Question for Steve and other guitarists...

[lad]

Alright lads and lassies, I currently use a Jackson RR3 for playing metal. However, the neck action is, shall we say, not so nice from around the 10th fret onwards. Basically, I far prefer it for rhythm playing than lead, and have opted for a 7-string - probably an Ibanez - as my next "save'n'purchase". I'm wondering how much of an effect it'll have on the overall cleanliness and fluidity of my playing? I mean, will I become sloppier trying to adapt to a thinner next and closer action, and vice-versa? How long would it take for me to be able to play fluidly on both guitars?

Any help/advice will be appreciated.

 

[Nebulous]

I'd say it all depends on your personal preference and experiance. I use to preffer the thinner Jackson style necks, but now I'm playing a Schecter C1, which is a bit thicker, and I seem to play just as good on it, preffering it, though longer playing sessions will result in some sore hands (like 4 plus hours) due to the thicker radius. You might find a similar thing gonig from a 6 to a 7, you might not.
As for the change in playing, it could go either way from the start, but as long as the new ax is playable, with a proper setup, you should be able to adjust to it. If you want to be able to play both properly, just practice on both.

While you're in the market for a 7, I'd recommend checknig what Schecter have to offer.

 

[Liverslapper]

you will adjust to it, it just takes time. i remember my first electric guitar when i was 9 was a Fender Stratocaster, played that for the longest time and then moved up to a KH ESP, then from that i moved to the monster C-7, took a lot of time to get use too, but once you adjust you will be fine. Just find what is most comfortable. I have small hands so it was harder to adjust necks when i would switch guitars, like what Nebuluos said, it all depends on your personal preference and experiance.

 

[JBroll]

No Ibanez seven. Not happy.

A problem with Ibanez is that they use cheap woods and are usually very slimmed down - a bigger guitar, like one of the ESP/LTD Les Paul-style guitars or a Schecter, preferably made of mahogany, will sound thicker and respond better in just about any situation. Ibanez guitars are also very overpriced, and very few come with pickups that are made well. Schecters come with EMGs or Seymour Duncans, ESPs come with EMGs... hell, the stock pickups in the Deans and a new BC Rich I've played slay a good number of the aftermarket pickups out there, so you're just going to get those guitars sounding better.

That aside, guitars are going to feel different around the 12th fret or so - your string is cut down to half its 'open' length and less, so it's just going to behave differently. Your guitar also has to compensate for the slightly elliptic vibration of the string - this is one of the reasons why necks are bowed and not completely straight - by leaving the string with a little more room to 'play' around there - but in all fairness it may be set up wrong, so check out projectguitar.com to see how to set up a guitar well. Any way you cut it, though, different parts of the neck will play differently, and while you can set it up in ways you like to an extent you're never going to get identical everything all up and down the neck.

As far as playing with fluidity, if your guitar is not falling apart you have no excuse for blaming your equipment - I willingly set my action high and use thick strings for the sound alone, and I still have enough fluidity to play just about anything I need. It comes down to practice - you could stick a pair of dimes under my Dean's high E at the 24th fret and not budge the string, if even touch it, and I learned the solo to Under A Glass Moon on that same axe. If you were playing a Wal-Mart guitar with frets popping out and the neck turning into a rollercoaster track, you might earn some sympathy, but fluidity does not need come from low action any more than pick attack should come from having a gold-plated bridge - it's how you play. Get lessons and learn to use a metronome, and you'll build up speed on any guitar - get a guitar with a really low action and a flat fretboard and you'll be able to play differently on that guitar, but the minute you touch another axe you've lost it. Hell, if you get shredding on a guitar that doesn't play well, you won't get any worse on an expensive guitar that's tricked out to fuck and back - but it's just as easy to play horribly on a custom-shop Jackson as it is to play horribly on a Squier Bullet.

Jeff

 

[Steve Smyth]

No Ibanez seven. Not happy.

A problem with Ibanez is that they use cheap woods and are usually very slimmed down - a bigger guitar, like one of the ESP/LTD Les Paul-style guitars or a Schecter, preferably made of mahogany, will sound thicker and respond better in just about any situation. Ibanez guitars are also very overpriced, and very few come with pickups that are made well. Schecters come with EMGs or Seymour Duncans, ESPs come with EMGs... hell, the stock pickups in the Deans and a new BC Rich I've played slay a good number of the aftermarket pickups out there, so you're just going to get those guitars sounding better.

