Gun Master Debate

UA and Summerian are more backwards than Monoxide.

This from someone who just said: "If you Yanks want the freedom to shoot each other, that's your business." A pretty backward statement in itself, but here's the cherry on top: from your previous statement it's clear that you are in favor of of gun control, yet call us "backward" when we post in favor of exactly such a thing. Lost your logic somewhere, have you, lad?
 
You clearly lack the capacity to understand I have nothing to do with the NRA, the Tea Party, the Republican Party, etc etc etc etc nor that guns are merely tools to be used for good or ill depending on the user.

Nothing empowers criminals and gangs like the profits from the War on Drugs. You're focused on the wrong thing.

Oh really? Then why does almost everything you say sound like propaganda lifted directly off the NRA website? I've already pointed out how illogical and ridiculous the whole "tools" argument is - next thing you'll be telling us that every single country in the world should have the right to own nuclear weapons to keep the peace, aye? o_O

And now it's the war on drugs that's fueling global gun violence, is it? :rolleyes: Would you propose that local pharmacies or supermarkets everywhere sell ecstasy, cocaine, heroine, etc. legally over the counter to undercut the power and profit of gangs? Even if such a ludicrous situation were to occur, the gangsters would certainly use their guns to regularly rob such outlets and sell the drugs cheaper on the black market. It would only fuel more violence, not to mention the questionable morality of selling mind- and body-destroying substances legally to the general public.
 
Oh really? Then why does almost everything you say sound like propaganda lifted directly off the NRA website? I've already pointed out how illogical and ridiculous the whole "tools" argument is - next thing you'll be telling us that every single country in the world should have the right to own nuclear weapons to keep the peace, aye? o_O

Why shouldn't they? What makes the current nuclear weapon holding nations superior in this regard?

You have done no such thing re: "showing how illogical the tools argument is". Maybe in your beautiful mind you think you have.

And now it's the war on drugs that's fueling global gun violence, is it? :rolleyes: Would you propose that local pharmacies or supermarkets everywhere sell ecstasy, cocaine, heroine, etc. legally over the counter to undercut the power and profit of gangs?

Why not sell these things openly?

Even if such a ludicrous situation were to occur, the gangsters would certainly use their guns to regularly rob such outlets and sell the drugs cheaper on the black market. It would only fuel more violence, not to mention the questionable morality of selling mind- and body-destroying substances legally to the general public.

Speaking of absurd. This didn't happen when the prohibition on alcohol ended. What makes other drugs any different? Prescription drugs are no less dangerous and deadly than the illegal variety and yet no moral qualms found there. Your illogical emotions are showing.
 
Pharmacies dispense drugs that are even more addictive than most drugs on the black market, aside from, say, crystal meth. Many of these drugs sell pretty well on the street. Generally, they'll sell at a much higher price than drugs like heroin. A single Oxy 30, for example, can run around $40. That being said, pharmacies aren't frequently robbed.
 
One propaganda-possessed-puppet ignores all the facts, studies, and statistics arrayed against him and sticks his head into the ground like an ostrich in defiance of the cold hard truth. The gods of reason and logic nod their heads knowingly at his pathetic small-minded brainwashed condition.

This is actually getting hilarious. Not only has Overwatch and others posted numerous facts, figures, studies, and statistics to support his point of view, he’s pointed out key facts in sources you have cited that you have confidently ignored that further support his points and invalidate your view that guns are, as Overwatch said, “some kind of pathogen”.

You still ignore the fact that even though Gun sales and possession is increasing (you posted an earlier remark that it’s actually decreasing, which is false. A graph was posted pages ago shows you’re wrong.) Crime is decreasing and reaching near historic lows. All the facts, figures, studies, and statistics do nothing to show that less guns = less crime as you seem to think.

I’m sure this post is useless. Whatever. I guess all information that doesn’t fit into your narrative must be NRA propaganda, pushed by a bunch of brainwashed puppets. I mean, obviously accusing everyone that disagrees with you, no matter how sound the opposing argument, of being “brainwashed” or pushing “propaganda” is a clear indication of being of sound mind and not being brainwashed yourself whatsoever.
 
This from someone who just said: "If you Yanks want the freedom to shoot each other, that's your business." A pretty backward statement in itself, but here's the cherry on top: from your previous statement it's clear that you are in favor of of gun control, yet call us "backward" when we post in favor of exactly such a thing. Lost your logic somewhere, have you, lad?

