ViK Guitars creator is getting publicly reamed right now

[Drummerrrrr?]

https://www.facebook.com/vik.kuletski/posts/783181571700734

https://www.facebook.com/pages/ViK-Guitars/133171110056707

https://www.facebook.com/adam.getgood/posts/10100693982382775


He made an anti-gay post and everyone's gone ape-shit!

 

[JeffTD]

Where's the post? I can't find what he actually said in any of these.

*edit* Okay is this him saying Paul Masvidal being gay turned him off headless guitars? Regardless of what his opinions are the dude is an idiot of a businessman.

 

[Ermz]

The headless guitars thing? I must be missing the reference.

 

[Drummerrrrr?]

What even?!

 

[JeffTD]

Hahhahahaha oh JFC this guy is an idiot. What a waste.

 

[abt]

Poor Nolly. Major props to him for trying to do the right thing.

 

[anotherpaul]

Wow people in the comments on his facebook page went full retard. Oops, did I just offend retarded people? So much for the freedom of opinion.

 

[Lasse Lammert]

So he's just deleted it.

 

[efx]

Wow people in the comments on his facebook page went full retard. Oops, did I just offend retarded people? So much for the freedom of opinion.

Freedom of opinion and speech do not protect you from the consequences of what you choose to express.

 

[Keregioz]

Oops, did I just offend retarded people?

I wouldn't worry about it, I believe it's socially acceptable for people to use that word if they're retards themselves.

 

[anotherpaul]

@efx Same way as freedom of religion proclaimed by goverment won't protect me from crusades or jihad. What's the use then?
@Keregioz Good one. Anyway, I had an experience working in a kindergarten with retarded kids and I know how serious the issue is for parents. But the whole political correctness and "being offended" thing just doesn't make sense to me in this context.

Maybe it's because I'm not english native speaker, but I just don't get it why are people so agressive and dramatic about other people expressing opinions especially on the gay theme. Recent blog post that had IMO perfectly sensible usage of word "faggotry" received waves of shit. I am way more concerned about actual crimes, like you know, theft both on casual and grandiose goverment levels, murder, funding and supplying weapons for revolutions and civil wars. Those occur every day all over the world, but media and internet just LOVE to bash people for not being politically correct by using "f-word" or "n-world" or whatever other word is now prohibited.

ViK guitars guy definitely made a stupid move speaking personally of Masvidal's sexuality. But whoa, people shitstorming and saying this should end his career and that he is a bigoted asshole and basically wishing to lynch him?

P.S. I'm not homophobic, but it seems weird when I am told that I should like and respect that Conchita Wurst dude from Eurovision for being so brave and talented. I personally thought the song and performance were bad and an image of a guy in women's clothes and make up also doesn't attract me enough to vote. Eurobros, tell me, does that make me a bad person? Or is it only bad if I express my opinion publically?

 

[efx]

In regards to free speech, this comic kind of sums it up for me: http://xkcd.com/1357/

As to why words are important and that some should be culled from our respective languages is because they have meaning and as easy as it is to look at things from a male, white heterosexual point of view one shouldn't overlook the fact that the words and viewpoints espoused by people like Vik have had a profound impact on a group of people and their ability or lack thereof to live out in the open without fear. Just telling them to ignore it won't fly. Just as society has come to accept that the N-word isn't really acceptable due to it's long history of use within the most derogatory contexts the same applies for the F-word and I'm glad we are getting to that point.

And I don't think anyone told you to LIKE Conchita Wursts song (I still haven't heard it myself) but if you put in the context that a bunch of politicians in the eastern parts of europe decided the minute they saw her to publically call for her exlusion from the Eurovision then the fact that she was voted the winner makes a whole lot sense and should be respected as a least a bit of a stand against the rise of rightwing intolerance that is currently fucking a lot of people over in these parts.

 

[Mago]

dayum didn't get to see the original post...what did he post exactly?

P.S. I'm not homophobic, but it seems weird when I am told that I should like and respect that Conchita Wurst dude from Eurovision for being so brave and talented. I personally thought the song and performance were bad and an image of a guy in women's clothes and make up also doesn't attract me enough to vote. Eurobros, tell me, does that make me a bad person? Or is it only bad if I express my opinion publically?

you don't need to "respect" anyone, as long as it doesn't alter the way you treat people.
If you say you don't dig chicks with beards that's fine.
If you say you didn't dig the song that's fine.
If you say you thought the performance was bad that's fine too (although I don't really see what was bad there but hey, to each their own).

 

[indecizo]

I don't get it, which one is the anti gay post?

 

[Mago]

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/4034989-post928.html

was that all he wrote?

