Question for Borknagar (or anyone well versed in uh?Norweigen?)
- Thread starter KamelotGuardian
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Phyros
Blue Jesus
Uh.. Hallou Borkis board..
Guess it was just a matter of time before I found my way here... Anyways...
*insert agreeing smiley*
when written I understand (almost) everything of scandinavian, but spoken...
Yepp, seems to be that that is the case to, eventho I understand bokmål faaaaaar better than nynorsk... I, like the the others don´t know why tho... I´v heard that norrmän blames swedish national TV for understanding Swedish...
Anyways... May it be that Swedish has evolved more while Norweigian have stayed more tr00 ( )? Just specualating...
The Swedish dialects are quite different, but not _that_ much, if you talk swedish and not slang. I mean... You can understand eachother _perfectly_ all over Sweden, but Skånska (the dialect in the southernmost Sweden) can be hard sometimes... Must be the closness to Denmark...
-phyros ( swede, eating some swede, wearing and listening to suede )
Guess it was just a matter of time before I found my way here... Anyways...*insert agreeing smiley*
when written I understand (almost) everything of scandinavian, but spoken...
Yepp, seems to be that that is the case to, eventho I understand bokmål faaaaaar better than nynorsk... I, like the the others don´t know why tho... I´v heard that norrmän blames swedish national TV for understanding Swedish...
Anyways... May it be that Swedish has evolved more while Norweigian have stayed more tr00 (
)? Just specualating... The Swedish dialects are quite different, but not _that_ much, if you talk swedish and not slang. I mean... You can understand eachother _perfectly_ all over Sweden, but Skånska (the dialect in the southernmost Sweden) can be hard sometimes...
Must be the closness to Denmark... -phyros ( swede, eating some swede, wearing and listening to suede )
corrado
jo eh
perhaps "akurat or exact" sounds similar in many languages because it´s imported from some ancient scholar language, like latin or greece... I think that´s why many scientific words are similar.
Blackspirit
there are no words left
Originally posted by Phyros
when written I understand (almost) everything of scandinavian, but spoken...
Lol! I soon discovered that you have problems both
reading and hearing Norwegian! >
P Hehehe... Nah, just teasing. But it's weird. Norwegians seem
to understand Swedish better than the Swedes
understand Norwegian...
Then it's easier for Norwegians to read danish,
while understanding what they say is a totally
different story >
PIt's quite the same here. I can understand written Dutch surprisingly well, but understanding it when it's spoken is always a matter of luck. The general meaning isn't that hard to catch, though.
Fjelltussa
...
Originally posted by Ziuwarian
Are bokmal and nynorsk THAT much different, really? Haven't tried norwegian, yet, but I suppose I'll have to learn it soon
Bokmål and Nynorsk is getting closer all the time, but it's still very different. And in some dialects, there are still cases, or whatever it's called in english (akkusativ, nominativ, genitiv and dativ). It is in the dialect spoken where I live. -Though not too many really use; mostly old ppl. This was also used in norse, but it hasn't been used in Denmark since we had the same language in all Scandinavia almost 2000 years ago. And the thing is, with bokmål and nynorsk, and the dialects, that not only are there different accents, but the words are different, and the grammar. Just to take one examle from different dialects: "E svalla kji likt som de". That is a dialect. The same sentence in Bokmål is "jæi snakker ikke likt såm dæi" (both examples are spelled the way they are pronounced, and not correctly). (These sentences means "I don't speak the same way you do".) Nynorsk is based on the dialects and, gramatically, norse, while bokmål is based on danish, and the way the upper class ppl in Kristiania (now Oslo) spoke in the 19th century, just with more and more norwegian words and frases.
The way these two written languages were made, are also the reason that the written language debate in Norway are a rather sore spot for a lot of ppl. It has so much to do with our history and identity. This is also partly why a lot of ppl refuse to understand the form that they don't write/speak themselves. This is ppl from both sides, and they _do_ understand much more than they say. They just don't want to. Like nynorsk ppl claim that bokmål ppl think they are better than themselves; city ppl who don't think nynorsk is good enough for them. Then you have the bokmål ppl who actually do think that nynorsk is just old fashioned and lame, for peasants, and just smth that they don't want to spend their time learning. But of course, the rather big differences in diealects also cause difficulties in understanding. I myslef sometimes have a bit difficulties with understanding ppl from the south western Norway. But the dialects there are beautiful, though!
@Phyros: depends on from when you mean the evolving has happened. The nor. dialects don't sound very much the same as norse now any more. But then, the greatest changes there happened from approximately 1349 (the black death) until about 1500. That was the gramatical changes.
Mammon
Indifferent
Originally posted by Fjelltussa
I myself sometimes have a bit difficulties with understanding ppl from the south western Norway. But the dialects there are beautiful, though!
