Recording drums directly to stereo, or alternatives?

[DanLights]

Has anybody ever had to record drums on an interface with only two outputs? If so, how have you done it or what solutions have you found to work better?

To be more clear, all I have for recording drums is an analog mixer with enough inputs/preamps to mic the whole kit, but the infterface only sends the stereo output of the mixer to the pc, so I can't record everything separate.

I'm thinking for example I could use a 4 mic method, two overheads, kick and snare, take great care in the mic'ing process to make sure it's workable enough and has no phase issues or volume imbalances with the sources and then just record that as a stereo .wav and work the mix with that. The genre is stoner metal, very "Raw" and real so it's not like sample replacement would be needed, plus fortunately it's a good drummer who hits like a man and a good drumkit/cymbals.

Another option I'm thinking of is simply recording overheads and then programming the drum parts in, following exactly what the drummer recorded (from the drum bleeds into the overheads), after previously taking samples of his kit.

Option #3, making him record once, mic'ing just overheads and then record again mic'ing kick and snare and triggering from there (instead of recording stereo, I could just pan each separately and record both to separate tracks), but I fear the overheads being in a different performance from the shells could cause some weird issues with overhead bleed from the drums, so I'm not too sure about this one.

Option #3.1 Same as 3 but on the second go recording all shells together including toms, so I can have more toms instead of just overhead bleed of them.

Programming drums entirely is a bit out of the question, cause it wouldn't fit the style, plus the drummer is good and it would suck to leave his performance out of the equation.

The good thing is the guys in the band are very open to my ideas and haven't been resilient about anything so far, I even suggested recording electronic drums with real cymbals, but the guy from whom I could've borrowed the e-drums recently sold them so that's out of my reach as well.

P.S. I can't buy any extra stuff right now, so as much as I appreciate any advice, telling me to buy an 8 input interface doesn't really help in this case, I know I have to, but I can't do so yet.

anyways, please share your thoughts and experiences on the subject, and thanks in advance!

 

[Lon]

get a good sound out of everything, mix it to stereo, then smash the shit out of it with a parallelcomp, if you have to replace you'd have to do it manually but if the drummer is good and the equipment is sound, you can get a nice drumsound out of it (for anything not-metal).

I would not count on the drummer to be able to give a honest performance when the kit is split-up, even if hes really good, its not enough to do this kinda thing.

 

[MindMunch]

 

[bryan_kilco]

That one mic is moving ALLLLL the fuck over the place. Kinda defeats the purpose of so carefully measuring the distance....

 

[Trevoire520]

I's say your best bet for this is to use the 2 tracks for overheads and get some triggers and a drum module to send out midi for the shells,

 

[MindMunch]

That one mic is moving ALLLLL the fuck over the place. Kinda defeats the purpose of so carefully measuring the distance....

They screwed on the video, but the technique is good. Heard some great tones recorded like that and I can´t think of any better way using only 2 mics. If there was at least 4 inputs the Glyn Johns method could be a better alternative.

 

[greyskull]

On this video it sounds gash.
But to be fair I think that's the drummer/Cymbals.

 

[szymon]

Id go for sampling the drums and recording overheads (do you have triggers?). If its metal stuff, that is the best solution imo.
BUT, if you have some gear, you may try to do a stereo mix of drums using outboard compressors, reverb etc., and then try to fit everything else to match the drums. A bit of a challenge

 

[Strachan of D]

i would take samples of your snare, toms and just record the overheads

place the samples on new tracks

 

[Skinny Viking]

get a good sound out of everything, mix it to stereo, then smash the shit out of it with a parallelcomp, if you have to replace you'd have to do it manually but if the drummer is good and the equipment is sound, you can get a nice drumsound out of it (for anything not-metal).

This but I would also program in everything else then blend the 2

or rent (have them rent) a bigger mixer so you can at least get more mic channels

either way, you're boned as far as being able to edit much later so do all the parts to each song in sections to make sure they're as tight as possible to the click

 

[Kohugaly]

I suggest similar approach as Trevoire520 suggested. use the two inputs as overhead mics and record the rest of the kit thrugh basic inputs on the PC ... if their quality would be very bad it's at least possible to use them as triggers for sample replacement...I think it would be better solution then to simply program the shells....