 

[anotherpaul]

@efx
The comic is good indeed! It's just that basically the majority defines what's right and wrong in this model. Right now the majority supports LGBT movement so being against it is bad. The majority thinks nazism and facism is bad, so being a nazi and facist is also bad.
Recently due to some impressive mass media work the majority has also decided that being russian citizen is horrible and is enough to be banned from the rest of the world. However, the same majority is fine with one of the candidates for ukrainian president being a leader of a nazi party "right sector".

I guess free speech and opinion model relies heavily on intelligence of the majority and on its full knowledge of facts to make desicions upon.

I'm sorry for OT, won't happen again.

 

[drew_drummer]

In regards to free speech, this comic kind of sums it up for me: http://xkcd.com/1357/

As to why words are important and that some should be culled from our respective languages is because they have meaning and as easy as it is to look at things from a male, white heterosexual point of view one shouldn't overlook the fact that the words and viewpoints espoused by people like Vik have had a profound impact on a group of people and their ability or lack thereof to live out in the open without fear. Just telling them to ignore it won't fly. Just as society has come to accept that the N-word isn't really acceptable due to it's long history of use within the most derogatory contexts the same applies for the F-word and I'm glad we are getting to that point.

And I don't think anyone told you to LIKE Conchita Wursts song (I still haven't heard it myself) but if you put in the context that a bunch of politicians in the eastern parts of europe decided the minute they saw her to publically call for her exlusion from the Eurovision then the fact that she was voted the winner makes a whole lot sense and should be respected as a least a bit of a stand against the rise of rightwing intolerance that is currently fucking a lot of people over in these parts.

Personally I think this notion that being white and male and straight somehow prevents you from
being empathic or having valid opinions, or that being those things somehow means you shouldn't have a voice in any debate... that is a notion that needs to be quashed.

Words are not bad. People are bad. Deal with actions, not opinions. It's much more productive and has more of an impact in the long term. Censoring people - yes, even if they are bigots and/or intolerant assholes - is not the way forward.

 

[Mago]

For me there are coming together a few things here:

Ofc you can always express you opinion, but saying you don't like someone just because of the way he/she is born isn't an opinion.
There's no difference between racism and being homophobe.

So technically (from what I saw) he didn't say a lot of "bad" things, especially considering what some east politicians said publicly about the causa Wurst (around here too btw).
But at the core it's the same disgusting thing,just in a "nicer "package. Plus I read some more comments that wheren't worded as good.

Just something funny I saw recently:
http://www.religioustolerance.org/hom_fuel2.htm
(table in the middle of the page)


It always amazes me how quickly people jump on the online media shit-storm though.
So quick to hate back, but whenever it would require to actually go outside and protest you don't see nearly as many people there.

 

[efx]

Personally I think this notion that being white and male and straight somehow prevents you from
being empathic or having valid opinions, or that being those things somehow means you shouldn't have a voice in any debate... that is a notion that needs to be quashed.

Words are not bad. People are bad. Deal with actions, not opinions. It's much more productive and has more of an impact in the long term. Censoring people - yes, even if they are bigots and/or intolerant assholes - is not the way forward.

I both agree and disagree on some points.

Words in of themselves are perhaps not bad but words combined with opinions have an influence on people that is undeniable. We have all but eradicated rascist laws in most western countries but you can't say that people espousing hateful views through words and opinions will not have a tangible effect on those it's directed at.

I agree of course that being white and male doesn't exlude you from being as compassionate and understanding as anyone else but I'm not going to pretend that being on say here in Sweden will expose you to the same type of experience going through life as someone who is not.

I'm not saying censoring someone, I don't want there to be legislation that say you can't say the N-Word if you want. But just as much as someone has the right to say that people have the right to say something back. Goes both ways.

In the end I will say that yes, we need to deal with all forms of hateful views, be it words or actions. Again, I'm not saying that people should not be allowed to say the shit they say but they also shouldn't act all fucking surprised when it gets turned on them.

 

[drew_drummer]

I often find the problem with your logic is that (not saying you're doing this) people tend to go "right... this stuff here is offensive and should be outlawed and banned.... but this stuff over here? Nah, we don't find that offensive.. so no need to do anything about it"

So many instances of hate, bigotry, and intolerance fall through the cracks that way. I've experienced it many times in my life, based on my gender, my race, and my hobbies. At a certain point, you've just got to grow a pair of bollocks and accept that the world can be a pretty harsh place.

Most of the time when I say that; I get the response of "oh well you're a straight-white-male, so any oppression, bigotry, or intolerance you've experienced, just isn't going to be on the level of what WE'RE talking about...." - the automatic presumption that my (or yours!) experiences didn't affect me to the same degree ... *sigh* it's just myopic. The whole social justice movement has lost its way. Your Martin Luther Kings no longer exist. It's all just pussy arseholes on the internet.