New album Foregone out February 2023

[Jester Slave]

There are setlists which are forgiveable for a festival tour: you play for a general audience, so the majority of your set (especially if you aren't headlining) has to be safe. Give the audience a bang, while simultaneously pulling in potential new listeners with your biggest hits. I get it.

But for a proper tour?! This current setlist is a mix between vanilla and dogshit. I am not exaggerating, every time that piece of shit The Hive makes it onto the setlist I listen to it again, because I can't remember a single note from that song, it ends, and I am still not sure what the fuck had I just listened, because it just kinda started and ended. It's not bad, it's not good, but it's 100% forgettable. EG , Darker Times and Graveland have also no place on that setlist. I'm not the biggest fan of Ordinary Story either, but at least it's a rarity and still far better than the previously mentioned 4, so fine, it's cool I guess.

Then you get the hits and it's almost over. Would I still see this setlist for the Xth time? Sure, the hits are hits for a reason, but I barely have any excitement for these songs. It'd be cool to see Alias, TQP and IAA, but as a fan, I'd be much more excited to hear some actual rarities or at least less played songs. Even from the old flames era there are a bunch of better songs, like the ones you mentioned, but it's a travesty that they don't play Jotun for example. How the fuck do they look at Whoracle with songs like Jotun, Jester Script, Food, Episode 666, Gyroscope and conclude that it's time for The Hive AGAIN?! I wouldn't even mind if not for the rest of the garbage there.

Is it hard to play F(r)iend over EG, literally anything (but The Puzzle) from SOAPF over Darker Times, December Flower/Moonshield/Artifacts/Dead Eternity over Graveland, and switching out 1 or 2 hits for something else? Yes, even for something else from the newest stuff, because even if nothing would beat OFTW from the new record, it's still supposed to be some sort of era where you have the (mis)fortune of hearing songs which you'll most likely never be able to do so again, while OFTW would eventually return to rotation. Don't even get me started on The Mirror's Truth, because that's just another can of worms, and I'm already tired.

But sure, considering they are returining after 10 years, I'd be happy if they started the set with playing LS in its entirety, so the bar is admittedly low, I just hoped for more. I don't even ask for one of those crazy Scandinavian sets, because that would really be wishful thinking.

 

[DE4life]

Well, ultimately I agree, they're just being lazy and it's annoying. I don't get how they can be content to just play the same older songs over and over again - regardless of the quality of song chosen. Even with the relatively newer stuff - the title track of SOAPF is an absolute gem, FITW and New Dawn both very cool as well... But nah, we'll do bang fucking average Darker Times for the millionth time. It's like when they decided to play Drifter of all songs from Reroute for years. Like, it's okay, but almost any other song on that album would be more interesting if we're being honest.

They're either incredibly boring, autistic, or as Grayfox speculated, phoning it in at this point.

 

[Xpyro125]

Honestly, I’d be happy with anything from SoaPF, maybe save for the interludes since they probably wouldn’t slot into a setlist that well. I know Darker Times is the usual choice from the album, but I didn’t get to see it live, so I’m admittedly much more partial to it since it gets dropped from the setlist more than their other usual picks like The Hive, Graveland, and either of the two ASoP songs (One is enough for a tour like this, and I heard them both when I went). As much as I love The Hive, there are so many absolute killers on Whoracle that basically anything on it would wow an audience, maybe save for the title track (Which I do still like).

The Quiet Place, Trigger, and especially Ordinary Story (Holy fucking shit) are wonderful starts, but it sucks that they stuck with same-y picks for quite a few of their albums. Even Lunar Strain isn’t starved for choice, and yet it’s always Behind Space. I’ll absolutely forgive Everything’s Gone because the only other SC track suited for their kind of setlists is When the World Explodes, and honestly… Nah. That one dropped off a fucking cliff to me.

Graveland, once again, is fucking boring. At least Scorn actually comes alive when it’s played live. As good of a performance as the band gives with Graveland, I just did not fucking feel it.

