Cruel doubt on drum phase/ time aligning - Need some clarifying

[jacare]

Hello guys
I've searched a lot here and on the web about this subject, but I still got some doubts, and I'm sure someone here can enlighten me about this doubts:
Let's suppose I'll align my OH tracks to the snare. Should I pick the snare transient in the OH track and match with the snare transient on the snare track ? Same with the tom1 track for example, let's say: I identify the begin of the the snare transient on the tom1 track and align it with the begining of the snare transient on the snare track ?
Is this way of thinking correct ? If not would one correct and give me some insights on this matter please ?
I'm sorry if this is "holy shit you n00b13", but I really can't figure this out alone. Thank you already !

 

[~BURNY~]

Don't do that unless you are using a coincident OH setup and you feel that there's some serious phase issues that can't be solved by flipping the polarity.

 

[jacare]

a coincident OH setup

Care to explain that please ?

 

[~BURNY~]

Coincident= XY or Blumlein as opposed to spaced mics (AB, ORTF, Glyn Johns and watnot)
If you are using a spaced microphones, any source that isn't dead center in the stereo field will reach both microphone at different time. So you can't align them to both microphones.

 

[~BURNY~]

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/1997_articles/feb97/stereomiking.html

 

[jacare]

Coincident= XY or Blumlein as opposed to spaced mics (AB, ORTF, Glyn Johns and watnot)
If you are using a spaced microphones, any source that isn't dead center in the stereo field will reach both microphone at different time. So you can't align them to both microphones.

I've mic'ed the tracks in the XY way. I just want to know how one should do it...

 

[::XeS::]

So you say that if there is a delayed snare hit in the OH tracks...it's better to not align it to the snare track hit?
And for example ambience track? The mics should be distant and here the delay is very noticeable if you don't align the tracks

 

[ahjteam]

I usually try to match the phase on stereopairs to themselves

 

[::XeS::]

This post is very usefull
http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/...acoustic-drums-metal-guide-4.html#post4304212

 

[jacare]

So you say that if there is a delayed snare hit in the OH tracks...it's better to not align it to the snare track hit?
And for example ambience track? The mics should be distant and here the delay is very noticeable if you don't align the tracks

Didn't understood you well. Were you responding to me ?

 

[::XeS::]

No it was for Burny

 

[jacare]

I usually try to match the phase on stereopairs to themselves

So, I align the OHs to themselves and that's it ?

 

[jacare]

No it was for Burny

Ok! I've asked somewhere else about this subject and the only thing that most people agree about it is: Don't do it !

 

[egan.]

I don't think you should ever shift around the time alignment of drum mics unless you are after some specific special effect.
If you have 10 mics on the kit then you have 100 time/phase relationships. Good luck aligning all of those. Yeah, some of these will effect each other more than others but IMO it's much smarter to get the kit sounding good in the first place and forget about what it looks like on the screen. Besides, a big reason for OH and room mics is you want a time and phase shift.

 

[beyond dead]

wouldnt lining the snr track up to the ohs make things sound funny? because the oh`s are further from the drum, shouldnt the transient be a bit later in the ohs?

 

[KeithTidd]

the only drum mics i would ever nudge around are room mics.

 

[Fox Mulder]

I tend to use a gate on the OH. But instead of 'muting' everything, I just make sure the stuff except the OH hits gets lower in level, low enough to hardly cause too much concern. As you are probably aware, completely muting the stuff with the gate would make the sustain sound a bit funny. The digidesign expander/gate works wonders for me. Afterwards, I rely on the oh-so-holy room mic to make up for the left out ambience caused by gating the OH tracks.