sonata arctica forum

[Reno]

Originally posted by dreamwatch
I don't see that as unprincipled at all.

You misread me

I wasn't saying wheather I believed that UM's decision to charge bands was or was not unprincipled. What any site besides my own decides to do is their affair and I am neither for nor against it unless it affects me personally. How I meant it, was me, myself and I am too principled to start charging anyone unvoluntarily once I stated I wouldn't. I'm probably principled to the point of foolheartyness if I would close my site down before I start charging people, but then again, I am stubborn in my convictions

Sorry for any confusion.

 

[Reno]

By the way, it's been a few days and nothing from Wellu (neither a PM or E-Mail) concerning the forum. How would you guys suggest I/we proceed with this?

I don't want to step on any toes (read the band's), but I also want to give you guys a place to discuss SA as well.

 

[MadeInNewJersey]

Not being a master of decorum, I say fuck 'em, keep the forum going, I *like* it.

 

[Jax]

The worst they can do when and if they do bother to respond is ask you to take the logos (as copyrighted material) off the forum, Reno..they can't make us stop gathering there to converse..so keep it going.

 

[Mark]

Originally posted by Reno
I wasn't saying wheather I believed that UM's decision to charge bands was or was not unprincipled. What any site besides my own decides to do is their affair and I am neither for nor against it unless it affects me personally. How I meant it, was me, myself and I am too principled to start charging anyone unvoluntarily once I stated I wouldn't. I'm probably principled to the point of foolheartyness if I would close my site down before I start charging people, but then again, I am stubborn in my convictions

So instead of saying, "Sorry, we now need to implement a small charge so we can keep everything running, and your community open" you'd say "woops, too expensive! the forum's closing. sorry!"?

Nice one!

 

[Mark]

Originally posted by Heidi
Yeah but you wouldn't have this much people visiting here without the bands, big bands. That's why you asked them to move here and promised it's for free, you don't have to pay for it and then, when the bands have brought people here, you noticed "oh my god, we need more space" and because you need more money for that, you had to ask the money from the bands.

So you should be greatful to those bands who moved here because without them you wouldn't have this much people hanging around.

That's why you shouldn't have asked money from the bands like Sonata.

You're completely misinformed.

The forum service was free when Sonata came on board, because we were able to offer it as much and provide a solid alternative to banner-ridden services like EzBoard. We never stated it would be free forever, to SA or anyone.

Of course we asked bands to join our community because we wanted to make it grow - but the fact is, we were taking payments from the users a full YEAR before we instigated the charge for all forums, and payments from new forums for 4 months before the 'older' boards were asked to contribute as well.

The fact is, the idea of charging for the forums was not mine, but one from a major band who already had their forum here (and which I wringed my hands over for 6 months considering whether it was fair). At the end of the day, I had the option of either charging or knowing the forum would have to close by January 2003. I made my decision, which 95% of forum owners agreed with, and whole-heartedly supported (and which is bringing in new forum enquiries every week) and ensured the survival of this unique community. And other people and webmasters can make all the cloaked digs at UM as they want, all I care about is maintaining a community for metal fans to discuss the music they love, and for bands to have a solid community tool with which to reach their fans and allow them to gain exposure that UM can provide. And I don't think that's wrong or unprofessional at all, which is more than I can say for some.

And that's all I have to say.

 

[spiney]

Reno,

you are a complete cockhead. First of all, Mark has to charge bands else as he has said this site would no longer be here if he didn't. And plus whats the big deal? He never promised that they would be free forever and anyway what is $5 a month to a band or anyone?

What would you guys rather browse, a crappy ezboard or UM? Im sure as hell know what id rather be looking at.

And reno, your website is a joke. It is nothing but a poor rip-off of UltimateMetal.com

If you want to be successful at something how about using your OWN imagination and make something original.

 

[Heidi]

Originally posted by Mark
And that's all I have to say.

But did you say "This might get paid." ? Did you? I mean if you didn't, you just said this is for free, it's like screwing up the bands. I mean, everyone thinks, hey, it's free, and they think it's free next year too. And the next and the next... You know what I mean? I can't express myself in english too well. That's what I think.

 

[MadeInNewJersey]

Originally posted by spiney
Reno,

you are a complete cockhead. First of all, Mark has to charge bands else as he has said this site would no longer be here if he didn't. And plus whats the big deal? He never promised that they would be free forever and anyway what is $5 a month to a band or anyone?

What would you guys rather browse, a crappy ezboard or UM? Im sure as hell know what id rather be looking at.

And reno, your website is a joke. It is nothing but a poor rip-off of UltimateMetal.com

If you want to be successful at something how about using your OWN imagination and make something original.

This is completely uncalled for. You clearly didn't take the time to read & understand everyone's posts here, and it's a shame you make yourself look this foolish in public, but I'm sure you're used to that by now.

As for Reno, he's exhibited nothing but class and decorum, and has even openly admitted to modelling HMAS after UM so it would be an easy transition and "familiar" to people. So lay off 'im.

 

[Reno]

Originally posted by spiney
Reno,

you are a complete cockhead. First of all, Mark has to charge bands else as he has said this site would no longer be here if he didn't. And plus whats the big deal? He never promised that they would be free forever and anyway what is $5 a month to a band or anyone?

What would you guys rather browse, a crappy ezboard or UM? Im sure as hell know what id rather be looking at.