 

[Jester Slave]

Yeah, it's sad that Trigger is not more of a staple, but they could've picked Paralyzed, Rusted Nail or Through Oblivion from SC - or god forbid: nothing. LS should be happy to be even represented, it's either BS or nothing.

This whole "play at least 1 song from each record" feels so forced. Do a rotating setlist where you can cover all your bases and keep all your shows fresh and special. Yes, people are bound to be disappointed for getting show B instead of show C or A, but I think it'd be worth it. Frankly, it almost feels a bit condescending the way they are doing it right now.

 

[Xpyro125]

Can’t really argue with any of those notions personally. It does beg the question of why they brought December Flower back for a little bit then drop it for Graveland just as suddenly as it arrived. Horrible decision, and we can all agree on that.

 

[eochaid]

Yeah, it's sad that Trigger is not more of a staple, but they could've picked Paralyzed, Rusted Nail or Through Oblivion from SC - or god forbid: nothing. LS should be happy to be even represented, it's either BS or nothing.

This whole "play at least 1 song from each record" feels so forced. Do a rotating setlist where you can cover all your bases and keep all your shows fresh and special. Yes, people are bound to be disappointed for getting show B instead of show C or A, but I think it'd be worth it. Frankly, it almost feels a bit condescending the way they are doing it right now.

It's an hour and a half show. So a few concepts must be sacrificed.

 

[Jester Slave]

Stand Ablaze as well. If they were to rotate that and BS for example, I don't think many people would complain.

And I still can't get over the fact that they are only playing 3 songs from Foregone. Not playing Meet Your Maker in particular pisses me off to no end. It's a decent song which grew on me (coud've been so much better, but oh well...), it found mainstream success as well, it's not part of the 3 songs you've been playing for a year now from the record and it's not hard to sing live, pretty similar to The End. But they aren't playing Foregone part II. either, which was another single which was well-received, and can actually slot into the older songs in the set. Dialogue would be a pretty cool live song as well, I think the instrumental part is really groovy, and overall very similar to Deliver Us, so, you know, maybe switch them out?! These fuckers will play Monsters In A Ballroom years after the SC tour, but -- whatever, it's just dumb as fuck, and I don't buy the "can't sing them live" excuse because I doubt he ever hit all the notes on Deliver Us for example.

 

[Jester Slave]

It's an hour and a half show. So a few concepts must be sacrificed.

I understand that, and I am aware that many of my ideas are wishful thinking, but I'd be happy to settle with a middle ground. Switch around a few "mid" songs and remove one staple from the set. I don't think that's too much to ask for.

 

[eochaid]

The problem here is how to keep all the fans happy. At this point, that is impossible. The shouls be doing two or three different shows for every venue. I understand your concerns though and I agree with you but they seem to be successful with what they're doing now.

 

[Xpyro125]

Stand Ablaze as well. If they were to rotate that and BS for example, I don't think many people would complain.

And I still can't get over the fact that they are only playing 3 songs from Foregone. Not playing Meet Your Maker in particular pisses me off to no end. It's a decent song which grew on me (coud've been so much better, but oh well...), it found mainstream success as well, it's not part of the 3 songs you've been playing for a year now from the record and it's not hard to sing live, pretty similar to The End. But they aren't playing Foregone part II. either, which was another single which was well-received, and can actually slot into the older songs in the set. Dialogue would be a pretty cool live song as well, I think the instrumental part is really groovy, and overall very similar to Deliver Us, so, you know, maybe switch them out?! These fuckers will play Monsters In A Ballroom years after the SC tour, but -- whatever, it's just dumb as fuck, and I don't buy the "can't sing them live" excuse because I doubt he ever hit all the notes on Deliver Us for example.

Honestly, rotating Stand Ablaze and Behind Space would be pretty fucking cool. Not much more to say than that.

Even though Meet Your Maker is one of my personal least favorite songs on the album, I really can’t argue with that logic. If it’s successful and fans love it, it makes sense to play it. I personally think SOSD, TGD, and Part I are probably the best picks from the album for live performances, but it still would be nice to rotate them with another song here and there.

