Tips for working with a pro studio

[Uladyne]

Hai Guise!

So I've joined the band I went on tour with, and we're working on a new album. They want to go in a much more aggressive direction with the new record, so I'm all over it like a fly on shit! I'm actually contributing a lot of material so far, and handling the mix for the pre production. (Yikes!)

Anyway, the plan tentatively is to record the drums in a pro studio, record guitar/bass DI's and vocals on my rig, reamp the guitars somewhere (anyone here interested?) and send it off to be mixed by a professional.

I was wondering if there are any certain things I need to be aware of with this method that might not be obvious from the outset. Of course communication with the other engineers will be crucial once we determine who they will be, but I'd like to prepare as much as I can as early as I can. I want to try to save myself from any facepalms I might otherwise run into in the future.

-I use Sonar, and I'm pretty damn sure whoever else we'll be working with will be using something completely different. Will .wav files be sufficient as long as theyre well organized, descriptively labeled and all start from zero?

-Any advice on the best way to prepare a tempo map for the drum session? Should I bring a list of all the tempos and where tempo changes occur, like "150bpm at 0, 200bpm starting at measure 48 beat 2", etc? Would that be sufficient or would some sort of file be needed?

-We may have the drums edited at the same place they're recorded, but we will be sure to get all the raw tracks (ddrum trigger tracks along with the mic tracks) in case we or the mixing engineer need them for whatever reason. Sample replacement is planned.

-Assuming the drum studio provides us with edited .wav drum tracks at say, 24/44.1, everything should be fine for importing them into Sonar and recording all our DI tracks and vocals, right? Or am I missing something?

-I'll be sure to read the reamping thread "front to back" and pretty much make it my bible before even preparing for tracking the DI's.

-After recording all the other instruments and vocals, and recieving the reamped tracks, I'm assuming we could export all the .wavs for the new instruments and include them with the drum studio's original drum tracks to be sent to the mix engineer. Correct?

Thanks for the help guise!

 

[Lasse Lammert]

yeah, edit the tracks before you send them out to the guy mixing it.
consolidate all the files from the very beginning of the session, make sure to have all your markers etc set and then export a midi file.
that midi file will contain all the tempo and marker information, that way the mixing studio can just drop it into PT and will have the tempo and markers etc.
and also important: Contact me about reamping

EDIT: bringing a tempo map (or midi track) and a guide guitar track to the drum-studio is a good idea, that way you can just start recording and don't have to waste precious time preparing that stuff

 

[Uladyne]

Good tips! Thanks, Lasse!

Would the midi track need to contain any certain events? or just maybe some quarter notes for the click? I dont use markers often enough to really know how they work with midi.

 

[Lasse Lammert]

Good tips! Thanks, Lasse!

Would the midi track need to contain any certain events? or just maybe some quarter notes for the click? I dont use markers often enough to really know how they work with midi.

I don't know how that works in sonar, but in cubase (and PT) you just have to select the range you wanna bounce, then export midi and check the box "include markers" (or similar).
the midtrack doesn't really have to contain anything, an empty track is enough...
although...if you already know what kind of click your drummer prefers (like 1/8 notes rather than 1/4 or so) you could already put the click on there as well....you don't have to though

 

[Uladyne]

Ah, Sonar doesnt seem to allow the inclusion of markers on export. Geh.

 

[ahjteam]

If you want it to sound more agressive, focus on the vocal work

 

[Ermz]

Great tips from Lasse.

If Sonar doesn't export marker information, no biggie. Just write it all into a text document and get the session engineer to map it all out in ProTools for you. It takes a little time, but it's better than stabbing in the dark!

On the other hand you could always grab a cheap copy of PTLE and do all your markers and guide tracks with that. Makes everyone's life easier because you can pre-prepare all your tracks, groups and whatnot!

 

[Uladyne]

I seem to remember hearing of a free demo version of protools that was limited to like 8 tracks or something. This was some years ago, though. I'll have to look it up and see if that will work and if its even still around.

 

[AgeOfGeburah]

http://www.studiofredman.com/cubase.html

I think you can apply these steps in Sonar aswell.
This Is how i recomend people to do before they send me songs for mixing purposes.

 

[Jarkko Mattheiszen]

I seem to remember hearing of a free demo version of protools that was limited to like 8 tracks or something. This was some years ago, though. I'll have to look it up and see if that will work and if its even still around.

Yeah, but it only worked on OS9/Windows 98, and isn't available for download anymore :/

 

[DanLights]

how/where do you plan to do the vocals? or are there no vocals? as ahjteam says, you should focus on that too.

 

[Taurean]

Hai Guise!

So I've joined the band I went on tour with, and we're working on a new album. They want to go in a much more aggressive direction with the new record, so I'm all over it like a fly on shit! I'm actually contributing a lot of material so far, and handling the mix for the pre production. (Yikes!)

Anyway, the plan tentatively is to record the drums in a pro studio, record guitar/bass DI's and vocals on my rig, reamp the guitars somewhere (anyone here interested?) and send it off to be mixed by a professional.

I was wondering if there are any certain things I need to be aware of with this method that might not be obvious from the outset. Of course communication with the other engineers will be crucial once we determine who they will be, but I'd like to prepare as much as I can as early as I can. I want to try to save myself from any facepalms I might otherwise run into in the future.

-I use Sonar, and I'm pretty damn sure whoever else we'll be working with will be using something completely different. Will .wav files be sufficient as long as theyre well organized, descriptively labeled and all start from zero?

I myself use Sonar as well and if the mix engineer you will work with does by chance, you can use .CWB bundle files proprietary to Sonar. Works great, and gaurantees smooth integration. This especially useful when you have production settings or ideas that are absolutely a must, you can easily set it up in the session and leave it, and just let the engineer know. Otherwise, .wav is fine as well. You can export as broadcast wave files which also is nice for more compatible integration with other DAWs. Just make sure, as you said, everything is consolidated from "0", and clearly labeled.