That aside, guitars are going to feel different around the 12th fret or so - your string is cut down to half its 'open' length and less, so it's just going to behave differently. Your guitar also has to compensate for the slightly elliptic vibration of the string - this is one of the reasons why necks are bowed and not completely straight - by leaving the string with a little more room to 'play' around there - but in all fairness it may be set up wrong, so check out projectguitar.com to see how to set up a guitar well. Any way you cut it, though, different parts of the neck will play differently, and while you can set it up in ways you like to an extent you're never going to get identical everything all up and down the neck.

As far as playing with fluidity, if your guitar is not falling apart you have no excuse for blaming your equipment - I willingly set my action high and use thick strings for the sound alone, and I still have enough fluidity to play just about anything I need. It comes down to practice - you could stick a pair of dimes under my Dean's high E at the 24th fret and not budge the string, if even touch it, and I learned the solo to Under A Glass Moon on that same axe. If you were playing a Wal-Mart guitar with frets popping out and the neck turning into a rollercoaster track, you might earn some sympathy, but fluidity does not need come from low action any more than pick attack should come from having a gold-plated bridge - it's how you play. Get lessons and learn to use a metronome, and you'll build up speed on any guitar - get a guitar with a really low action and a flat fretboard and you'll be able to play differently on that guitar, but the minute you touch another axe you've lost it. Hell, if you get shredding on a guitar that doesn't play well, you won't get any worse on an expensive guitar that's tricked out to fuck and back - but it's just as easy to play horribly on a custom-shop Jackson as it is to play horribly on a Squier Bullet.

Jeff

Very well said, Jeff.Although the setup factor on a guitar does come into play a little on the guitar. And with the quote I'm borrowing comes a SHAMELESS plug to follow.....
"Get lessons and learn to use a metronome, and you'll build up speed on any guitar - get a guitar with a really low action and a flat fretboard and you'll be able to play differently on that guitar, but the minute you touch another axe you've lost it. Hell, if you get shredding on a guitar that doesn't play well, you won't get any worse on an expensive guitar that's tricked out to fuck and back - but it's just as easy to play horribly on a custom-shop Jackson as it is to play horribly on a Squier Bullet."

I am now accepting students for guitar lessons via the internet. Here's the URL, lad, if you might be interested! www.stevesmyth.com/i-lessons.htm
And happy hunting! My suggestion: check out what BC Rich is doing lately, you'll be very happily suprised!

 

[lad]

Thanks a lot chaps. Appreciated.

No Ibanez seven. Not happy.

A problem with Ibanez is that they use cheap woods and are usually very slimmed down - a bigger guitar, like one of the ESP/LTD Les Paul-style guitars or a Schecter, preferably made of mahogany, will sound thicker and respond better in just about any situation. Ibanez guitars are also very overpriced, and very few come with pickups that are made well. Schecters come with EMGs or Seymour Duncans, ESPs come with EMGs... hell, the stock pickups in the Deans and a new BC Rich I've played slay a good number of the aftermarket pickups out there, so you're just going to get those guitars sounding better.

That aside, guitars are going to feel different around the 12th fret or so - your string is cut down to half its 'open' length and less, so it's just going to behave differently. Your guitar also has to compensate for the slightly elliptic vibration of the string - this is one of the reasons why necks are bowed and not completely straight - by leaving the string with a little more room to 'play' around there - but in all fairness it may be set up wrong, so check out projectguitar.com to see how to set up a guitar well. Any way you cut it, though, different parts of the neck will play differently, and while you can set it up in ways you like to an extent you're never going to get identical everything all up and down the neck.

As far as playing with fluidity, if your guitar is not falling apart you have no excuse for blaming your equipment - I willingly set my action high and use thick strings for the sound alone, and I still have enough fluidity to play just about anything I need. It comes down to practice - you could stick a pair of dimes under my Dean's high E at the 24th fret and not budge the string, if even touch it, and I learned the solo to Under A Glass Moon on that same axe. If you were playing a Wal-Mart guitar with frets popping out and the neck turning into a rollercoaster track, you might earn some sympathy, but fluidity does not need come from low action any more than pick attack should come from having a gold-plated bridge - it's how you play. Get lessons and learn to use a metronome, and you'll build up speed on any guitar - get a guitar with a really low action and a flat fretboard and you'll be able to play differently on that guitar, but the minute you touch another axe you've lost it. Hell, if you get shredding on a guitar that doesn't play well, you won't get any worse on an expensive guitar that's tricked out to fuck and back - but it's just as easy to play horribly on a custom-shop Jackson as it is to play horribly on a Squier Bullet.

Jeff

I'll humour you (and be honest), I've been mostly using a Yamaha Pacifica someone left here for some time - purely for tuning purposes and slide lessons - and the string action is pretty even throughout. That might explain (partly) why I'm a sloppier lead player on the Jackson, since I do use a metronome for about half an hour, most days. Still, your "practise" statement I cannot argue with.

