I need help on guitars. bad

[kool98769]

No matter what I do I can't really get a guitar tone that i'm actually satisfied with. It's driving me fuckin nuts.

I know the drums don't sound the best, but it's my first clip ever using slate drums, so i'm hoping i'll get better.

Theres just like, this upper midrange snarl. When i compare it to other clips, it feels like it's missing a tiny bit of top end clarity, and lower mids. But I have the lower mids cut to clear room for bass and the low end of the snare, and generally just to clean up the sound of the mix and remove mud. I mean, the mix is fairly balanced. I dunno what to do. suggestions?

Guitars are schecter+emg->countryman di->LeCto with some redwirez impulses. I could run it through my triple rectifier, but it always seems like my low mids are muddy as hell because i don't have a treated room to mic it in.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/16665737/testingclipv2.mp3

Suggestions please!
general mix critique would be greatly appreciated too.

 

[timislegend]

that's a pretty sloppy player (no offense)

as much as you want it to "sound like -blank-" ...it's not going to.


i might be stating the obvious here but... it's not a matter of throwing on a processing chain to a couple of tracks and bingo = super tone!


it's years and years and years and years, of tracking/mixing/mastering experience. (annnd years)!


may sound redundant at this point but... additive/subtractive equalization and limiting will issue a consistent workflow and eventually you will find a more reasonable method to your tone.


let's face it, even the CORK SHIFFERS are not completely satisfied with their $10,000 private stock custom guitar and $18,000 custom built amp rig and effects chain.


the answer to your question is; work harder.

 

[kool98769]

that's a pretty sloppy player (no offense)

as much as you want it to "sound like -blank-" ...it's not going to.


i might be stating the obvious here but... it's not a matter of throwing on a processing chain to a couple of tracks and bingo = super tone!


it's years and years and years and years, of tracking/mixing/mastering experience. (annnd years)!


may sound redundant at this point but... additive/subtractive equalization and limiting will issue a consistent workflow and eventually you will find a more reasonable method to your tone.


let's face it, even the CORK SHIFFERS are not completely satisfied with their $10,000 private stock custom guitar and $18,000 custom built amp rig and effects chain.


the answer to your question is; work harder.

Sorry...I think you got the wrong idea.
I'm not trying to sound like any one band or whatever. I'm trying to not follow any one persons processing chain. I'm not asking for a preset. i just want suggestions as to what to try based off other peoples experiences?

 

[timislegend]

i'm aware.

not saying you are "trying to sound like" ...i just meant, the only way you are going to get the guitars to sound the way you want them to is by spending countless hours and hundreds of different combinations of eq/compression/amp/cab/mic/limiter/strings/pickups etc etc.


and to expand on my initial comment; subtractive equalization will subdue the frequencies in your signal that you do not like and additive equalization will promote the ones you do like... limiting is a better form of dynamics processing (imo) for guitars because a limiter reacts quicker than a typical compressor and more importantly, the sonic characteristics employ a clearer detail (if done "correctly").

***for the record: not anywhere in your "chain discription," did i see any processing, such as compression, eq, limiting, saturation... etc. (unless you just failed to mention it).

once again, i am aware of your frustration as i am sure you have spent a lot of time deducing sounds that you like and don't like but i can't be more clear when i say, try harder.

one day you will find an excellent tone (as a result of your countless hours of tweaking) and feel that it is decent enough to print... then in the mixing/mastering phase bring the tone to life.

good luck!

 

[timislegend]

also;

this is how i have recorded guitar in the past:

gibson goldtop with bareknuckle - aftermaths (brand new strings)

mesa dual rec - v30 2x12" cab

settings - gain (about 10 o'clock) / bass (around 11 o'clock) / treble around 1 o'clock / pres (around 2 o'clock)

-mic: sm57 - modded (on axis) | royer r121
-preamps: manley
-converters: lynx aurora

-processing: subtractive eq - uad ssl e | additive eq - massive passive (outboard)
-limiting: manley vari-mu (slow recovery)


then a bunch of stuff in mastering, like m/s processing and multiband compression.


this was just my experience... it sounded great (from what i remember) but i don't think i have used this method ever again.

