To the 2 people who left towels on their seats most of the night ....

[TENTH DREAMER DECEIVER]

Assigned seating would solve the problem. Someone won't leave your seat, get security. Someone wants your seat tell them to go away.

I once had 2 young ladies try and shift me from seat at U2. Told them no as I'd flown in for the show. Also, the tickets were in the Red Zone or something (joined the FC for the pre-sale). Unimpressed, they said they did the same. They had a hard time reconciling that they were not going to get their way. Millennial entitlement I guess. Anyway, they just moved ahead the next few rows and sat in the first empty seats available. People can be shitty that way. Bought the cheap seats but sat in the expensive ones.

If I leave my seat at a GA show then it's my bad luck if someone else gets it.

 

[Mardoch]

So there's a problem with finding a new seat? The horror! There are no bad seats in Center Stage. If you have to leave yours you will not die and your experience will not be ruined. I flew solo for 4 of my years and, gasp, I had new seats every time I took a piss. My experience survived in tact somehow, though!

 

[March Hare]

So there's a problem with finding a new seat? The horror! There are no bad seats in Center Stage. If you have to leave yours you will not die and your experience will not be ruined. I flew solo for 4 of my years and, gasp, I had new seats every time I took a piss. My experience survived in tact somehow, though!

This. I have gone solo the last 3 years and I know that if I leave my seat to piss, get a drink, etc, etc my seat will probably still be open when I return. But if it isn't so be it. I have not had any issue finding another one.

 

[LunaTEKKE]

Personal opinion, somebody gets their ass thrown out for saving seats for 2 hours, fine. But if you take a seat which has been occupied all fucking day and only opened up for 5 minutes, and you are unreasonable to giving said seat up, theres going to be a throwdown.

Totally agree - I think there has to be *some* flexibility here. Say you are meeting 3 friends at PPUSA who you only get to see once a year. The four of you buy gold badges and line up extra early to get in the venue as soon as it opens, and take your seats. You leave to use the restroom, come back, and your seat is gone. Friend #1 leaves to buy a drink, comes back, and the seat is gone. Friend #2 leaves to buy a t-shirt from the merch table, comes back, and the seat is taken. Now the 4 of you are scattered all over the venue because you had the audacity to use the restroom, buy a drink, or purchase a t-shirt? I don’t think that’s right, especially for people who went to the trouble of arriving at the venue early vs. those who just show up in time for their favorite band.

 

[sccaldwell]

I don’t think that’s right, especially for people who went to the trouble of arriving at the venue early vs. those who just show up in time for their favorite band.

It is not a reserved seating event, therefore you do not have "a seat". It's also not right for you to prevent someone else from sitting just because you decided to go down on the floor for your favorite band. You have a choice at any moment….go down on the floor and potentially lose the seat you're in, or go down on the floor and be closer to the action. Pick ONE. For the record, I got their early every day, too.

It's also not right for other people to be wandering around the venue, missing the band they want to see because someone else is "saving" their seat for some INDETERMINABLE amount of time with merch bags, towels, etc. My back has been bothering me for a few days, so standing for the entire festival simply wasn't an option.

Why should I (and others) have to wander around looking for a seat that isn't "taken" just so that "your" seat will still be "saved" for you FOR THE ENTIRE DAY, even if your ass is only actually in it for 3 hours of that day?

And yes, I get the restroom break, etc arguments…but unless a friend of yours is there to answer the question, there's absolutely no way anyone can know how long you're going to be gone.

- Are you gone for a restroom break and will be back in 5 or less?
- Are you down on the floor for this entire band, so "your" seat could clearly be used for the rest of this set?
- Have you gone for dinner and plan to skip the next two bands, anyway, so the seat will be unoccupied for 4 hours?
- Have you passed out and won't be back at all?

THERE'S NO WAY WE CAN KNOW, and *that* is why the whole "saving seats with merch bags/towels" thing is pure bullshit. And the answer someone gave of "well, that's fine, but if the 'owner' of the seat comes back, you should give the seat up" is also bullshit. Seriously? Why can't YOU find a new seat instead? Same amount of effort involved for you to find a new seat vs me finding a new seat.

And there's the thing….it's simple narcissism and inability to see the other side of the coin. I think that most of the people saying "oh, saving seats with merch bags isn't that unreasonable" are the very people I'm bitching about….so OF COURSE you don't see it as a problem!! "Your" seats are being "saved" by your fucking merch bags and towels, so YOU'RE not having to wander around trying to figure out where the hell you can sit.

You just always go back to "your" saved seats, oblivious to how many people you've pissed off in the 5 minutes to 6 hours you haven't been there…..unless Chris, Su, me, or someone else has thrown your crap away. Then you feel all indignant that "how dare they move our stuff!! Those were *our* seats!!"

Fuck that.

So for future years, if someone comes back to "their" seat to find that it's occupied and your stuff is not in the seat, it might be me and no, I won't be moving.

 

[sccaldwell]

Now the 4 of you are scattered all over the venue because you had the audacity to use the restroom, buy a drink, or purchase a t-shirt? I don’t think that’s right, especially for people who went to the trouble of arriving at the venue early vs. those who just show up in time for their favorite band.

