Russell's Grit

[SquirrelOfSteel]

Hey, what's up?!

I'm starting to take vocal lessons. Russell Allen is one of my favorite singers ever. I tried to duplicate his style a lot but never really succeeded 100%.
I'm a big fan of his gritty style and would love to learn how to do that.

To all the singers out there, anybody know how Russell produces the grit.. like the one he uses on the first verse of "Inferno", "King Of Terrors", and especially during the chorus of "Seven"?

I would appreciate any help and tips.

Thanks alot! \m/

 

[BlackTron]

Never succeeded 100%? I don't think anybody will hold it against you.

We do expect you to sing 92% as good as Russell, however.

 

[SquirrelOfSteel]

LOL.
What I meant was I could manage to sing clean and with a slight grit, but I can never be able to reach a more powerful gritty voice like Russell does.

 

[Ultimate_Symphony]

Hey, what's up?!

I tried to duplicate his style a lot but never really succeeded 100%.
I'm a big fan of his gritty style and would love to learn how to do that.

To all the singers out there, anybody know how Russell produces the grit.. like the one he uses on the first verse of "Inferno", "King Of Terrors", and especially during the chorus of "Seven"?

First thing you're doing wrong is trying to duplicate him. It's nice that have influences and all, but never try to duplicate someone at the get go, that's the first thing you'll learn from a vocal coach.

Russell never really goes down low (technique which comes from the gut), the rasp is just throat work. When you try to hit higher notes and you want to add some rasp to it, just let the air work with your throat a little bit and that way you'll add the harshness that you want. I'd suggest you to be careful with this because inexperienced singers can easily fuck their throats up by trying way too hard without practicing first.

 

[SquirrelOfSteel]

Hey, thanks for the tip.

But are you really saying that Russell doesn't sing from the gut? He doesn't add any downwards support??

 

[Ultimate_Symphony]

Hey, thanks for the tip.

But are you really saying that Russell doesn't sing from the gut? He doesn't add any downwards support??

Yes, you should add downwards support to project your voice better.

 

[SquirrelOfSteel]

It seems as though the vocal fry is the safest method for producing grit.
So, using the throat while maintaining downwards support is good and won't screw your throat up??

 

[razoredge]

Russells voice is also part of who he is, his physical construction. I dont suspect there are many who could sound just like him and anybody that comes close and is well disiplined for being in a band could have a career with the proper collective chemistry of people. Which is also a hard thing to come by. Great voices are far and few between, best of luck in your pursuit.

 

[Postulate]

You want a real challenge, try to copy Andi Deris' voice. Oy ve...

 

[Lucius Octavion]

Russells voice is also part of who he is, his physical construction. I dont suspect there are many who could sound just like him and anybody that comes close and is well disiplined for being in a band could have a career with the proper collective chemistry of people. Which is also a hard thing to come by. Great voices are far and few between, best of luck in your pursuit.

Another reason why most gutteral, really low, death metal vocals are done by generally "bigger" people with more cavernous projection and lung capacity (eg: George Corpsegrinder Fisher of Cannibal Corpse (who is a mutant giant and has a huge neck that just morphs into his head), and Dallas Toller Wade / Karl Sanders of Nile. And of course Russel Allen with his wide capabilities also happens to be a very huge person.

I've also noticed that in general, many of my friends who are big have a much more natural ability to do this sort of things more so than most people.

 

[CantoX]

 

[Eternal Dragon]

If you try to copy him it'll always just sound like a shit imitation. Find your own voice .

 

[razoredge]

Another reason why most gutteral, really low, death metal vocals are done by generally "bigger" people with more cavernous projection and lung capacity (eg: George Corpsegrinder Fisher of Cannibal Corpse (who is a mutant giant and has a huge neck that just morphs into his head), and Dallas Toller Wade / Karl Sanders of Nile. And of course Russel Allen with his wide capabilities also happens to be a very huge person.

I've also noticed that in general, many of my friends who are big have a much more natural ability to do this sort of things more so than most people.

I was thinking this too, but then I thought about Dio. Who Russell can sound very similar too especially in his early days. None the less like Eternal said, everyone must find their own voice. No doubt in my mind however that an aspiring vocalist would do well to study the expression and voicings of Allen and Tate, others as well of course but nothing bad can come from studying the best.

If one wants to blow their vocal chords out they could practice a bunch of 80's John Oliva or 69-71 Robert Plant... lol

 

[HackerX]

I'd suggest you to be careful with this because inexperienced singers can easily fuck their throats up by trying way too hard without practicing first.

^ This.

Honestly, if you try and force this you'll fuck your vocal chords. It's something you need to be able to achieve "with ease". I'd work on just being a better singer, get your vocals down pat then you'll find this comes much easier. That goes for any death metal singer too, learning basic (non death metal) singing techniques has a huge effect.

 

[Lucius Octavion]

LOOOOOL I love your signature

 

[EyeballKid]

If you try to imitate the harsh style, you could definitely screw your voice up.

It took me five years of trying to sing metal to realize that sometimes you just aren't physically built to sing metal. Make sure to find your own voice before you try to copy specific styles by established singers. Learning their techniques is fine, but searching for a specific sound is not the way to go.

 

[Ultimate_Symphony]

So, using the throat while maintaining downwards support is good and won't screw your throat up??

No, that is still no guarantee. Downwards support just gives you more clarity to your voice and power. If you go break all hell loose so to speak, without knowing your limits first, you could easily fuck it up. Like someone else said, first you should know what type of singer are you, not everyone is capable of adding that rasp to their voice. Like I told you before, you should first start slow with the rasp and then go up and up, see where it takes you. Get to know where your limits lie, that's it if you don't want to get a vocal coach.

 

[SquirrelOfSteel]

Thanks for all the tips, guys.

I have one more question, though.

Each time I practice with my band, I always get a headache from singing. When I hit a note, it's as if I am pushing the headache away, when I stop singing, the headache comes crashing down and it hurts so much that I don't want to sing anymore. Could this be because I was pushing too hard for more volume and/or other reasons?

Thanks for the help.

 

[razoredge]

sounds medical to me. I mean stress, noise and excess can cause a headache but you shouldnt have one every time you sing.

 

[Ultimate_Symphony]

Thanks for all the tips, guys.

I have one more question, though.

Each time I practice with my band, I always get a headache from singing. When I hit a note, it's as if I am pushing the headache away, when I stop singing, the headache comes crashing down and it hurts so much that I don't want to sing anymore. Could this be because I was pushing too hard for more volume and/or other reasons?

Thanks for the help.

Don't worry about the volume thing, it's not that.

You're probably using head voice (type of voice that's on the upper registers). One of the side effects of using head voice is headaches and tension (that's why we call it head voice), though i've never experienced it to be so much that it's unbearable.