can't get the kick right

[Genius Gone Insane]

I don't have a sample online yet for you to hear, but maybe you can help anyway. I keep running into a problem with the kick drum. It's a give/take issue where the kick will sound good played once or maybe a triplet will sound good too, but when I've got double bass flowing, I get a low rumble that's annoying as hell.

So I put the C4 to use, and compressed the low end, mostly below 90 Hz. That got rid of the rumble from the double-bass hits. The problem is that the kick now has lost a lot of punch, so the single hits don't sound so good. Basically, I'm having a hell of a time finding a good point to compromise at.

What can I do about this? Am I missing something? Dammit!!! frusterating!! Should I double-compress (meaning use a one channel compressor, then a C4 on top of it)?

 

[Kenny Lee]

automation!

 

[Genius Gone Insane]

automate what? the compressor? the volume?

 

[DIOBOLIC5150]

Maybe just compress THAT part of the drum track below 80 or so. I've had to do that. Sometimes it adds a nice touch by doing that (makes it impact harder because it sounds sort of "clipped" during a break or thrash part). Hard to explain, but try it. Might even do that to the whole mix on those parts to see how that turns out too.

 

[Genius Gone Insane]

Maybe just compress THAT part of the drum track below 80 or so.

I was thinking about doing that, but it seemed kind of unprofessional, and I'd like to avoid bad habits if you know what i mean.

 

[DIOBOLIC5150]

I was thinking about doing that, but it seemed kind of unprofessional, and I'd like to avoid bad habits if you know what i mean.

I wouldn't consider it unprofessional if it makes a huge improvement... now if it sounds like shit, I would consider it a bad attempt at fixing it. I've actually done it on purpose on several songs. Let's say you have a "typical metal breakdown", I'm talking cymbal mutes annd the whole 9 yards right before you bust out with your "typical metal climax"... Right when it breaks out into that "climax", I've compressed the first second or so of that "climax" to make it sock you in the chest and "pump" when it comes in. Using C4 I typically will boost the bottom end and squash the higher frequencies a tad. By doing that I get a (sort of) sub-bass feel when it kicks in at that "typical metal climax". I don't think it's a bad habit... it's more of a method to get the dynamic I wanted for those certain parts (unprofessional or not). Besides, it's subtle for the most part. It's not like WHAM!! "that guy must have screwed up". I'm no pro though... it could be a total fag maneuver for all I know, but it sounded killer.

 

[Impy]

I was thinking about doing that, but it seemed kind of unprofessional, and I'd like to avoid bad habits if you know what i mean.

I would actually call it professional. Why have a compressor on a whole track when there's just a part of it that needs it? Use automation so that the compressor only kicks in when the doublebass is going, problem solved plus less strain on your CPU.

 

[Genius Gone Insane]

that's why i said "seemed like it was unprofessional". but hey, if that's the best way to do it, kick ass! rock and roll, let's do it!

I would actually call it professional. Why have a compressor on a whole track when there's just a part of it that needs it? Use automation so that the compressor only kicks in when the doublebass is going, problem solved plus less strain on your CPU.

is this a typical thing to do? do you guys do it often? tight

 

[Impy]

I personally use quite a bit of automation, mostly to put less strain on the CPU but also since there's no reason to put say a compressor on something that doesn't need it. Just automate it to only kick in on the parts that need it.
I also do a lot of volume automation which saves you the use of plug-ins sometime, don't use plug-ins if you don't have to.

 

[Genius Gone Insane]

Is that standard or just personal preference, to lower the kick (via either automated compression or volume) during double kick parts? Are there other options?

See, I'm trying to get more of a Daniel Bergstrand-esque kick sound, with more pronounced lower frequencies (maybe 62 hz), hence that annoying rumble on the double-bass parts, as opposed to the Sneap-type kick sound with the punchy mid-lows that are less distracting to the ear for some reason.

 

[Impy]

I don't know if it's a 'standard'. There aren't any rules that say "this is how you do it" you just do whatever gets the job done. This is a simple way to do it and leaves CPU power for other things (if you're at home with your computer this is really valuable).

 

[Andy Sneap]

I'll pull the kick down by maybe 3 db on fast double kick parts and filter some high and low out on those sections.

 

[Genius Gone Insane]

tight, thanks for the responses...what other scenarios are there where you'll automate compression or volume with other instruments? besides obvious ones like background vocals or solos--just the main instruments. I haven't run into a need where I would want to lower say, a snare roll, but are there instances where any of you have done that?

 

[Frank'nfurter]

Noboddy here talks about a decent adjustet Gate before compressing. According to the max. tempo of the Song adjust the release of gate and you got it. plain and easy.