 

[Shinozoku]

I'd try the Glynn Johns method (similar to Recorderman), and sample any drums that don't get picked up well or that you have no inputs for, and blend them in.

If you can rent an 8 input mixer, more power to you. Then just use the mixer's EQ to help everything sit in the mix and take it to your computer through the stereo out.

 

[Skinny Viking]

I'd try the Glynn Johns method (similar to Recorderman), and sample any drums that don't get picked up well or that you have no inputs for, and blend them in.

If you can rent an 8 input mixer, more power to you. Then just use the mixer's EQ to help everything sit in the mix and take it to your computer through the stereo out.

or basically everything I just said

 

[rob w]

I've done this quite a lot, the advice I would give you is - try to get the bass drum louder than you think you'll need it as it can be tamed, if it doesn't go in loud enough you'll struggle to raise it through the mix. I would also try to keep the cymbals faint as they also can be raised from the dead with a bit of specific parametric eq. Old school recording rocks!

 

[Shinozoku]

or basically everything I just said

Precisely

 

[DanLights]

Thanks for all the ideas guys, I´m looking into all the options, for now the recorderman method seems like a good alternative, but I´m still reading around and deciding. Since it seems it wasn´t clear, I do have enough preamps to mic the whole drumkit, but I can only record a stereo file (or two mono files), not separate tracks.

Anyways, If anyone has any more ideas or opinions please do share!

 

[ahjteam]

Thanks for all the ideas guys, I´m looking into all the options, for now the recorderman method seems like a good alternative, but I´m still reading around and deciding. Since it seems it wasn´t clear, I do have enough preamps to mic the whole drumkit, but I can only record a stereo file (or two mono files), not separate tracks.

Anyways, If anyone has any more ideas or opinions please do share!

I'm on the same boat as the rest of the guys... Use a mixer and this way you'll also learn to mix live drums the "old school way".

If you also have some dynamic processing, all the better (especially noise gates, and maybe compressor for kick and snare). If you don't have noise gates, you might want to consider NOT micing the toms, as the tom mics usually bring a lot of unwanted bleed compared to the usable amount of signal signal, because they are usually not played in 95% time of the song. You can usually still hear the toms in the overheads.

In general, start with EQ flat and try to get the sound as good at the source as possible. But beware of the 300-700hz range. Mud, masking, shit and a big can of worms in general lives there. Boost them first like +12dB, sweep the frequency range and decide which of them sounds the most shit, then cut it out as much as possible until it sounds too hollow, then bring back about one third of the cut amount (so if you cut 9dB, bring back 3dB, if you cut 3dB, bring back 1dB etc).

If you don't have a mixer, just borrow or rent one for a day. Make sure that the mixer has at least high pass filter and 1-2 sweepable parametric mids, so no Behringer style "British EQ's" as one fixed mid pot is just a shitty idea in general.

 

[Shinozoku]

^This is what I'm about to do with a single output for my friend's band next time they record. It's a shitty Behringer mixer, but I can work with it. Their drums are always too low in the mix (a single 1/4" to USB output doesn't help) but they haven't really addressed EQ issues that I know of.

 

[The Dark Magician]

The few times I've been forced to record drums in stereo (or even with a single mic over top of the kit) I've managed convincing results using the filters in kt_drumtrigger to process only the low end frequencies (to sample replace the kick) and then another peaking filter somewhere in the midrange to replace the snare. After rendering the samples and aligning them to account for latency the results are fairly convincing. Slap a compressor on the Drum buss for some glue and plow onward.

The biggest problem I think you'll have is eliminating the inherent "boxiness" that comes from what essentially amounts to using only room mics. This can be EQed out and depending on your room it might not even be an issue.

 

[heshian46]

stereo mic the cymbals, program the rest.