Clearly, you have difficulty identifying friendly sarcasm. Just because we have similar ideas doesn't mean I think you're justified in having your opinion. So far, you've only stated anti-gun propaganda that any twelve year old with internet access and a basic understanding of how to debate could come up with. Overwatch is using actual statistics and facts to back up his well-thought-out arguments. He actually did his research on the subject while you're just regurgitating the same old arguments over and over again. You and Sum sound like you just stumbled off of a meme site and think your basic logic can actually stand up to proper critical thining. It's embarrassing.
 
Clearly, you have difficulty identifying friendly sarcasm. Just because we have similar ideas doesn't mean I think you're justified in having your opinion. So far, you've only stated anti-gun propaganda that any twelve year old with internet access and a basic understanding of how to debate could come up with. Overwatch is using actual statistics and facts to back up his well-thought-out arguments. He actually did his research on the subject while you're just regurgitating the same old arguments over and over again. You and Sum sound like you just stumbled off of a meme site and think your basic logic can actually stand up to proper critical thining. It's embarrassing.


Best post I've read in a long time. Right on man!
 
Why shouldn't they? What makes the current nuclear weapon holding nations superior in this regard?

You have done no such thing re: "showing how illogical the tools argument is". Maybe in your beautiful mind you think you have.



Why not sell these things openly?



Speaking of absurd. This didn't happen when the prohibition on alcohol ended. What makes other drugs any different? Prescription drugs are no less dangerous and deadly than the illegal variety and yet no moral qualms found there. Your illogical emotions are showing.

Ok there it goes, now I KNOW that either (a) you're obviously trolling, or (b) are incredibly and amazingly naive and/or stupid, or (c) are in fact just a kid who thought he would try his hand at the Internet. Did you seriously just suggest that unstable third world dictatorships whose government changes every couple of years in revolutions or civil wars deserve the right to possess nuclear weapons?? If that were true, human society as we know it would have ended ages ago in a nuclear winter. Get a grip, please

And you roll from that onto a statement also as absurd and idiotic as the first: that governments should sell hard drugs to their citizens legally. Let me firstly say that I'm not really opposed to something like marijuana being legalized because it's effects on the human body are relatively mild in comparison to actually hard drugs like cocaine, crystal meth, ecstasy, etc. and it is a natural plant, not something concocted in a lab. It's also the most common drug and governments wasted billions of dollars prosecuting and locking up people for a "crime" that is hardly more severe than lighting up a cigarette.

However, there is plenty of information out there in terms of studies and people's personal true-life experiences regarding how incredibly serious and devastating the effects of actual hard drugs are upon the human mind and body (do I really need to dig up the thousands of examples out there to prove what is a obvious fact to anyone with half a brain?), and there is no way that any society could ever sell such things to it's citizens in good conscience (which is *probably* why none of them do). Prescription drugs undergo years of clinical trials and do have a specific medical functions, whereas hard illegal drugs are just batches of toxic chemicals thrown together to fry your brain up, and you would have the ultimate idiocy to actually question which are more harmful to the human body? You're little more than an illogical laughing stock :lol::lol::lol:
 
*whine* *whine* *whine* I clearly haven't read any of the studies, facts, or statistics that UltimateApathy has posted in this entire thread.
I seem oblivious to the fact that he's shown things such as:

a) the deterimental effect of guns upon the psyche of carriers
b) how the NRA deliberately tries to bury and sabotage gun violence research data
c) How civilian-owned guns fuel violent gangsterism and civil wars in third world countries
d) how there is a direct correlation between gun availabillity and gun violence
e) how gun violence is generally far more severe than other forms of violent crime
f) How the USA has far more serious violent crime than any other first world country in the world
g)how the NRA is political wing of the gun manufacturers of American which exist solely to brainwash people into the idea that they need guns with ridiculous conspiracy theories

I also failed to notice that, by contrast, all that Overwatch has shown is that the US has less violent crime than gangster-poverty-war-ravaged third world countries. Apparantly I'm somehow in doubt as to who the winner of this debate is - gosh, let me take a liedown before I hurt myself.