 

[kool98769]

i'm aware.

not saying you are "trying to sound like" ...i just meant, the only way you are going to get the guitars to sound the way you want them to is by spending countless hours and hundreds of different combinations of eq/compression/amp/cab/mic/limiter/strings/pickups etc etc.


and to expand on my initial comment; subtractive equalization will subdue the frequencies in your signal that you do not like and additive equalization will promote the ones you do like... limiting is a better form of dynamics processing (imo) for guitars because a limiter reacts quicker than a typical compressor and more importantly, the sonic characteristics employ a clearer detail (if done "correctly").

***for the record: not anywhere in your "chain discription," did i see any processing, such as compression, eq, limiting, saturation... etc. (unless you just failed to mention it).

once again, i am aware of your frustration as i am sure you have spent a lot of time deducing sounds that you like and don't like but i can't be more clear when i say, try harder.

one day you will find an excellent tone (as a result of your countless hours of tweaking) and feel that it is decent enough to print... then in the mixing/mastering phase bring the tone to life.

good luck!

Ah, I understand now.
I mean, i have my ideal tone and know exactly what it sounds like in a room. but getting that to translate into a recording is a much different story! haha.
Of course, I understand about trying harder. I haven't been doing this for very long, but i've been making constant progress. I just want to make sure I don't lose the fire under my ass. I'm finally being able to wrap my mind around the concept of things such as why you eq before compressing, multibanding before limiting, etc. Just understanding is making a huge difference.
Although you didn't really say much as a whole, I think I understand what you're trying to say....thanks for the advice!

Oh, and after listening to the DI's of my guitar, I realized that the high mid hump is simply because my guitar sounds like that. Sounds like i'll just have to use a different guitar to get the sound I'm looking for.

 

[jimwilbourne]

please tune.

 

[kool98769]

please tune.

For real. It's actually in tune. I just didn't have my guitar properly intonated.

 

[Fandus]

What kind of mod was on your sm57 tim? How did it benefit the sound?

 

[timislegend]

i have a few sm57's with tab-funkenwerk mods.

it sounds similar to the sm7.

 

[ahjteam]

No matter what I do I can't really get a guitar tone that i'm actually satisfied with. It's driving me fuckin nuts.

I know the drums don't sound the best, but it's my first clip ever using slate drums, so i'm hoping i'll get better.

Theres just like, this upper midrange snarl. When i compare it to other clips, it feels like it's missing a tiny bit of top end clarity, and lower mids. But I have the lower mids cut to clear room for bass and the low end of the snare, and generally just to clean up the sound of the mix and remove mud. I mean, the mix is fairly balanced. I dunno what to do. suggestions?

Guitars are schecter+emg->countryman di->LeCto with some redwirez impulses. I could run it through my triple rectifier, but it always seems like my low mids are muddy as hell because i don't have a treated room to mic it in.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/16665737/testingclipv2.mp3

Suggestions please!
general mix critique would be greatly appreciated too.

where is the bass guitar?

 

[kool98769]

where is the bass guitar?

you can't hear the bass guitar?

 

[ahjteam]

you can't hear the bass guitar?

Nope, barely. Not with headphones, Genelecs or with just the sub.

 

[kool98769]

Nope, barely. Not with headphones, Genelecs or with just the sub.

Weird. I mean, there is more room in my mix for bass but uh. i dunno. I hear it pretty well in my akg 702s. It's kinda dull sounding. Not something that cuts through a ton.

 

[Ionei]

Nope, barely. Not with headphones, Genelecs or with just the sub.

I can hear the bass guitar on my shitty earbuds.

 

[ahjteam]

I can hear the bass guitar on my shitty earbuds.

If I wouldn't have heard some of the bass playing errors there, I would've said that the song doesn't have a bass guitar in there, because the quality of the low end sounds more like a boomy guitar than a bass.

 

[kool98769]

If I wouldn't have heard some of the bass playing errors there, I would've said that the song doesn't have a bass guitar in there, because the quality of the low end sounds more like a boomy guitar than a bass.

Errors?
uh. there aren't errors in there dude. It's just playing something other than the root note of what the guitars are playing.