The only counterargument (And counterargument to my counterargument) that I can make is that they all do have to learn/relearn the songs, and play them well at that. However, they all learned December Flower, notoriously one of the most technical and difficult IF songs and performed it well like six(?) times just to drop it. That’s just fucking retarded, personally.

I know there’s more to respond to, but I’ve been feeling all sorts of fucked up for the past day, so I’m going back to bed now. Anyways, I’ll see you guys in 15 or so.

 

[The Grayfox]

I was lucky enough to get Worlds Within the Margin back in '06 and lost my shit for it. It was really, really good live. They thought enough of it back then to even open a few shows on that same tour with it. The same complaints people have now were around back then too; nobody is saying 'don't play anything from Clayman.' But maybe rotate OFTW and Pinball Map out and play Swim and the title track -- I'm done asking for Suburban Me, although that would be great. There are plenty of songs in the back catalog that have been proven to work well live, they just don't play them anymore. Why does Coerced Coexistence never get played? Hell, even 'deeper cuts' from albums like RTR that were in sets before, like Vacuum. System almost never gets played anymore, the title track or Egonomic... just something different. They give little bits of it occasionally but it always winds itself back to a standard setlist with 1 or 2 slight surprises that shouldn't even be considered surprises.

 

[DE4life]

Honestly, I’d be happy with anything from SoaPF, maybe save for the interludes since they probably wouldn’t slot into a setlist that well. I know Darker Times is the usual choice from the album, but I didn’t get to see it live, so I’m admittedly much more partial to it since it gets dropped from the setlist more than their other usual picks like The Hive, Graveland, and either of the two ASoP songs (One is enough for a tour like this, and I heard them both when I went). As much as I love The Hive, there are so many absolute killers on Whoracle that basically anything on it would wow an audience, maybe save for the title track (Which I do still like).

The Quiet Place, Trigger, and especially Ordinary Story (Holy fucking shit) are wonderful starts, but it sucks that they stuck with same-y picks for quite a few of their albums. Even Lunar Strain isn’t starved for choice, and yet it’s always Behind Space. I’ll absolutely forgive Everything’s Gone because the only other SC track suited for their kind of setlists is When the World Explodes, and honestly… Nah. That one dropped off a fucking cliff to me.

Graveland, once again, is fucking boring. At least Scorn actually comes alive when it’s played live. As good of a performance as the band gives with Graveland, I just did not fucking feel it.

I've never actually heard them play Darker Times from SOAPF live, and I'm quite OK with that. I've only seen them once since SOAPF was released and that was in 2019, and on that occasion they played All For Me and WTDSD. The latter, great, the former... bleugh. Although it was a bit better live than on CD at least.

Somehow I've literally seen all of my most hated IF tracks live, despite some of them not even being regulars on the setlist. Bottled, Scream, The Chosen Pessimist (TWICE), Here Until Forever, All For Me, House, The Truth... I mean, some of these it's like, yeah, they've played them a lot over the years... but Bottled? Are you kidding me? Setlist.fm says it's only ever been played 40 times and somehow I was there for one of them. It was also the only time they ever played it in the UK. THANKS.

With that said, the same show that had Bottled also had Dark Signs - which setlist.fm says was only ever played 15 times, and indeed, the show I saw it on (Bloodstock 2007) is the last recorded time it was played. Love that one, so... delight and angers, I guess that's the way it's supposed to be.

 

[DE4life]

Frankly, it almost feels a bit condescending the way they are doing it right now.

Lol. Rest assured, in this instance it isn't that they're being condescending... they're just lazy. Anders has been condescending plenty of times in the past to older fans "they want anudda jestah race", "they don't jump jump jump muddafukkas to the old songs", "if you changed production then [insert new album here] would have loadsa stuff that sounds like the jestah race people are just idiots and don't understand how music works like i do", "i don't need to learn to sing because i have emotion in my voice mang", "won't listen to a band until they've released 5 albums", "can't play da old songs because of all the guitar tracks but having a million vocal backing vocal tracks and keyboard tracks are fine because we make songs for a live environment and fans don't get it we can't just have a hundred guitar layers but it's ok to layer everything else"... and so on and so on and so on, but for this specific thing, it's just the band doing the bare minimum to make it appear that they still care about da roootz.