All very true, that's one of the best posts I've read in a long time. :D
 
Since everyone conveniently decided to ignore these studies, I'm going to post them again for the fun of saeeing brainwashed puppets squirm as the true nature of their propaganda puppet masters is exposed:

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-relea...-90943419.html

NRA Once Again Embracing Anti-Government Rhetoric

WASHINGTON, April 15 /PRNewswire-USNewswire/ -- Fifteen years ago former National Rifle Association (NRA) member Timothy McVeigh -- motivated by his fear and hatred of the federal government -- bombed the Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City. Today, the NRA and other members of the gun lobby are again embracing and validating anti-government rhetoric according to the new 21-page Violence Policy Center (VPC) study "Lessons Unlearned: The Gun Lobby and the Siren Song of Anti-Government Rhetoric" (http://www.vpc.org/studies/lessonsunlearned.pdf).

The study offers examples of the NRA's anti-government language, details NRA marketing to Tea Party supporters, and reveals links in nine states between NRA State Election Volunteer Coordinators, the Tea Party movement, and other factions of the "Patriot movement."

The study's release comes four days before the pro-gun "Second Amendment March" in Washington, D.C. The April 19th event, held on the anniversary of the Oklahoma City bombing and the federal government's siege at Waco that contributed to McVeigh's anti-government anger, has been publicized by the NRA and received financial support from the organization.

The study finds that, echoing the language of the resurgent Patriot movement, the NRA routinely presents the election of Barack Obama as a virtually apocalyptic threat not only to gun ownership, but to the future of the United States itself.

In a December 2009 direct-mail letter echoing the language of both the Tea Party movement and the Oath Keepers, the NRA urges the reader to join an "army whose highest allegiance is not to any individual or any political party but only to the cause of freedom."

In the letter, NRA Executive Vice President Wayne LaPierre -- who, speaking at the 2009 CPAC convention, told cheering attendees that "our Founding Fathers understood that the guys with the guns make the rules" -- warns of "...massive armies of anti-gun, anti-freedom radicals marshaling against us for an attack that could make every other battle we've ever fought look like a walk in the park...an attack aimed at completely rewriting our nation's values and the future of our country in ways that you and I won't even recognize."

In the first four months of 2009, the NRA's flagship activist magazine, America's 1st Freedom, profiled key members of the Obama administration, likening them to a "'who's who' of gun-ban advocates."
A January 2009 article entitled "Beware the Rahm" asked, "Will Rahm Emanuel be able to stab a knife into the Constitution and scream that the Second Amendment is 'Dead! Dead! Dead!?'"
A February 2009 NRA profile of Attorney General Eric Holder attacked his record under "the infamous Janet Reno ," the Clinton Administration attorney general who is widely blamed in pro-gun circles for the Waco stand-off.
A March 2009 cover proclaimed, "The Whole World is Watching—Hillary Clinton Takes the Reins: Will the new secretary of state defend the U.S. constitution, or will she invite the global gun-ban movement into the corridors of power?"
An April 2009 cover featured Secretary of Education Arne Duncan with the headline: "What would this man teach your kids? Anti-gun extremist Arne Duncan takes over as Secretary of Education."


The organization now also markets NRA clothing products emblazoned with the Gadsden "Don't Tread on Me" flag, which has become the symbol of the Tea Party movement. The description for the NRA Gadsden tee shirt reads: "What goes around comes around. In the late 18th century, oppressed American patriots voiced their defiance of tyranny by exclaiming, 'Don't Tread on Me!' Perhaps it's time once again for Freedom-loving citizens to rally 'round the legendary slogan of the famous Gadsden flag."

The VPC study states that "the NRA incites its members and others, offering words that outside of the purported protective bubble of direct-mail and official publications would be chilling." It cites an August 2008 NRA direct-mail letter warning of the threat posed by a possible Obama administration: "Our Constitution and our system of government guarantee that every American has the opportunity to write his or her name in the history books of tomorrow -- to leave his or her imprint on the fabric of our nation. But in the end, history is always written only by a select few -- the few who sacrifice of themselves to fight for the causes in which they believe."

The study concludes, "Such language offers benediction to the most violent of acts...Based on past history, the overriding concern should be that the NRA's words may, in fact, once again be revealed as violent prophecy."




http://www.salon.com/2012/07/25/the_...n_gun_science/

The NRA’s war on gun science

As the tragic shooting in Colorado last week has reignited the debate over guns, one key public policy question — does gun control save lives? — is almost impossible to answer thanks to a dearth of research on the subject. That lack of research is no accident. It’s the product of a concerted campaign by the gun lobby and its allies on Capitol Hill to stymie and even explicitly outlaw scientific research into gun violence in what critics charge is an attempt to deceive the public about the dangers of guns.