Also, <3 EMGs and Seymour Duncans (which I'm using just now), so thanks for the heads up on that.

Steve, thanks for the offer, but financial and academic obligations will most likely get in the way of that...for now. It's a serious consideration, nonetheless.

Haggis ftw.

Cheers

 

[Jeebo]

I agree with Broll, you shouldn't have to have one certain setup to stick too; be able to adapt to action, string gauge, neck thickness etc. Just because Ibbys don't feel "right" in my hands doesn't mean I can't play them. Just because the stock action on my c-7 hellraiser is relatively high doesn't mean that I can't play certain passages on it. All that really matters is your technique, and if it's good enough, you should be able to play on anything. With that said, I prefer the Schecter 7 strings, they feel great, sound great, and are well made for the price. I feel that Ibbys are overpriced and feel cheaper than schecters.

 

[JBroll]

"Hey, I know the big sounds on records come from fat chunks of mahogany that have been cut right and proven to sound thick and meaty, but... what if, say, and I know it's a big if, but what if we were to replace all of that with a glued-together steno pad, make pickups out of paper clips and spittle, and - get this - make it look just like a Strat, but pointier?"

"It'll never work! People won't just blindly buy the guitars they see their idols playing because they think it'll improve their technique, or make them sound better, or that endorsements necessarily imply quality - much less quality along the whole range, not just the thousands we'll be spending on the big names! Guitarists can't possibly be that stupid!"

Oh well... don't you guys ever miss the days when being cynical actually took work? Sarcasm and irritation at the world around you are just handed out on a silver platter, it takes all of the fun out of it.

Jeff

 

[guitarguru777]

If i may chime in .....

Being a former Ibanez man myelf i say this.

If your going to go with an Ibanez 7 make it a model made between 90 and 94, these are the best 7's made by ibanez. If you are looking for something new ....

SCHECTER !!!

I can not stress how amazing their guitars are especially for the price.

If your going over the $1500 range, look into the USA BC's they are AMAZING instruments.

As for switching from 6 to 7, it took me about 3 months to adapt. Its really the picking hand that has to adapt more than the fretting hand.

 

[bibz]

The schecter guitars are very nice, and really good guitars! The fretwork on my hellraiser 7 however I found terrible. Granted theres no standard but jumbo frets were meant to be big right? I had to have the action a fair bit higher then I thought I should for a new guitar, but the tradeoff was mega rich tone. Nitpicking aside (pun intended) it still played fantastic when I got used to the extra string height, which was alot easier then adjusting to it being my first 7!

Of course playing everything from the 40's to the naughties has helped me...dads guitar collecting helps bigtime

 

[lad]

"Hey, I know the big sounds on records come from fat chunks of mahogany that have been cut right and proven to sound thick and meaty, but... what if, say, and I know it's a big if, but what if we were to replace all of that with a glued-together steno pad, make pickups out of paper clips and spittle, and - get this - make it look just like a Strat, but pointier?"

"It'll never work! People won't just blindly buy the guitars they see their idols playing because they think it'll improve their technique, or make them sound better, or that endorsements necessarily imply quality - much less quality along the whole range, not just the thousands we'll be spending on the big names! Guitarists can't possibly be that stupid!"

Oh well... don't you guys ever miss the days when being cynical actually took work? Sarcasm and irritation at the world around you are just handed out on a silver platter, it takes all of the fun out of it.

Jeff

This post was patronising and worthless. That said, I did laugh. And I'm blazing.

 

[Noumenon]

I've never been as happy as when I got my RG7620. Plays perfectly, although the knife's edge is a bit worn. It's got it all, the look & the feel. oh, and the EMGs

 

[Liverslapper]

meh i have an ibanez 270DX, i have enough problems with it as it is, but my C-7 hellraiser is soo. damn....sexy!

 

[JBroll]

Finished my solo for contest 4 a couple of hours back... every time I pick up my Schecter I'm amazed by it. I've never played an Ibanez that I'd pay half the asking price for (and I know some people who were pretty desperate to sell off Ibanez RGs... can you say $300 for a 7-string?) but when I think about how I got that Blackjack 7 for $500 (and that it included SD pickups, is thick enough to sound like beef through a Marshall Micro Stack with a dying battery, and that a nonexistent scratch make it qualify for S&D discount from Musician's Friend, and that it can take almost thirty pounds of pressure per string with no more than a slight intonation adjustment...) I just wish women worked the same way.

Jeff