As far as not understanding why more Foregone isn't played - if you think about it, it makes sense. Foregone is the rootsiest album ever to exist. It's so absolutely roots-infested that it has, through sheer force of da rootz, become In Flames oldest and most hardcore album. Think back to how they've treated older albums - LS, TJR, Whoracle especially. Barely played, and if they do play those songs then it's the same ones over and over again. Behind Space, Graveland, The Hive.

Same treatment for Foregone, and we should have seen it coming, as Foregone technically comes before LS in the album order nowadays. It's a miracle they play anything off it at all.

 

[DE4life]

For a festival, Bloodstock 2007 actually had a pretty weird setlist.

Leeches
Dead Alone
Touch of Red
Pinball Map
Trigger
Dark Signs
Episode 666
Graveland (yes even 16 years ago this was the go-to from TJR)
Colony
System
Bottled
Egonomic
Come Clarity
OFTW
Cloud Connected
The Quiet Place
Take This Life
My Sweet Shadow

Now granted we have a pretty solid sprinkling of 'da hitz' here for 2007, but Dead Alone, Touch of Red, Dark Signs, Graveland, System, Bottled and Egonomic were all very or somewhat rare, even by 2007 standards. Even more so for a festival set.

 

[mindd]

Weird how they dropped Trigger and Drifter off the setlist after 2017 (not counting Trigger at Dalhalla Brinner and one random gig this November).
Also, Colony wasn't played at all this year (again, not counting Dalhalla), which is a crime.
Another crime is that Minus has been played only 8 times, all in 2003.

But the fucking apparent modern classic Everything's Gone is being played regularly.
And obviously, thanks to its rootziness, State of Slow Decay has already been played more than Reroute to Remain, Resin, Coerced Coexistence, and a lot of other good old stuff.

Bonus fun fact 1: Upon an Oaken Throne has been played more than Deep Inside, Follow Me and Stay With Me. An obvious indicator of ITM's insufficient rootziness.
Bonus fun fact 2: The rarest song performed by IF that I had a (dis)pleasure of hearing live was Hurt (NIN cover) with 13 times played total. I've forgotten about that and would rather have it stay that way, but alas. Adding salt to the injury is that they've played Dawn of a New Day in all concerts before the one I've went to, like just a couple of days before that, and of course they had to drop it from the setlist. Thank you guys,

 

[DE4life]

Whilst it is indeed a disgrace that Minus has only been played 8 times, the only positive is that it actually was recorded, so we at least have one video of that track being played live.

 

[Jester Slave]

It's funny, because Hurt is the closing song of 98% of NIN shows, a sort of epitome, but Anders completely missed the point of that song, and him randomly growling in it is just baffling. Like when amateur actors are sweating bullets to emphasize every single word they say, like they are aiming for an Oscar, instead of let things simmer and come to them naturally. And I get that he performed the Johnny Cash version, but it's just as abyssmal if you compare it to that.

That Save Me performance is probably the most embarassed I've ever felt for Anders. He was like a whore horse trying to ice skate in a church.

The Bloodstock set is weird, but Dark Signs intro gives me such nostalgic chills. Love that intro.

 

[DE4life]

Dark Signs is a really underrated track in the IF discography. In 2007 I probably didn't think so, so probably I didn't appreciate it so much at Bloodstock, but nowadays I'd love if they played it. Opening 10 seconds are one of the best openings to any In Flames song, would have sounded even better with Colony style production. Reroute's production sadly nerfs the power of the guitars. Still sounds great, but should sound incredible. When Anders says "cut down to half a member", does he mean dude's physical or metaphorical penis has been cut in half? Some way to open a song anyway, love how it switches between the melodies and riffs during the verses.