Over the past two decades, the NRA has not only been able to stop gun control laws, but even debate on the subject. The Centers for Disease Control funds research into the causes of death in the United States, including firearms — or at least it used to. In 1996, after various studies funded by the agency found that guns can be dangerous, the gun lobby mobilized to punish the agency. First, Republicans tried to eliminate entirely the National Center for Injury Prevention and Control, the bureau responsible for the research. When that failed, Rep. Jay Dickey, a Republican from Arkansas, successfully pushed through an amendment that stripped $2.6 million from the CDC’s budget (the amount it had spent on gun research in the previous year) and outlawed research on gun control with a provision that reads: “None of the funds made available for injury prevention and control at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention may be used to advocate or promote gun control.”

David Satcher, the then-director of the CDC, wrote an Op-Ed in the Washington Post in November of 1995 warning that the NRA’s “shotgun assault” on the CDC was dangerous both for public health and for our democracy:


What ought to be of wider concern, is the second argument advanced by the NRA — that firearms research funded by the CDC is so biased against gun ownership that all such funding ought to cease. Here is a prescription for inaction on a major cause of death and disability. Here is a charge that not only casts doubt on the ability of scientists to conduct research involving controversial issues but also raises basic questions about the ability, fundamental to any democracy, to have honest, searching public discussions of such issues.


Dickey’s clause, which remains in effect today, has had a chilling effect on all scientific research into gun safety, as gun rights advocates view “advocacy” as any research that notices that guns are dangerous. Stephen Teret, who co-directs the Johns Hopkins Center for Gun Policy and Research, told Salon: “They sent a message and the message was heard loud and clear. People [at the CDC], then and now, know that if they start going down that road, their budget is going to be vulnerable. And the way public agencies work, they know how this works and they’re not going to stick their necks out.”

In January, the New York Times reported that the CDC goes so far as to “ask researchers it finances to give it a heads-up anytime they are publishing studies that have anything to do with firearms. The agency, in turn, relays this information to the NRA as a courtesy.”

In response to the news, the Brady Center to Prevent Gun Violence sent a letter to Secretary of Health and Human Services Kathleen Sebelius expressing concern that the agency was giving the NRA a “preferred position” and allowed to sway research.

Teret said that he’s noticed that the CDC appears to avoid using the word “firearms” when possible in research on homicide and suicide, using instead euphemisms like the “availability of lethal means.”

More recently, Republicans have gone after the National Institutes for Health, which has also funded research into the public health issues of guns. “It’s almost as if someone’s been looking for a way to get this study done ever since the Centers for Disease Control was banned from doing it 10 years ago,” Rep. Joe Barton, a Texas Republican, said in 2009 of the NIH.

“You’d think that after the CDC had their money revoked, we wouldn’t be dealing with this,” Erich Pratt, a spokesman for the Gun Owners Association of America, told the Washington Times at the time.

Last year, Rep. Denny Rehberg, a Republican from Montana, added a rider to the current government-funding bill, the Consolidated Appropriations Act of 2012, based on the Dickey language, which targets the NIH. It states that no funds going to the NIH “may be used, in whole or part, to advocate or promote gun control.” In a press release from March, Rehberg touted the amendment and condemned President Obama’s “insidious … efforts to subvert the Second Amendment,” a reference to a signing statement Obama made pushing back (gently) on the provision.

Daniel Vice of the Brady Center told Salon that the stymieing of research at the CDC “is just one part of a broad campaign of secrecy to keep information from the public about how dangerous guns are.” He noted that the ATF used to release lots of gun crime data to the public, including a list of problem gun dealers providing firearms to criminals (almost 60 percent of firearms at crime scenes were traced back to just one percent of gun dealers, he said). But beginning in 2003, an amendment introduced by Rep. Todd Tiahrt, a Republican from Kansas, prevents the ATF from releasing all kinds of gun data. It’s been added as a rider to every spending bill since.

Dr. Arthur Kellermann, a prominent researcher whose 1993 CDC-funded study became a flashpoint in the debate over government funding of gun research, told Salon that the effects of the campaign against gun research have real consequences. “In a nation dedicated to personal freedom and responsibility, it is ironic that policymakers and the public have been denied access to timely and objective research on this issue for 15 years and counting,” he said in an email.

