Demo is up! (5 mp3's!!! Laney AMP *DURBANS*)

^^^^ LOL thanks. Dude, I know what you mean exactly on all those points. The problem is that the band thinks they are all mix-masters and eq'ing gurus. So I do my part how I think it should go, and then they came in and were like "well..." and just started asking for all this CRAP and then it turned out like it did. If the whole mix went how they wanted it, it would be a helluva lot worse than it is, trust me on that.

Basically, they don't understand how monitors work. When working in a flat monitoring environment, you have to imagine a little. Anything that goes on with the monitors, will be amplified in a stereo by at least 10x. So however hard a kick drum hits those monitors, it will hit 10x (or more) harder on their car/home stereo. So the kick drum hits hard as shit on the monitors, then you listen to it at home, and it's just so bassy that it's mud, I mean the click disappears, and there's all those low frequencies that aren't necessary and they just clutter everything up. The guitars have so much low-end that needs to be cut off it's not even funny, but they think it should be there since there isn't a bass guitar. Now, I do agree that the guitars should have added bass freq's to kind of pick up the slack of no bass guitar, but not NEARLY as much as they suggest. The actual snare that he uses doesn't have the exact pop that he wants, so he asks me to add "pop" to it. Only thing I can really do is try to raise some of the high-end freq's...which in turn makes the track clip every once in a while. The toms were mixed like that per the drummer's request, since his high tom is in the "center" of his kit, it starts out like this...tom1 0, tom2 38%L, tom3 57%L, floortom 100%L...which is a fucking joke if you ask me, but again, gotta please the band. Ugh, everytime I listen to it, it makes me more and more sick of it. BAHHHH!

~006+1
 
I agree. You just can't afford to let the band run the session. I think you either need to be alot more suggestive, compromising in your approach (ie. 'I do think it's great that your toms are placed this way, and it makes micing a total pleasure, but here... listen to this Carcass record, see how the toms are panned all over the stereo image? Why don't we give that a shot too?') or 'shut the hell up. drummers sit in that seat *points to drumkit*, engineers sit in this seat *points to control room*. now play, monkey, play'.

The musicians might well be able to pull a rehearsal sound that they like, but all of that goes out the window when you track and mix. You can't afford to let them inundate you with that 'live scenario' mentality when you're cutting a record for them. You're the man in charge - nobody else.

I mean, if all else fails, sit the guys down and A/B some records with them. I couldn't actually believe that a Schecter with 707s could sound so bad run through such awesome gear... like the pieces just don't fit in my mind. You need to show them how their approach is 'wrong' and yours is 'right'.
 
006 said:
^^^^ LOL thanks. Dude, I know what you mean exactly on all those points. The problem is that the band thinks they are all mix-masters and eq'ing gurus. So I do my part how I think it should go, and then they came in and were like "well..." and just started asking for all this CRAP and then it turned out like it did. If the whole mix went how they wanted it, it would be a helluva lot worse than it is, trust me on that.

Basically, they don't understand how monitors work. When working in a flat monitoring environment, you have to imagine a little. Anything that goes on with the monitors, will be amplified in a stereo by at least 10x. So however hard a kick drum hits those monitors, it will hit 10x (or more) harder on their car/home stereo. So the kick drum hits hard as shit on the monitors, then you listen to it at home, and it's just so bassy that it's mud, I mean the click disappears, and there's all those low frequencies that aren't necessary and they just clutter everything up. The guitars have so much low-end that needs to be cut off it's not even funny, but they think it should be there since there isn't a bass guitar. Now, I do agree that the guitars should have added bass freq's to kind of pick up the slack of no bass guitar, but not NEARLY as much as they suggest. The actual snare that he uses doesn't have the exact pop that he wants, so he asks me to add "pop" to it. Only thing I can really do is try to raise some of the high-end freq's...which in turn makes the track clip every once in a while. The toms were mixed like that per the drummer's request, since his high tom is in the "center" of his kit, it starts out like this...tom1 0, tom2 38%L, tom3 57%L, floortom 100%L...which is a fucking joke if you ask me, but again, gotta please the band. Ugh, everytime I listen to it, it makes me more and more sick of it. BAHHHH!

~006+1

i say cut them loose as quick as you can. after you make them happy, if its not what you think it can be, in a way that portrays your work/studio in a negative way, tell them to keep your name and the name of the studio off the cd. this way you can please their messed up way of thinking and get them on their way to tryin to figure out why everything doesnt work. tell them to sit on it for a few and if they decide it isnt right(which its not)you can make it sound way better doing things your way. then you can charge them more for a remix :D . that'll learn 'em!
 
Well can you blame em for wanting it to sound like this? It's a very fitting sound, it's not "supposed" to sound über clean, it's supposed to sound raw which it does. Listen to bands like Commit Suicide and so on, it doesn't sound "good" per say but it does sound brutal.
I also totally disagree with you on the lowend in the guitars, i say it's not enough :)
They're very thin sounding...
 
006 said:
A is the reason they can't find a bass player. One, that would be into it and that also could play it.

Aww, come on! Don't tell me that there's not one technically capable bass player in the whole of San Antonio?! In my hometown of 250000 I know at least one or maybe two who could play that... And SA is for sure much larger.
If the situation's that bad, I really sympathize with the guys, but I'd rather play the bass myself than leave the recording without it. It doesn't have to be as technical as the other instruments, it can always just keep the low end.