And reno, your website is a joke. It is nothing but a poor rip-off of UltimateMetal.com

If you want to be successful at something how about using your OWN imagination and make something original.

First of all, I am unsure as to why I am even bringing vallidity to your comments by replying to you, but if I must, then I must.

First of all, if you would take the time to research the vBulletin software, instead of calling me a rip-off, you will notice any site that runs it is going to look similar. HMAS.org looks similar to UM.com. UM.com looks similar to vbulletin.com and so-forth. You could say any site that runs vBulletin is just a cheap "rip-off" of Infopop UBB. Personally, I consider it an honor to even have my site mentioned in the same breath as UM. Now if you're referring to the Zine section of my site, I don't see too many similarities. I mean you can only come up with so many ways to layout the "big 4" (Interviews, Reviews, Articles and News) that make up 99.999999% of all zines regardless of genre. If there's a similarity between mine and UM that you perceive, so be it. I have nothing to prove to you or anyone else.

 

[Reno]

Originally posted by Mark
So instead of saying, "Sorry, we now need to implement a small charge so we can keep everything running, and your community open" you'd say "woops, too expensive! the forum's closing. sorry!"?

Nice one!

Yes, I would pull the plug before I charge anyone. I also think that if things become dire straights for us, someone would step in and offer to help. Good samaritinship and all that jazz. I would also do volunary donations and such, plus some $$$ from advertising like we get now. I'm trying to take steps to ensure that'll never happen, such as hosting mostly small forums, declining any requests for new forums after we get so many etc. I'm not looking to be a huge community, more like a smaller "niche" type of deal, with a small, loyal following.

In any case, I don't see any problems that would end up in the shutting down of the forum for a long, long time. Even with our limited resources, we've only used about 10% of them so far and we can add double that for a couple more $$'s a month when the time comes.

 

[Reno]

Originally posted by Mark
And other people and webmasters can make all the cloaked digs at UM as they want

Mark, I hope that doesn't include me. If anything I have said sounded like I was slighting UM.com or I was taking thinly veiled shots at you or the site, I apologize for it. It was truly un-intentional.

If I had anything against UM, I wouldn't be here posting. I guess, a lot of my comments can be taken in different ways, and I apologize for that as well.

 

[Jax]

*reviving this thread because I like seeing you all here*

 

[mourningstar]

well done, jax. this thread had become a place for complainings.
[by the way, your little val's pic is in the pics thread, mommy ]

 

[Steve]

Originally posted by spiney
Reno,

you are a complete cockhead. First of all, Mark has to charge bands else as he has said this site would no longer be here if he didn't. And plus whats the big deal? He never promised that they would be free forever and anyway what is $5 a month to a band or anyone?

What would you guys rather browse, a crappy ezboard or UM? Im sure as hell know what id rather be looking at.

And reno, your website is a joke. It is nothing but a poor rip-off of UltimateMetal.com

If you want to be successful at something how about using your OWN imagination and make something original.

One: The forums look the same in general because Both UM and HMAS use VBuletin, which both of them pay for, so neither of them ripped each other off, they both pay the same people for their software. Reno is very original with a lot of his graphics, which he adds to the forums to make them look unique and much better.

Two: The HMAS Zine is a hell of a lot different than UM. It has the same core elements of any music site (reviews, interviews, News, commentary, etc.) but the layout is completely different. The graphics are also different.

Three: HMAS has many elements that make it unique from UM. Reno has various forums for different types of general discussion , Web Design and Graphics, Sports (5 different ones plus a main forum for general sports discussion), Video Games("Big 3" subforums plus main for all others), and various different music ones. UM has all of that discussion in one big "chat" forum. UM also has unique forums, like the introduction forum.

Four: UM and HMAS each have their ups and downs.
UM
Ups:
many different band forums
diversity in people
plenty of people
individually moderated forums

Downs:
sometimes too many people
more people means more jerks
sometimes confusing in such a big place
not much contact with administrator


HMA
Ups:
small community
many specific non-music forums
lesser known bands are prominent
some more popular bands
administrators are always around

Downs:
administrators are always around
not many people
fewer bands
stricter moderation/easier to be banned


Five: Make your own website and know what you are talking about before you poorly criticize very good ones

Six: Reno's head resembles neither a penis or a chicken. He is not a cockhead.

Steve

 

[Jax]

Originally posted by mourningstar
well done, jax. this thread had become a place for complainings.

HEY!! NO MORE COMPLAINING, DAMMIT!!
Ya'll who wanna post on Reno's board, can post there..ya'll who don't can stay here, or head to whatever forum Wellu comes up with some day. Quit bitching at each other tho!!!

There..how's that, Val?

[by the way, your little val's pic is in the pics thread, mommy ]

ooooooo yay!!! *runs to go see*

 

[Steve]

Originally posted by Lady of the Oracle

Ya'll who wanna post on Reno's board, can post there..

Not quite...

 

[Jax]

Not even gonna ask.

 

[mourningstar]

a friend of mine will move to dublin, so the other day he invited me and three other friends of him (all into the music biz like him) out for dinner.
i start talking with this guy who was sitting next to me, and it takes me a few minutes to understand he's really smart (and when the discussion turns to philosophy and science i start to :hotjump: ).
after one hour or so, it turns out he's one of the two guitarists who founded lacuna coil!

i hope i can put my hands on his other band's album... gothic rock à la paradise lost and sisters of mercy

 

[Jax]

Wow, what a trip, Val!