Indeed, gun violence is the second leading cause of death for young people after car accidents, but the federal agency responsible for researching ways to stop it has had its hands tied. No other research topic has been singled out in this way. “We’ve got a huge social problem that causes a very substantial amount of premature mortality and by and large, we have invested scant resources studying it. And the reason is politics,” Teret said.




http://www.thestar.com/news/world/20...rol_video.html

NRA uses Barack Obama’s kids in ‘repugnant and cowardly’ anti-gun control ad


Are the president’s kids more important than yours?” a narrator says in the 35-second television and Internet spot. “Then why is he skeptical about putting armed security in our schools when his kids are protected by armed guards at their schools? Mr. Obama demands the wealthy pay their fair share of taxes, but he’s just another elitist hypocrite when it comes to a fair share of security.”

WASHINGTON- Hours before President Barack Obama was due to unveil proposals on Wednesday to prevent mass shootings like the one in Newtown, Conn., last month, the National Rifle Association released an advertisement that referred to his two school-aged daughters.


“Are the president’s kids more important than yours?” a narrator says in the 35-second television and Internet spot. “Then why is he skeptical about putting armed security in our schools when his kids are protected by armed guards at their schools? Mr. Obama demands the wealthy pay their fair share of taxes, but he’s just another elitist hypocrite when it comes to a fair share of security.”


Obama’s two children, who attend private school in Washington, D.C., receive Secret Service protection.


The White House condemned the ad.


“Most Americans agree that a president’s children should not be used as pawns in a political fight. But to go so far as to make the safety of the president’s children the subject of an attack ad is repugnant and cowardly,” White House spokesman Jay Carney said.


Former Obama press secretary Robert Gibbs, speaking earlier on MSNBC’s Morning Joe program, said the ad was “disgusting on so many levels.”


Gun control activists and gun rights advocates have said in recent days that they could find common ground, particularly over the issue of expanding background checks for potential gun owners.


The NRA ad’s tone, however, and the personal nature of the attacks speaks to the cultural gulf that divides both sides.


The clip, called “Stand and Fight,” promotes the leading gun lobby’s proposal to put armed guards in schools. The idea has been at the centre of the NRA’s response to the Dec. 14 shooting at the Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, in which 20 children and 6 adults were killed.


The ad is airing on the Sportsman Channel, a cable network, but will likely receive a much larger viewership on news stations and through the Internet.


The NRA, which says it has about 4 million members, also announced earlier this week that it would produce a nightly one-hour cable talk show hosted by gun advocate Cam Edwards on the Sportsman Channel.


“I am skeptical that the only answer is putting more guns in schools,” Obama said in a recent interview with NBC’s “Meet the Press. “And I think the vast majority of the American people are skeptical that that somehow is going to solve our problem.”


In a survey released on Monday, the Pew Research Center found that people favor putting armed guards or police officers in more schools by a two-to-one margin, 64 per cent to 32 per cent.
 
Pro tip: "Stability of government" has little to do with nuke usage on civilians. Just ask Japan.

So what drugs are bad for you? Lots of things are bad for you. Why does that require prohibition? Nevermind the fact it hasn't worked.

The only troll here is you with all your fearmongering and subjective and inaccurate statistic citings.
 
Pro tip: "Stability of government" has little to do with nuke usage on civilians. Just ask Japan.

So what drugs are bad for you? Lots of things are bad for you. Why does that require prohibition? Nevermind the fact it hasn't worked.

The only troll here is you with all your fearmongering and subjective and inaccurate statistic citings.

http://thestir.cafemom.com/in_the_news/149261/piers_morgan_makes_gun_nut
Piers Morgan isn't a man known for mincing words. But on Monday night, Morgan had gun crazy radio host Alex Jones on his CNN show Piers Morgan Tonight, and the results were insane, indeed. Jones blew up. Acted like a crazy person and basically proved everything Morgan could have said without Morgan having to say many words at all.
This all started when Jones started a petition to deport Morgan for his outspoken views on guns. Basically he believes in gun control. For Jones, these are fighting words.
Jones claims the government is responsible for the 9/11 attacks. He calls Prozac a mass murder pill and he became irrationally furious about Morgan’s nationality. "Don’t try what your ancestors did before,"


Alex Jones a friend of yours?
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
:danceboy:
 
So we are admitting guilt by association as a legitimate "debate tactic"?

You are so smooth. How shall I ever recover from your mercilessly witty onslaught? Who could possibly be worse than Alex Jones in comparison? I shall, nevertheless, attempt:


Are Lenin, Stalin, Hitler, Mao, Pol Pot, Mussolini, etc all friends of yours?????........???!!