-Any advice on the best way to prepare a tempo map for the drum session? Should I bring a list of all the tempos and where tempo changes occur, like "150bpm at 0, 200bpm starting at measure 48 beat 2", etc? Would that be sufficient or would some sort of file be needed?

If you can map it out in Sonar, you can also use MIDI to indicate clicks for the metronome, using whatever sound you want. Export as audio but also, as exprience dicatated to me, export as MIDI as well. It's good to have it as insurance. Write it all down as well as having it in the click track. It's a double insurance.

-We may have the drums edited at the same place they're recorded, but we will be sure to get all the raw tracks (ddrum trigger tracks along with the mic tracks) in case we or the mixing engineer need them for whatever reason. Sample replacement is planned.

Make single shot hits from your own kit as you have it set up there at the studio. Create maybe like 4 - 5 different velocities. Save those and tuck them away for mixing time. They can used as single shots or together made as a multivelocity file for use in various drum samplers. (Format dependent)

-Assuming the drum studio provides us with edited .wav drum tracks at say, 24/44.1, everything should be fine for importing them into Sonar and recording all our DI tracks and vocals, right? Or am I missing something?

Yup that should do it.

-I'll be sure to read the reamping thread "front to back" and pretty much make it my bible before even preparing for tracking the DI's.

-After recording all the other instruments and vocals, and recieving the reamped tracks, I'm assuming we could export all the .wavs for the new instruments and include them with the drum studio's original drum tracks to be sent to the mix engineer. Correct?

Absolutely, just again, create completely separate folders as to what's edited and what's raw and again label clearly.


Include either reference MP3's or the name of a CD or two of your favorite production/mix. And include a text file of certain things you may be looking for in the mix.

One final thing: unless you absolutely want an effect for production idea or creative idea that the band is set on having in a given song, don't process anything. Keep it all clean and raw and let the mix engineer handle that aspect.

 

[Taurean]

I seem to remember hearing of a free demo version of protools that was limited to like 8 tracks or something. This was some years ago, though. I'll have to look it up and see if that will work and if its even still around.

Technically, no, it is no longer available...

 

[Charlie E.]

Some great advice here. I'm doing the same exact thing for my bands next record so I will definitely keep an eye on this thread.
I don't mean to hijack this thread but I'd like people's opinions on this (yes it is related to this!)

I also have Sonar, but I also have Logic. I really really like Logic's comp function and I'm pretty sure that editing drums with it will make my life sooo much easier than the traditional manual cut/paste and cross fade, especially with the grouping function. However most studios only have pro tools and the studio that I want to record drums in doesn't even have pro tools 8 (they have 7.2) so I can't even take advantage of their new comp function.
Does anyone happen to know if I can just import wave files on top of each other in Logic to create comp edits? I seem to recall the comp function only being available after recording another take, not when moving files on top of each other.
I really hope it's possible because buying an m-box + production toolkit or pro tools m-powered (I have m-audio cards) would be a little pricey for just convenience sake but I'm not ruling it out. Especially since I want to focus on tracking while at the studio, not worrying about exporting/importing and editing.

Also, if I do go with this route, will the studio be able to open my pro tools 8 files? (they run 7.2)

EDIT: Ok I found the solution. For those who are somewhat new to Logic like me You can simply pack a take folder (select regions then Arrange menu Region > Folder > Pack Take Folder) This will allow you to make much faster edits since it should let you to use the comp function.

 

[GarethSE]

If you want it to sound more agressive, focus on the vocal work

If you want it to sound even MORE agressive, focus on EVERYONE's performances, not just the vocalist's.
Get everyone severely pissed off before they track or something.

 

[Uladyne]

how/where do you plan to do the vocals? or are there no vocals? as ahjteam says, you should focus on that too.

We aren't entirely sure where the vocals will be done, but more than likely it will be at however's house we determine to use as our "studio" for the project. We'll likely be constructing some sort of vocal "booth" to eliminate nasty reflections, but we dont have plans for anything too extravagant.

One final thing: unless you absolutely want an effect for production idea or creative idea that the band is set on having in a given song, don't process anything. Keep it all clean and raw and let the mix engineer handle that aspect.

Cool, Thanks for all the tips!

 

[Genius Gone Insane]

Uladyne, sounds like you're on top of things. If I were doing my own CD I would do it just like you are.

 

[Uladyne]

Right on! Thanks man!

 

[Pipsymbol]

regarding sonar...
- tempo map and markers do get saved +with MIDI if you use "save as MIDI Format 1". I had a case when i needed to export tempo and markers from my project and send it to professional studio using Nuendo and it worked flawlessly. you don't need to have any data written in, just tempo and markers.
- also there is an option of exporting files into OMF format which is readable by any DAW including ProTools. I had a chance of testing this on another computer using ProTools M-powered. OMF gives you some usable options.

with combination of those two things you can have an exact copy of your project just in any other DAW.

 

[smy1]

I would just map out the tempo changes to a click/beat and export it as a WAV file. Then record guide guitars to that and just bring the click and guide guitar WAVs for each song in a separate folder. That way you avoid all possible problems that may arise from DAW incompatibilities.

Something that may seem trivial but really helps an AWFUL lot: make a checklist of everything that needs to be done. This is most likely gonna be a few pages long and should include everything from "bring singer's favorite drink" to "buy new tom heads" to "copy all guide WAVs to USB stick" to a list of all things that you need to bring to the studio to a list of all things that need to be tracked (do this on a per song basis).

This way you can tick off every single thing and work down the list with ease without having to worry about forgetting something (and you'll still forget something! ).