Pre-chorus has that amateur-clean vocal charm that exists throughout Reroute. It's really unique and nowadays I quite like it. Although "and you call me names" always gives me a chuckle, sounds like something a ten year old would say. That's our hipster hamster for you though.

Screams in the song are actually in quite a high register, reminds me of how they sounded on ATFRT. Sounds painful, but at the same time I selfishly like that style of vocal, even if it was killing Anders' throat. Really like that final "what life can provide" scream at the very end.

It's funny, but literally until now I missed the "are you afraid?" line in the pre-chorus. One of the things I love about older IF stuff is, even after all these years, hearing things I haven't caught before.

Guitar work between 02:19 - 02:31 is really nice, but again, that fucking Reroute production burying it way too low.

Well anyway, awesome song, and here's the instrumental version because, why not.

 

[DE4life]

Having just listened to the Clayman album instrumentally, I have to say, Reroute and everything after it really was a huge step down guitar-wise. I say that as somebody who likes Reroute in particular as an album, but honestly, when you switch between Clayman and Reroute instrumentally it is night and day. Clayman is absolutely unbelievable in terms of pure guitar melodies. It's so tight structurally as well. Reroute has some of the old magic but the effort on Clayman is far higher - it isn't just production, either. Almost every song on Clayman is bursting to the brim with melodic energy and drive. Far more so than even the great albums that came before it. Nordstrom may have worked them hard during those sessions, but it's impossible to deny he squeezed every last drop of potential from Jesper and Bjorn on that album. Everything that came afterwards - and I include Come Clarity and SOAPF in that - is simply nowhere near the same level, melodically, as what was achieved on Clayman. Even TJR, Whoracle and Colony do not get to that level instrumentally, although they are of course all incredible albums in their own way.

It goes without saying that switching to stuff like Battles is absolutely fucking tragic, especially when you consider one of the primary songwriters on Clayman remains in the band. You can't help but wonder how the fuck Bjorn went from penning solos like we hear on OFTW , S&A and ATFRT to the absolute garbage on SC & Battles. How he and Anders can say their music has "evolved", or that albums like SC & Battles are a continuation of the IF sound, with a straight face is beyond me. Devolved is the correct term here. There is more effort put into a single track on Clayman than the entirety of Battles, and that really isn't an exaggeration. Instrumentally Battles is so simplistic it is actually quite pathetic. I can give SC a pass on some level as they were intentionally trying something different, regardless of how the end product sounded.

 

[The Grayfox]

Lol. Rest assured, in this instance it isn't that they're being condescending... they're just lazy. Anders has been condescending plenty of times in the past to older fans "they want anudda jestah race", "they don't jump jump jump muddafukkas to the old songs", "if you changed production then [insert new album here] would have loadsa stuff that sounds like the jestah race people are just idiots and don't understand how music works like i do", "i don't need to learn to sing because i have emotion in my voice mang", "won't listen to a band until they've released 5 albums", "can't play da old songs because of all the guitar tracks but having a million vocal backing vocal tracks and keyboard tracks are fine because we make songs for a live environment and fans don't get it we can't just have a hundred guitar layers but it's ok to layer everything else"... and so on and so on and so on, but for this specific thing, it's just the band doing the bare minimum to make it appear that they still care about da roootz.

As far as not understanding why more Foregone isn't played - if you think about it, it makes sense. Foregone is the rootsiest album ever to exist. It's so absolutely roots-infested that it has, through sheer force of da rootz, become In Flames oldest and most hardcore album. Think back to how they've treated older albums - LS, TJR, Whoracle especially. Barely played, and if they do play those songs then it's the same ones over and over again. Behind Space, Graveland, The Hive.

Same treatment for Foregone, and we should have seen it coming, as Foregone technically comes before LS in the album order nowadays. It's a miracle they play anything off it at all.

Why does Anders sound like a Puerto Rican from New York City?