:danceboy::danceboy::danceboy::danceboy:





















dancingsmiley.gif /infinite repeat
 
So we are admitting guilt by association as a legitimate "debate tactic"?

You are so smooth. How shall I ever recover from your mercilessly witty onslaught? Who could possibly be worse than Alex Jones in comparison? I shall, nevertheless, attempt:


Are Lenin, Stalin, Hitler, Mao, Pol Pot, Mussolini, etc all friends of yours?????........???!!

So...
















he's a relative?
 
Pro tip: "Stability of government" has little to do with nuke usage on civilians. Just ask Japan.

So what drugs are bad for you? Lots of things are bad for you. Why does that require prohibition? Nevermind the fact it hasn't worked.

The only troll here is you with all your fearmongering and subjective and inaccurate statistic citings.

Now you've truly run out of things to say and are just jabbering meaningless nonsense for the sake of saying something. Just as with violent crime, you seem unable to comprehend that fact that the world is not purely divided into black and white and that there are differing levels of both violent crime and how damaging various substances are top your body. You would have us believe that fistfight in a pub is as serious a violent crime as a shooting, just as presumably you would have us believe that eating Mcdonald's french fries (they're bad for you, right?) or taking a cold pill is as damaging to your body as taking cocaine or crystal meth. Your inabillity to see severity levels and to classify everything as black and white when in fact the world is composed of a million shades of gray is disturbingly similar to religious fanatics who would even have us believing that Harry Potter is a spawn of Satan that exists purely to lure innocent young minds into witchcraft and Satanism :lol::lol::lol: What you're saying kinda reminds me of something Summerian posted earlier:

stupid-gun-nuts.png


Some have asked why I constantly refer to brainwashing and propaganda etc here, and I will answer that. As someone who has travelled extensively and also lived in several countries (one of which was inundated with a rash of civillian firearms and was one of the most dangerous non-war-zone places you could ever imagine, and another which had very strict gun control regulations and was so safe that it was almost laughable), I can tell you for a bona fide fact that to believe in the right for everyone (without a felony conviction) in a society to carry a gun with a religious-like fervour and passion is both highly unusual, bizarre, and (as the all the facts, studies and statistics shows) unhealthy. The U.S.A. is the only country in the world that has this ludicrous civillian-gun-ownership-cult going on, but what is the reason? Of course it is that the U.S.A. is also the only country in the world that has a political organization (the NRA) devoted entirely to promoting civillian gun ownership. At the end of the day you gun nuts are just spewing out propaganda fed to you by a political wing of the supremely-powerful gun manufacturing companies of America - you're just these corporation's bitches, basically. Why don't you also try to persuade us how "finger-licking good" KFC is or how Prada/Gucci/Nike will enhance the value of your existance - at least they aren't selling killing machines with a bunch of propaganda attached to them :lol::lol::lol: What the U.S. needs to do is follow the example of basically every other first world country out there and implement strict regulations as to who gets guns and why, and the society will become a lot safer and cease hovering around gun and violent crime rates similar to those of third world countries.
 
Yes, the ONLY reason, the only relevant causation/correlation/any other "ation" you can think of is all NRA. The NRA......The NRA.....The NRA. You are a broken record beyond repair.

You continue to repeat statements about statistics that the statistics themselves do not bear out. You simply cannot get around the fact that gun ownership is trending up and gun crime is trending down. That most of the western world is less safe than the US (except for those handful of megacities full of government sponsored gangs or with heavy gun restrictions). Why isn't that brainwashing? You somehow conflate civilian armament with sucking corporate cock. This demonstrates a profound lack of knowledge about the world both now and in history.

You are conflating possession of a gun with crime itself. We have laws about murder not because it prevents it, but to provide statute for punishment/restitution because murder is a harmful act to someone else. Mere possession of a gun hurts no one. We have laws against wrecking into other people with your car because that is a harmful act against others, not because it prevent wrecks. Merely possessing a car doesn't hurt anyone in and of itself.


Laws to prevent the breaking of laws is reactionary and childish, the sort of solution for pedantic fools under sway of the puerile corporate sponsored narrative. Is that enough ad homs for you?

Society will become safer when people like you stop ignoring the fact that government is the tool of mass murder, not the guy on the corner with a shotgun in the closet or a revolver in the night-stand.