How to achieve a wide mix?

[Mashreef]

share with me your technique regarding this matter..
i always do hard pan L/R.. and at the end of the day i had to use a widener (which i dont want to use)..

 

[greyskull]

Instead of using stereo plug ins on stereo sources, use multiple mono instead. Especially with compressors, the difference in sound on either side contributes to the perceived wideness.

 

[mickrich]

The ears hear mono (from the phantom centre) from stereo speakers or headphones when the same signal is transmitted by the left and right speakers.
A mono source is played back with the exact same sound at equal levels from both speakers.

If you use the exact same rig for left and right on guitars they will sound very similar if they are playing the same part and you will perceive it as pretty narrow. Amp sims are bad for this, especially impulses.

If you change something significant between the left and right channels the brain will decode it as a different sound from each speaker making it wider.
A different guitar is a bit wider but a different amp is much wider.

If I am using the same rig for left and right I usually put mics on different cones and rum them into different mic pres. This will give you much more width.
If I am mixing something recorded elsewhere and they have used identical rigs for left and right channels, I use URS saturation with american tranny one side and british tranny the other side. This helps but its not as good as making sure they are different while tracking.

 

[Mashreef]

The ears hear mono (from the phantom centre) from stereo speakers or headphones when the same signal is transmitted by the left and right speakers.
A mono source is played back with the exact same sound at equal levels from both speakers.

If you use the exact same rig for left and right on guitars they will sound very similar if they are playing the same part and you will perceive it as pretty narrow. Amp sims are bad for this, especially impulses.

If you change something significant between the left and right channels the brain will decode it as a different sound from each speaker making it wider.
A different guitar is a bit wider but a different amp is much wider.

If I am using the same rig for left and right I usually put mics on different cones and rum them into different mic pres. This will give you much more width.
If I am mixing something recorded elsewhere and they have used identical rigs for left and right channels, I use URS saturation with american tranny one side and british tranny the other side. This helps but its not as good as making sure they are different while tracking.

FUCKING "A" mate

 

[Mashreef]

so what i have to do is bring a good balance in the mix now

 

[aviel]

how do you route 2 mono compressors on a stereo track?

 

[greyskull]

how do you route 2 mono compressors on a stereo track?

In Pro Tools you choose multiple mono.

 

[Mikaël-ange]

Do your basic balance, panning and eq in mono.

 

[Brett - K A L I S I A]

Do your basic balance, panning and eq in mono.

What?

 

[Skinny Viking]

^ lol

I think I re-read that about 5 times as well

 

[blue_fAng]

He only meant to eq in mono

 

[szymon]

http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/f-o-h/714087-how-get-wide-overall-sound-like-pro-recordings.html
This thread may make you more clear about your concerns. It all comes down to eq, compression and panning in the first place.

 

[Mikaël-ange]

What?

Yes you read that correctly

In mono, everything is actually harder to place. You can hear phase relationship and masking way better.
Simple thing to do is trying to pan a HH. Do it in mono, and when the HH stick out more you are in the right spot.

 

[bryan_kilco]

Yes you read that correctly

In mono, everything is actually harder to place. You can hear phase relationship and masking way better.
Simple thing to do is trying to pan a HH. Do it in mono, and when the HH stick out more you are in the right spot.

But....how can you pan something in mono if.....nevermind. I get what you mean, I think. So, EQ/comp in mono to make space?

 

[Mikaël-ange]

But....how can you pan something in mono if.....nevermind. I get what you mean, I think. So, EQ/comp in mono to make space?

No, panning... With the pan pot. Sound tend to stick out when put at the right place.
That force you to not pan everything hard L/R and find place for everything.
This way, when you switch back to stereo you get a more solid center, wide mix and depth.
You don't ear panning in mono like you do in stereo, but everything don't sound dead center when panned if that make sense...

 

[bryan_kilco]

I gotcha. I'll have to try that. I never really messed with panning in mono because I assumed everything was centered and your pan knobs wouldn't make a difference.

 

[The StabbinCabin]

I can understand eq-ing in mono but the panning thing doesn't make sense. It's all being routed to a mono source I don't understand how a stereo to mono source translates differently when there is only one pocket you're able to fit everything into. I mean in theory I kind of get it but trying to imagine the science behind it doesn't make sense.

 

[Mikaël-ange]

I can understand eq-ing in mono but the panning thing doesn't make sense. It's all being routed to a mono source I don't understand how a stereo to mono source translates differently when there is only one pocket you're able to fit everything into. I mean in theory I kind of get it but trying to imagine the science behind it doesn't make sense.

Give it at try with a lead guitar or a HH for exemple
Switch your monitoring to mono, play with the pan knob to place it where it feel the best (remember the stick out effect), and switch back to stereo to listen.

For clarify a bit, I don't mix everything monitoring in mono. But I do my broad balance, eq and compression for specific element (drum, lead vox and bg vox), and most fx balance in mono.
Also take note that my typical smallest session come with 50 tracks...

 

[HOFX]

One trick I have been playing with lately is to do some mid/side EQing on the distorted rhythm guitar bus. Specifically, the low and low-mids that you normally scoop out to give room to the mono bass guitar, try applying that EQ scoop on just the mid signal.

Even with just the guitar buss solo'd, this seems to get rid of the mono part of the sounds, but doesn't leave them sounding thin.

 

[plague_rider]

is there a particular part of your mix that isn't standing out as wide as you want it or are we talking the general mix?

just a point of curiosity... the responses above will resolve the problem...