem to get mine sounding tight and punchy like that... if you could shed any more light on your drumsound i'd be very very grateful
ExDown
Member
Wow, really like that guitartone James! (Quad tracked? What amp?)
Only thing I really don't like was the vocals though.. Not the recording, just the sound of his "growls".
And yeah, regarding that post about making the band´s myspace more noticed, I'd recommend them a "Friend Blaster" or something Who said anything about cheating? hehe 
Only thing I really don't like was the vocals though.. Not the recording, just the sound of his "growls".
And yeah, regarding that post about making the band´s myspace more noticed, I'd recommend them a "Friend Blaster" or something
Who said anything about cheating? hehe 
Kazrog
Kazrog, Inc.
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