I'm from the south western Norway, but I don't find my dialect beautiful
Ziuwarian
Ancient
Well... HUGE thanx for that insight, Fjell!! Sounds almost like comparing normal German with for example Swiss German or Austrian (Just examples)
I suppose I will start to learn Norwegian then, soon... Have to decide which norwegian then, tho
Sounds almost like comparing normal German with for example Swiss German or Austrian (Just examples)I suppose I will start to learn Norwegian then, soon... Have to decide which norwegian then, tho
Somber Soul
Member
- Oct 12, 2001
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Yes, comparing German languages to each other + comparing regional varieties within one German-speaking country to each other (this comes closer to Bokmål and Nynorsk issue, I believe).
So, Fjelltussa, did you study languages at some point?
So, Fjelltussa, did you study languages at some point?
Fjelltussa
...
@mammon: I think it is!
@Ziuwarian: Hehe, I guess this thing with two written languages within one language can be a bit confusing to someone who haven't know it from they learneds to talk. But it's not impossible of course, and I'd love to help you! -If you help me with learning german, hehe! Bokmål is most used in media and such, so I guess that's most easy to learn. There are also mush more words that are similar to german, that we use other, old norwegian words for in nynorsk. But in both you can choose a lot, so that it can get quite similar.
@Somber Soul: Nope, I did not.
@Ziuwarian: Hehe, I guess this thing with two written languages within one language can be a bit confusing to someone who haven't know it from they learneds to talk. But it's not impossible of course, and I'd love to help you! -If you help me with learning german, hehe! Bokmål is most used in media and such, so I guess that's most easy to learn. There are also mush more words that are similar to german, that we use other, old norwegian words for in nynorsk. But in both you can choose a lot, so that it can get quite similar.
@Somber Soul: Nope, I did not.
Mammon
Indifferent
Karldin
The Watcher
So you see what stuff they push us to learn. Not exactly what you're most interested in as a 7th grader.
Voice of God
Harmless Bum
Related yes, but not closely. Maybe as closely as Swedish is related to Latin or so. Hungarian and Finnish are very different, there's no chance in hell I could understand any Hungarian without learning it.
Somber Soul
Member
- Oct 12, 2001
- 972
- 4
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I didn't mean to imply that you could actually understand each other. But these two languages most be more closely related to each other than Swedish with Latin (they're only very remotely related; Swedish and German might be the better example). You know, among the philologies at university Finno-Ugristics is one faculty. So you can't study either Finnish or Hungarian alone - you take it both. This means there must a very close link.
Morgana
Vintermagi
Qsilver
Heathen Terrier
There was some discussion about finnish/hungarian at Vintersorg board long time ago.. let's see if I get little more bored I could dig it and paste the link. But there wasn't really any new/special info there so..
To me foreign accents are a good thing that brings charm.
And you can even mix languages in the same song (like Anorexia Nevrosa do : English, French and German). I think it's a good idea, on est en Europe !
And you can even mix languages in the same song (like Anorexia Nevrosa do : English, French and German). I think it's a good idea, on est en Europe !
Gaunerin
vanquish the pain
TravisW
Member
Heheh---this is a fun thread.
Here's a bit of a funny story...
About 5 years ago, I was in Copenhagen. I stopped in a 7-11 there to buy a Coke, and behind me in line was a guy who sounded like he was from around the Sogn area in Norway. I paid the 16 kroner for my bottle of pop (OUCH!!!) and it was his turn in line. The Danish teller told him the price, to which the Norwegian replied "Kva?"
To which the Dane replied "Hva?"
The Dane repeated the price....
"Kva?"
Since I had just been through the same thing before, I just told him the price. Thus an American who couldn't understand Danish and has a really tough time with Western Norwegian dialects helped avert an international Cola incident.
I learned some Norwegian growing up, and then when I got older I actually studied it. Unfortunately, most of the people in North Dakota who speak Norwegian are getting old or dying, so I'm starting to forget a lot of it, and it's getting tougher for me to understand.
Here's a bit of a funny story...
About 5 years ago, I was in Copenhagen. I stopped in a 7-11 there to buy a Coke, and behind me in line was a guy who sounded like he was from around the Sogn area in Norway. I paid the 16 kroner for my bottle of pop (OUCH!!!) and it was his turn in line. The Danish teller told him the price, to which the Norwegian replied "Kva?"
To which the Dane replied "Hva?"
The Dane repeated the price....
"Kva?"
Since I had just been through the same thing before, I just told him the price. Thus an American who couldn't understand Danish and has a really tough time with Western Norwegian dialects helped avert an international Cola incident.
I learned some Norwegian growing up, and then when I got older I actually studied it. Unfortunately, most of the people in North Dakota who speak Norwegian are getting old or dying, so I'm starting to forget a lot of it, and it's getting tougher for me to understand.
