Given the Choice...

[ElektricEyez]

Ok, I'm seriously considering getting an alesis DM10 kit for the studio which uses real drum heads. Mostly for metal because of the complex and speed and the accuracy needed. I already own a pretty sick 7 piece Maple PDP kit, with tons of Cymbals. But I've been thinking lately it might be easier to edit and FASTER to edit an electronic drumit. Espeically the kicks

Given the choice, if it was left in your hands, would you rather the drummer record with an electro kit, all midi or an acoustic kit and why? Bear in mind I usually mic and use triggers on the acoustic kit already, but it's all audio and I end up using the room mic to thicken it up.

I'm thinking an electronic kit would be pretty cool because even a semi bad take could just be fixed on the fly as opposed to making the drummer re-take.

Also I'm thinking that a hybrid could work too, where you mic and use real cymbals on top and just trigger the bottom half of the kit, so you don't have to deal with tom/snare/kickdrum bleed. Although I'm not entirely sure how that would work out because I'm guessing the electrokit would still have some bleed through into the cymbal mics.

Obviously it's going to come down to the drummer, but I'm thinking they might even choose the electro kit over the acoustic because it would take a lot less setup time and they could probably knock out the takes must faster because timing issues and double kick issues could be easily fixed on the spot.

Anyone care to voice their opinion here?

 

[Tommy Evans]

I use an all electronic kit due to lack of funds for mics and shit. BUT, it given the choice, I'd like to try (and get good at) real cymbals with e-kit shells.

 

[006]

Mic'ed cymbals, e-kit pads for snare and toms, the drummer brings/uses their own kick drum (which would be damped to hell). Best of everything, IMO. Most drummers will have a problem playing on a pad for the kick because of how it feels, but not so much on pads for snare/toms. Using their own kick for that gets rid of that problem.

As far as the bleed into the OH mics, when you have the MIDI triggering drum samples, you really won't notice the extremely faint "tick" sounds at that point.

I have used an e-kit before with mic'ed cymbals, worked out great, even though it was a shit e-kit (hart dynamics ~$500 kit). Would really love to have some Roland V-Drum snare/tom pads and a good module in the future.

 

[Audiosprite]

Electronic kits are disgusting. I find it hard to play when there's only a superficial correlation between what I'm playing and what I'm hearing. So from a drummer's perspective, I would never want to record on anything but a real kit.

 

[Loren Littlejohn]

It's all on how you look at e drums. I find that you have to play them differently than you would a real kit, I know that's weird to say but Sal agrees as well. You have to adjust your playing when you use them.

I think this is what hangs people up with them. My friend can't stand them, but his father is all about them. His dad has been playing for a few decades now and my buddy has 10 years under his belt. But when you watch him go at it on an e-kit he goes at it like he does an acoustic set and it just doesn't work.

My .02 anyway.

 

[ElektricEyez]

Thanks for everyones input. I think I'm gonna get them. After all if worst comes to worst I can always sell them I guess. I think the key thing is to try to get drummers to at least give it a shot. I mean perfect takes while at the same time cutting down editing time to me is the biggest selling point here. I know it comes down to the drummer, so I'm gonna offer drummers a choice with the opportunity to track with the electro set and if they can't seem to get the hang of it, I'll give them whatever time was spent on the electro kit back for free on the acoustic kit if it comes down to it.

I'm thinking it could go either way depending on the drummer. But I think some drummers are little sloppier than others and totally not used to tracking to a click track, and their kicks are all over the place. With the electro kit, I could take a fairly decent take and edit it to perfection rather quickly. And even if there was a screw up that cought later after the drumset was taking down, like say while tracking guitars, we could go in there and fix it on the spot I might even be able to get the guitarist to get 1 track, (with the DI's of course for reamping later) using my line 6 POD. I guess what got me thinking this way was I saw some video footage of Overkill tracking their new CD, and they had a full blown acoustic kit, except instead of using an acoustic kick, they actually just used the trigger as the kick. To me that made sense. But having never done this myself, and having a nice massive maple kit with all the mics I need at my disposal, well it's almost seems detrimental, but I think it has it's advantages and draw backs. I think for solid drummers, especially ones that don't play so complicated and fast, would benefit more from the acoustic style recording. So I think both have their place.

I guess my only worry with the hybrid setup, (real cymbals/electro bottom half), and I do appreciate your input on this 006, is that when making extreme edits, such as if the snare is like a little more than a 16th note off from the beat, perhaps closer to an 8th note. When you move the midi note, can you still hear the 'tick' of the original hit in the overheads??? That's really my only concern.

 

[aortizjr]

I think they are good to have around. I have used them for preproduction and writing. It gives the drummer to play on when doing tempo tracks. Then for writing, it is cool to have the beats there that you can arrange much more easily.

I also got mine hoping for guys who would want to use it for adding layers to like acoustic guitar singer/songwriters and such. Essentially saving on setup time.

For metal guys, I find it easier to just edit acoustic drums. They also play better in their natural environment. If a guy is sloppy on his regular kit, he often is even worse on an electric kit. If the guy is good enough to play on anything, then his takes are usually already solid.

Plus with speedy stuff most of it is muscle memory, so how do you handle extra toms, cymbals, etc. Most E-kits only have so many inputs. I just think you would spend more time programming that stuff and editing that than just slip editing the acoustic drums.

Even shitty drums can sound pretty good with new heads and a proper tuning. So I would just stick to that. But the E-kits are still nice to have around, just don't expect it to be your staple or savior to drums.