Thank you for proving my point. You only saw your side of it, not the other perspective.

I was there this weekend with my fiancee. We met two good friends of ours who, *exactly* as you said, we see exactly once a year at ProgPower (I used to work with one of them, before I moved to NC).

We all wanted to sit for most of the bands (except SW and PoS), but only were able to find four seats together for ***ONE*** band's set out of the whole festival. The rest of the time, there were *plenty* of sets of 4 seats together….with other people's merch bags and other shit in them. So, we wound up sitting separately in two sets of two seats for nearly every set just to avoid wasting time arguing with people about "oh, I think those seats are saved" bullshit, so we barely saw them all weekend. (And yes, this is true….I didn't make it up for the sake of argument).

News flash: YOUR friends (and time spent with them) are no important than mine.

Need to piss or get a beer? Totally reasonable. Just leave one person there to hold the seats. If your friends are back in 15 or less, it's all good. You can go piss when they're back.

That's what WE do at shows that don't have reserved seating.

 

[OrionSon]

Personally, I couldn't sit down after the third band had played on both Friday and Saturday. The only empty seats I saw were being saved for someone. I get the argument that we could always go find more seats, but why can't the seat savers just go find more seats themselves if it's that easy. Point is, it's general admission. The ticket says you don't get a special seat, no matter what the towel says.

As for the "but I went to the bathroom/get a drink" how am I supposed to know that? I'm not going to watch your seat for the rest of the day to judge how long you've been gone.

 

[sccaldwell]

I'm not saying to scan for seats and wait like an asshole to see if someone comes back. Go find another fucking seat and keep an eye on the seats you first looked at.

No. PPUSA is *not* a reserved seating event. Glenn's stated policy is "no saved seats." The argument is therefore over. I'll sit in any seat without someone in it and YOU can "go find another fucking seat" if it was your shit that was supposedly "saving" it.

There was NEVER a time during this weekend that all the seats were full and not available.

If you consider seats with merch bags, etc in them as "full", then you're absolutely wrong. Oh, there may have been single seats here and there, but certainly not 2 or more together (taking out the obstructed view seats). Take the merch bags away and consider those seats available, and you're absolutely right….PLENTY of places to sit.

I'd like to see someone try to move my shit or think about throwing it in the trash because I had to take a piss and my seat was open for a few mins.

And I'd like to see someone try to move ME because I'm "in their seat." I promise that a merch bag will be far easier to move.

We're all there to have a good time and enjoy the show. Take some chill pills with you next time. Medicine is now allowed in the venue.

Agree 100%. Be sure to bring yours, too.

 

[LunaTEKKE]

We all wanted to sit for most of the bands (except SW and PoS), but only were able to find four seats together for ***ONE*** band's set out of the whole festival.

Not sure when you arrived at the venue, but if you arrived Fri/Sat close to the time when doors opened, there were LOADS of spaces with four seats together.

Need to piss or get a beer? Totally reasonable. Just leave one person there to hold the seats. If your friends are back in 15 or less, it's all good. You can go piss when they're back.

That's what WE do at shows that don't have reserved seating.

We actually agree on this. What I *don't* agree with is those who believe that general admission means that the second you vacate your seat, you should lose it.

Edit: And if you are saving a seat for a friend taking a quick break, I also don't understand why it's better to leave that seat looking like it is totally empty, rather than throwing something on it to show it's taken. To me, leaving saved seats empty makes it harder, not easier, for someone to find a seat that is actually available.

 

[jem777az]

And I'd like to see someone try to move ME because I'm "in their seat." I promise that a merch bag will be far easier to move.

Let just agree to disagree and move on. I'm not here to continue with the pissing match. I hope you enjoyed the festival this year and your seating issues didn't lessen the experience for you. I'll be sure to bring a catheter next year so I don't have to get up and possibly lose my seat to you. Enjoy your day.

 

[Conscious Pilot]

And there's the thing….it's simple narcissism and inability to see the other side of the coin.

Ha, ha - & listen to you! What an ass...

 

[sccaldwell]

And if you are saving a seat for a friend taking a quick break, I also don't understand why it's better to leave that seat looking like it is totally empty, rather than throwing something on it to show it's taken. To me, leaving saved seats empty makes it harder, not easier, for someone to find a seat that is actually available.

Oh no, that's obviously better….my issue is when the ONLY thing "saving" a seat is someone's junk. If your entire group of 3 all left, you should IMO take your stuff with you, but if two of your group of 3 left, and one person is saving the seats, you're totally right…having a jacket, bag, or something in the seats makes it more clear that someone's coming right back. Unfortunately, with so many people simply leaving their junk in a seat for hours, it's impossible to tell the difference from a distance.

That's why I always ask the people around "saved" seats, "are friends of yours sitting here?" If the answer is "no," I move the stuff and sit down. If it's "yes," I look elsewhere.

