?'s for Jim

[Deviation]

I'm a bit new to scene compared to many. I'm 33yo and grew up on the radio hard rock of my times. My favorite song in elemetary school was Kansas Carry on Wayward Son (when it was released!) so that was probably a good sign of my future. )

I gave up on radio and buying CDs in the early 90's as Hurl Spam, et al. took over and Z Rock atrophied into nothing. So I have a ton of ignorance about death/black metal and most of the European stuff. Bear with me as I rediscovered things upon getting a cable modem and finding HardRadio.com in '98 which has resurrected my faith. I stopped buying CDs around '93 but have bought over 100 since getting the broadband access to hear what I'd been missing.

I'm not a death fan. I have two Opeth albums and In Flames Clayman. That is as goofy as I get on the vocals. There's just only so much I can handle. BUT, what in the hell is the difference between death and black metal? And what the hell is the Goteburg (sp?) sound? And how can you tell the bands apart? I'm not being cynical or insulting, I simply need some training of my ears and education. Thanks.

 

[Jim LotFP]

Originally posted by Deviation
BUT, what in the hell is the difference between death and black metal?

Definitions have gotten confused (and thank goodness as those who followed the definitions religiously are just boring!), but... 'classic' definitions involve:

Death- Low growling vocals, downtuned and heavy sound, riffs riffs riffs.

Black- High screechy vocals, trebly sound, 'atmosphere.'

Originally posted by Deviation
And what the hell is the Goteburg (sp?) sound?

Ah, Gothenburg. That's easy. Not that it means the same thing now as it did then, but that's true of any genre, isn't it?

Death metal for the most part grew out of thrash which grew out of heavy metal with some punk stuff thrown in there. In the mid 80s to early 90s, it generally was not melodic and speed and brutality were the buzzwords.

Gothenburg generally melds the death metal ideas (growly vocals, speed, etc) and instead of brutality, looks back to early 80s heavy metal (Maiden being the prime target). Early In Flames, Dark Tranquillity, and At the Gates filled this in quite nicely, while Dissection (and those are usually thought of as the 'big four' of Gothenburg, although more were around at the start as well) had a more 'evil' slant from the start. After about 95 or so, they either broke up or started going in different directions at the same time the clones started coming out of the woodwork...

What I call the definitive Gothenburg albums (arguments will follow, I'm sure):
At the Gates- Slaughter of the Soul
Dark Tranquillity- Skydancer
Dissection- Storm of the Light's Bane
In Flames- The Jester Race

All four have been reissued in the last year or so with an EP or other bonus tracks attached.

Originally posted by Deviation
And how can you tell the bands apart?

Same way people in the 80s could tell Maiden and Queensryche apart in 1986, I guess. Listen and note what each band beats to friggin death.

 

[Nate The Great]

Deviation. Every single web board I go to has question like yours. So don't feel like you're ignorant or anything like that. I'm still trying to figure out how both Anathema and Warhorse can be called Doom. . .

 

[Deviation]

Thanks for the help guys. I understand that thoroughly immersing myself in it will yield the best enlightement but to be honest, I'm not a death fan. So I was hoping for a Death Metal For Dummies guide to help me out. Does Opeth fall into the Gothenburg realm or is their style too slow?

I also read that In Flames has gone through some morphing in their style. Since I only have Clayman as a reference, what is all the uproar about? I'm afraid that if I discuss In Flames with anyone, I'll come across like a post Black album Metallica fan with no memory of the past glory.

On the other hand, I can tell the difference between Tony MacAlpine, Joey Tafolla, Paul Gilbert, Vinnie Moore, etc. since I've listened to so much of their stuff over the past 15 years.

I listened to some of the Novembers Doom stuff also today. Haven't been turned on or off yet so I'll keep listening. MP3.com categorizes most tracks as doom/death. I assume the "death" is due to the growly vocals and the doom is the kinda ballad tempo?

 

[llorenth]

Originally posted by Deviation
So I was hoping for a Death Metal For Dummies guide to help me out. Does Opeth fall into the Gothenburg realm or is their style too slow?

Nope, Opeth doesn't fall into the Gothenburg style, although they are close. Opeth is just a good deal more in the progressive vein than the Gothenburg melodic death bands, even the adventurous Dark Tranquillity (who don't seem to be well liked around here, but I LOVE their music).

I also read that In Flames has gone through some morphing in their style. Since I only have Clayman as a reference, what is all the uproar about? I'm afraid that if I discuss In Flames with anyone, I'll come across like a post Black album Metallica fan with no memory of the past glory.

Unfortunately most of us remember when In Flames was a really really terrific band. The first two to three albums are quite magical (_Whoracle_ is where the magic starts to fade IMO).

I listened to some of the Novembers Doom stuff also today. Haven't been turned on or off yet so I'll keep listening. MP3.com categorizes most tracks as doom/death. I assume the "death" is due to the growly vocals and the doom is the kinda ballad tempo?

Death is for growled vocals and heavy guitar riffs. Doom is a style of music that started all the way back with Black Sabbath's S/T debut, actually. That feeling of gloom and doom you get from a song like "Black Sabbath" should give you a good idea of what doom sounds like. A few major doom bands since then include Candlemass, Trouble, and Solitude Aeturnus. In the early 90s, three bands came out of England that merged doom metal with death metal to create doom/death. Their style would have a large impact on the scene. The three bands were Anathema, My Dying Bride, and Paradise Lost. The only one who still makes doom/death is MDB, as the others have changed styles considerably. So when you read about November's Doom and they get compared to the above bands or called doom/death, it's because of the trio of bands that founded the micro-style .
Now and Forever,
lmjh