Question regarding DI tracks and Reamping

[Paul Canzoneri]

Hello Everyone!

I recently tracked some DI guitar tracks using A Musicman Majesty into a Radial J48. I went straight into my Antelope Orion synergy core for the DI and then recorded my Mark V to get a live sound for the recording. The tracks came out really clean but now that I’m trying to reamp the DI tracks after editing I’m having trouble getting the tracks to drive the amp without bumping the faders on the track almost all the way up. I can get the amp to sound like the guitar going directly in but only by pushing the volume on the track hard and it’s showing it’s clipping the output of the Orion (obviously) and of course it’s adding a bunch of hiss on the backend. So a couple questions here:

1. The majesty is a pretty hot guitar as far as pickups go. Using the J48 with no pad engaged I was recording -5 peak at the preamp on the interface without any extra gain. The tracks I recorded I used the -15 db pad and then boosted the preamp to hit around -15 peak in pro tools. What levels should I be recording at for DI tracks? The guys at radial told me that I could be peaking at -5 and that was totally ok. What is your guys experience? Did I end up tracking the DI way too quiet?

2. When reamping whats your preferred signal chain? The Antelope Orion has built in reamp outputs but it seems like the output level is so quiet even with everything turned all the way up. I also tried using a line out with a radial reamp box but that wasn’t pushing the amp enough either.

The tracks seem to work fine with in box amp sims and I’ve recorded other instruments in this session at fairly uniform gain levels but it seems like nothing I’ve tried is cutting it when trying to get a strong sound without added hiss when reamping. Any ideas?

Thanks!

 

[Maxim Losch]

Hi Paul!

Re-amping is always connected with more noise in your signal chain than recording an amp live. The only thing you can do is try to avoid accumulating too much noise

The way you described it you pretty much summed up your issue already, I assume you've hit Pro Tools too quiet. While recording I'd generally suggest being between -18 and -12 dBFS, to leave you some headroom. Yet for re-amping purposes I'd suggest going in as hot as possible without clipping. I try getting my DI's peaks at around -5,-4 dBFS. So I have a bit of headroom in case the guitarist hits a bit harder in the breakdown
Like this, you don't have to push too much gain on your way out to the amplifier when re-amping.
I would always try to avoid using a pad with DI tracks. A pad means your signal is being pushed closer to your noise floor. When you bring that signal up after the pad by adding gain, you'll have more noise. Generally, not a big issue, but since you're amplifier all at the end will bring all that up, you should try to avoid that.

My preferred signal chain is a high-quality passive DI box, going into a mic in, then into my converters. Then out again through the converter and either through a re-amping box or a passive DI box into my amp.

I hope this helps!

All the best,
Maxim

 

[The_SoundGuy]

Looks like you need an actual Re-amp box, the re amp box will convert the impedance of your output so the signal hits the amp in a proper way. If you're sending just your line out to the amp, its sending a low impedance signal to the amp.

here's a great explanation I've read on the subject (not my words, copy pasting it)

The level of the signal is not important. The source impedance is. When the source impedance is the same as the input impedance of the device connecting to it power transmission is optimum in term of efficiency.

Low impedancesource feeding high impedance device is viable, but there may not be enough drive voltage. High impedance feeding a low impedance device is fraught with problems, possible overload, and frequency response for starters. Not a good idea.

Amplification is not about voltage, though the voltage aspects may be important. Amplification is about gain… power, voltage X curent… watts. The amount needed is under the control of the designer. Pre-amplifiers are often used to raise levels that are too low produce the maximum of the ‘power’ amplifier’s capabilities.

Tube circuits operate with high input impedances. Most transistor circuits operate with low or medium input impedances. (There are, of course, special devices and configurations for unusual applications. I use grounded base microphone amplifiers in my ham station, it avoids using transformers with very low impedance magnetic microhone capsules.)

 

[dropper]

Reamping is more difficult than using an audio interface. I prefer interfaces

 

[stephanadams]

Hello Everyone!

I recently tracked some DI guitar tracks using A Musicman Majesty into a Radial J48. I went straight into my Antelope Orion synergy core for the DI and then recorded my Mark V to get a live sound for the recording. The tracks came out really clean but now that I’m trying to reamp the DI tracks after editing I’m having trouble getting the tracks to drive the amp without bumping the faders on the track almost all the way up. I can get the amp to sound like the guitar going directly in but only by pushing the volume on the track hard and it’s showing it’s clipping the output of the Orion (obviously) and of course it’s adding a bunch of hiss on the backend. So a couple questions here:
Speed Test
1. The majesty is a pretty hot guitar as far as pickups go. Using the J48 with no pad engaged I was recording -5 peak at the preamp on the interface without any extra gain. The tracks I recorded I used the -15 db pad and then boosted the preamp to hit around -15 peak in pro tools. What levels should I be recording at for DI tracks? The guys at radial told me that I could be peaking at -5 and that was totally ok. What is your guys experience? Did I end up tracking the DI way too quiet?

2. When reamping whats your preferred signal chain? The Antelope Orion has built in reamp outputs but it seems like the output level is so quiet even with everything turned all the way up. I also tried using a line out with a radial reamp box but that wasn’t pushing the amp enough either.

The tracks seem to work fine with in box amp sims and I’ve recorded other instruments in this session at fairly uniform gain levels but it seems like nothing I’ve tried is cutting it when trying to get a strong sound without added hiss when reamping. Any ideas?

Thanks!

The way you described it you pretty much summed up your issue already, I assume you've hit Pro Tools too quiet. While recording I'd generally suggest being between -18 and -12 dBFS, to leave you some headroom. Yet for re-amping purposes I'd suggest going in as hot as possible without clipping. I try getting my DI's peaks at around -5,-4 dBFS. So I have a bit of headroom in case the guitarist hits a bit harder in the breakdown

 

[felipousismix]

Hi: get a Reamp box, like this one, https://www.diyrecordingequipment.com/products/l2a and this will match the impedance from your interface into the gtr amp, and then you will ne ready to go.