 

[Mardoch]

Oh no, that's obviously better….my issue is when the ONLY thing "saving" a seat is someone's junk. If your entire group of 3 all left, you should IMO take your stuff with you, but if two of your group of 3 left, and one person is saving the seats, you're totally right…having a jacket, bag, or something in the seats makes it more clear that someone's coming right back. Unfortunately, with so many people simply leaving their junk in a seat for hours, it's impossible to tell the difference from a distance.

That's why I always ask the people around "saved" seats, "are friends of yours sitting here?" If the answer is "no," I move the stuff and sit down. If it's "yes," I look elsewhere.

This.

If there's no one next to your shit, the seat's open cause no one's answering the question "they coming back?". If I politely query "someone sitting there?" and the answer is "Yeah, they just went to the bathroom" my response is "Ok, thanks." If I ask your bag of crap that, no response means get bent and I'm having myself a sit, thank you very much.

I had this altercation with a girl the first year when Sabaton played. I moved her shit cause no one was there. She got catty. So...I ignored her for the entire set, which really seemed to bunch her panties. Good, because General Admission, asshole.

 

[sccaldwell]

Let just agree to disagree and move on. I'm not here to continue with the pissing match. I hope you enjoyed the festival this year and your seating issues didn't lessen the experience for you. I'll be sure to bring a catheter next year so I don't have to get up and possibly lose my seat to you. Enjoy your day.

Agreed. Festival was great, hope you enjoyed it, too. As I said, I have no issue with a friend saving your seat while you go piss (as long as it's not a 90-minute piss!!!), so a catheter is not needed. Having had one for a week in January, I don't recommend it, anyway.

Ha, ha - & listen to you! What an ass...

Your reply tells me that you don't know what narcissim means. I'm not the one expecting everyone else to bow down to my importance that I deserve a "reserved" seat and everyone else should respect that.

Trust me, I understand the *desire* to save a seat…I just also understand that it's unreasonable at an event where there isn't assigned seating.

Or, if you like, let's take it a step further. How about if next year, I show up first thing on Friday, and put my merch bag on the floor at center stage, just behind the VIP pit. Then, that's "my spot" for the rest of the festival and no one else can stand there because my merch bag is saving the spot for me. When I choose to come back after dinner, etc, "my spot" is waiting for me.

Sounds absurd? Of course it does, but it's only slightly more absurd than doing the exact same thing with a seat.

Simple solution: If everyone stopped trying to save seats, everyone would be able to find a seat, and there Simply. Wouldn't. Be. A. Problem. You need to go piss? No worries, because 20 other people also went to piss (or get a beer) within 3 minutes after you got up….so if "your" seat got taken by someone, you can easily claim one of "their" seats, and when they get back, they get "your" old seat, etc, etc….you just might be 10-20 feet away from where you were before, but with essentially the same view as before. Nearly all of the seats at Centre Stage have a good view…it's not like we're in a huge stadium where some seats will need binoculars just to identify what band is playing.

Between people going to autograph lines, getting a beer/food, taking a piss, or simply taking a break, PLUS the number of people who go onto the floor for their favorite bands' set, there would almost always be available seats. with no merch bags to be seen and everyone happy.

 

[broegaard]

I don't think that is enough seat for 100% of the attendees

 

[Mardoch]

I don't think that is enough seat for 100% of the attendees

Good news, there will never be 100% of people seated.

 

[broegaard]

I was alone so at 100% of the time I left to go to the bathroom I was on the "verge" of loosing the seat I was in. Tough luck for me. It is how things work ( And I am a gold badger). I don't think GB mean a guarantee seat. Next time you want a spot? Rent a wheelchair

 

[DADRocks]

This.

If there's no one next to your shit, the seat's open cause no one's answering the question "they coming back?". If I politely query "someone sitting there?" and the answer is "Yeah, they just went to the bathroom" my response is "Ok, thanks." If I ask your bag of crap that, no response means get bent and I'm having myself a sit, thank you very much.

I had this altercation with a girl the first year when Sabaton played. I moved her shit cause no one was there. She got catty. So...I ignored her for the entire set, which really seemed to bunch her panties. Good, because General Admission, asshole.

This to me explains it perfect. We've done this and will do it again. There are 3 of us that have been going, if all three of us decide to step away for a period of time, we take our shit with us. Not expecting a merch bag to reserve the seats. If we'll be back shortly, always one of us stays in the seats to "save" them.

 

[adaher]

My attitude has always been that if I leave my seat and I come back and its taken I find a new one. I've never seen so many saved seats that I can't get another one that's decent enough. Granted, if I want to sit close I need to get in early and keep my butt planted, which I did the year I had a gold badge.

 

[Charles Muller]

I don't understand what we don't get here. This is as simple as it gets. Until we can buy a reserved seat, the rule in play is "there are no saved seats". It's a beautiful thing; one rule that applies to us all, equally, without discrimination. Either a seat has a warm body in it or that seat is available. That's it. There are no saved seats. Everyone plays under the same rule. I get it. There are no saved seats. If someone sees an empty seat, they can sit in it. They don't even have to ask, because there are no saved seats. We don't even have to listen to a sob story. THERE ARE NO SAVED SEATS. If a person vacates a seat and comes back to find it occupied, that's their tough shit. Why? Because there are no fucking saved seats!